Have you felt alienated/discounted by the autistic men here?

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For someone who doesn't think the 'undateable man' - that's you, right? - has a problem, you sure spend a lot of time complaining about it.

Your language gives you away. First, the undateable man suffers. Second, you hedge your commitment to the idea that being an 'undateable man' is not a problem with 'legitimately' and 'no basis' and 'actual'. All these are included in the idea of it being 'not a problem' - no need to qualify. It has the same sense of too much detail in a lie. I suggest you go ahead and read what you wrote. Maybe you're missing your own points.

From this, and the above, I'm going to go ahead and guess that you think being an 'undateable man' is indeed a problem, only you can't find a way to formulate it that doesn't end up sounding bitter or entitled etc.

You sound annoyed that you can't 'legitimately' talk about your situation as one that is a problem. If it's a problem for you, then it's a problem for you to try and solve (asking help or advice where needed), same as anyone else who finds themselves 'undateable'. The issue is not that you talk about it, but how you talk about it, how you frame it. Part of that framing involves dismissing the idea that women - including, as this thread title suggests, AS women - could have a hard time getting a date.

So askew is your worldview that you think women being sexually harassed means they are 'desirable' (the obvious inference, in the context of the above of the 'on the other hand' comparison to the 'undateable man', that they should in some way be grateful). A woman may find herself sexually harassed, yet quite unable to get a date (needless to say, such harassment will mess with one's mind when it comes to romance and sex).

I know you still haven't asked for my advice - and I can't think why since, having had romantic and sexual relationships and even procreated, I'm clearly a 'winner' - but your way of thinking has so far not worked for you. Maybe try a different way of looking at the world, of going about things, reconsidering what it is you want etc.

Okay, fair enough...then you will reap the consequences of not anticipating how other people will interpret your words. And I haven't made any personal attacks against you.

I for one couldn't care less if you get censored or not. If you do get censored, maybe we can go back to having undisturbed discussions about women's issues, since that's supposedly the purpose of this subforum. If you don't get censored, then it's an opportunity to address the issue of how men like you interpret harassment.

A separate subforum might be a good idea. I guess the response though would be that PPR is intended for that. And actually I have seen so much sexism, misogyny, and downright "rapey" talk in L&D that I'd say that it's already serving that purpose.

I have seen these gender and sexism discussions spill over into other sections of the forum before, where I didn't know how it originated or who said what along the way so I couldn't really assess what was going on. So I think it's kind of like dealing with a wildfire, maybe it's best to keep it contained as much as possible.

This time I have seen how it got started and it is really eye opening. It just seems like common sense that women should be allowed to discuss women's issues in a women's subforum in peace, without having men try to steal the spotlight for their own issues (or pervy things like the guy who started a thread in here asking if we enjoy our breasts ). Especially when other sections like L&D are already dominated by discussions about male dating problems.

The majority of sexual harassment is not even about attraction, it is about male domination, including domination of males against other males who are perceived as feminine or queer. This is especially true of street harassment and workplace harassment, which drive women out of spaces they need to access for basic life activities like work or transit to work or buying groceries. It is essentially a way of marking out territory as male property.

Discrimination and harassment policies, whether public or private, are enacted primarily to protect the rights of people to access the spaces or services they need for daily life. This is a privately operated website so it is up to the owners to decide whether any groups are considered protected and to what extent that will be enforced.

From a purely legal perspective, no one "needs" access to this forum, but from an ethical perspective many people do rely on this site for support or social activity that they do not find elsewhere. It is a difficult and possibly Herculean task for the admins and mods to make things fair for members and I don't envy it.

However I do find it misleading to label a section as "Women's discussion" and then do so little to make this a safe space for women.

Yes I find it unfair and more so very hypocritical.



I think it is up to you, if you want to have the thread locked I certainly wouldn't blame you. We're not really able to discuss things anyway, at least not in the way we would like to. I also hope that locking this thread wouldn't shut down ALL discussion about feeling discounted by men. I hope you would still be allowed to discuss the topic you originally started and the point of a lockdown would be to stop the derailment of it. But I don't even know who is modding this forum or what the policies are here.



I know and that is what makes me so sad about this.

Okay maybe I misunderstood...maybe you actually weren't saying that male behavior towards women, such as sexual harassment, is evidence of female desirability. Then what is it evidence of?

What "assumptions" "falsehoods" "facts" and "personal attacks" are you referring to?

well i got to this thread late...

misogyny is a social problem and it is not necessarily more rampant here than anywhere else, just sometimes more obvious. there is no escaping it because there is nowhere else to go, which is why I encourage op and any other woman considering leaving this community or not joining new communities to reconsider, because shutting up doesn't help anything or anyone.

Yes, I agree. Keep on giving meaningful input here and prove the doubters wrong. Rome wasn't built in a day.

Ha, yeah, but the sexes don't have to battle. I see a lot of immature and ridiculous behavior. And open hostility. For no good reason. Except maybe to show everyone else how pissed-off one is at the world.

I don't think you need to defend yourself. Not everyone here views you as a misogynist. I don't.

I was simply wondering why you think that no woman would want to have anything to do with you. It seemed that you were implying that women would find you disgusting.

So when I asked if you could at least understand where I and some of the other female posters are coming from, I take it from this comment that the answer is no.

No, I do not understand. I think all the arguing is pointless. I think that he stated his opinion, people didn't agree, then got hostile. He's allowed to have his own opinion. No one is required to agree. He didn't insult anyone, or call anyone names. He said what he thought. It's easy enough to say, "I disagree with you" without being angry. But that's not what happened.

I've witnessed this happen more than once on WP and it seems that some people want to argue, not discuss. I disagree with this attitude, I stated my opinion, and I was told I was wrong. So I'm not allowed to have an opinion either.

People make real discussion or respectful debate impossible.

If you have no understanding of where other people are coming from, and invalidate people by saying there is "no good reason" to be doing what they are doing, then how are you contributing to real discussion or respectful debate?

The same question can be asked in reverse. There is one poster right now that is really stirring up most of the drama, I know I can't be the only one that notices this.

Can it? I didn't say the things Yigeren said.



Pray tell, who are you referring to?

Not sure how saying I don't understand where someone is coming from invalidates anything. I don't understand. Should I pretend to think differently? I think that's kind of pointless.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and I'm entitled to mine. I'm not going to change my mind just because people don't agree with me. I suppose if enough people think it's productive to argue with each other, that's fine.

But it doesn't seem to me that anyone is changing anyone else's opinion. Each party continues to assert his or her opinion over and over in different ways, ad infinitum. There will be no winners in this debate.