Why don't more women fight back (TRIGGER WARNING)

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Ultimately the responsibility for the actions lays with the one committing them, not their terrified victims.

Yes, it would be nice if victims of sexual abuse didn't have trauma to deal with afterwards that makes it difficult to come forward but the fact of the matter is that it does have that impact and it's unreasonable and unfair to expect them to just ignore those impacts.

To paraphrase an old saying, the only thing necessary for evil to proliferate is for its victims to do nothing.

Sure, crimes should not be committed in the first place; but once committed, crimes and the people who commit them should immediately be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

Blaming the victims for failing to come forward doesn't help anyone at all.

But that’s not reality, now, is it? The fact of the matter is that only a small percentage of sex crimes are ever prosecuted, and sentencing is appallingly light.

Thank you for pointing out, once again, the obvious situation.

Now, how about some solutions?  Anyone can point to the burning house and say that it is on fire, but how about suggesting ways to put the fire out?

I would rephrase that: ...for the Community to do nothing.

An individual "survivor" cannot be expected to stop evil alone. Some can go far and be impactful, but that is not the general outcome. People need a community. It's not for a victim to face persecution alone. Believe me, there is still persecution in these matters as the Culture of Quiet is strong.

On a jury duty form it asked if I or my family members had been victims of violence and I automatically reported "No". A week later it occurred to me that the unreported or unprosecuted rapes and childhood abuse too many of my family members had experienced most likely qualified, or should have. Why hadn't I thought of that? Next time I'll be sure to raise my hand and ask what the definition of "victim" is in the context of the form (ASD gallows humor).

I know women who were raped in the 70s --- not a one reported it, nor the men they disclosed to. There was no support. It was clear to me that the movies back then "taught" that generally (non-stranger) rape was "acceptable". Victims were invalided or outright blamed.

Then in the 90s my family did report a rape (after all we saw Jodie Foster win). Sparing the details, the police wouldn't even take the report --- the story went that my family member didn't react appropriately for a victim. I learned that evidence didn't matter --- so much is circumstantial without a recording.

Then come around to my recent work discrimination experience. My coworkers agreed I was treated unfairly --- but they did not publicly lend their support. The one who tried was astounded that she was ignored. The women generally accept it or leave (women are not fired, just grossly underpaid and ridiculed). In ten years, I know of three men who stood up for their female peers and all three were fired within two months. I went way, way, way beyond what an individual would be expected to do in this situation, alerted all sorts of internal resources, provided reams of evidence, and still the destructive workplace culture "won". As the "victim", I ask ---- where was the Community?

Read about allyship. There is an answer ---- the strong stand for the battered, rather than stand aside.

^ This! While the majority of the blame is on the one who does wrong, some blame ought to also go to the surroundings and environment that shapes some people to be like that. Often, when I speak about different kinds of politics with my family, they answer some issue with "it just is like that" and when I say it shouldn't be, they just say "no, but it is" and are unwilling to discuss what would be a good thing to do about it. In short, my family is part of the community to blame, though I probably am too, just in different matters than them and I probably fail to notice in which ones.

I should also add

5. Guilt. Women are embarrassed and might think they were asking for it, afraid to tell anyone fearing they will be slut shamed. They didn't say no so they think it was their fault.

Applying this to financial extortion based on gender, which is hard and awful but easier to consider than physical assaults...

Absolutely. I would stand there with my mouth agape (frozen). In my head was ringing "he didn't just say that." And each time I got one demeaning behavior or situation resolved, another would raise its head and I'd be back where I started "that didn't just happen." (Now I am starting to at least speak that as I muster an assertive response.)


In the case of work, the job titles (and performance ratings) are manipulated to provide circular reasoning. Everybody can see the person in a protected class does the same job (or more) than her male peer. Her title is lower b/c she is paid less. She is paid less b/c her title is lower. She's not paid as much b/c her performance is less ---- ummmm, based on a biased evaluation.


It took six months to get an EEOC interview, since it takes time for someone to approach the EEOC there is practically no time for filing. I imagine the EEOC prosecutes only the most egregious situations and there are too many IMHO. I have a friend who gave up contacting them and Labor about ASD discrimination incidents. Too easy for employers to "hide" behind subtleties and misdirection.


This is why I submitted to, or quietly left, the gender bias and discrimination in my early years, but recently my reputation was so strong and respectable that I could face the invalidation and retaliation. Biased VPs stood by (or behind) their biased Dir's. As I mentioned, most people watched. I stood alone, while behind closed doors everyone sadly rooted for me. Before I left the only female director was let go. Her employee said "she did it too herself" (which is a sad rationalization). I won't go into details, but, again, it's too easy to pick off individuals. The "circumstantial" evidence becomes overwhelming when viewed holistically, but instead it is too often dismissed on an individual basis.


This is tough. I "allowed" the discrimination. I didn't know what to do about it. I didn't have role models. I wanted to keep my job. If a person in a protected class doesn't directly write/say "discrimination", there's no leg to stand on. I was so loathe to say it: I feared the invalidation and retaliation (which I got). A lawyer told me that I had to say it. It's still hard to say. I'm afraid also to say my family members where physically assaulted - like it's a disparagement of them (what did they do wrong?) rather than a call for community support and action (we -as a community- need to stop tolerating abuse).

Before the "community" can do anything, the victim has to report it.

Why subject yourself to reliving the ordeal if justice won't occur?
Why subject yourself to reliving the ordeal if you'll just be blamed for it occurring?

How likely would you report it if it were to happen to you?

I’m not sure if you’ve read the subtext that every woman on this thread has been on the receiving end of some level of harassment, assault, or abuse. Probably a decent percentage of us HAVE reported it, and know exactly what happens when we do. The only way this can change is with a major overhaul of the justice system AND how the community treats victims. I understand that, as a man, you have that instinct of “let’s fix this”; it’s something that is commendable… but we as women tend to be jaded because the majority of us have experienced this firsthand. It’s easy to “armchair quarterback” when it is something you will never have to experience firsthand. There simply are no easy solutions.

Last edited by ArtsyFarsty on 03 Jul 2021, 9:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Blaming victims for not reporting it does no good.

The first time I ever really came to terms with this was about 10 years ago, when it was nighttime and I was bringing my garbage to the communal dumpster of my then-apartment complex. Someone came around the corner and every primal fear instinct kicked in… until I noticed that the person was a woman. I spent a great deal of time “unpacking” how I would not fear another woman in the slightest, but I would fear the presence of a man as much as I would fear a rabid raccoon or a black bear.

But that fear is not irrational from an evolutionary perspective; females have always sought out males, not just to continue the species, but also for protection from other males. Which kind of put me on a rabbit trail how my husband is a respected public figure, so if something bad were to happen to me now (as opposed to when I was a preteen and my abuser was a “golden boy”) I am more likely to be believed than a random woman who was victimized by the same person. It’s a disgusting double-standard how we’re still, on some level, under the “umbrella of protection” of a man.

I may understand the situation more than you realize.

Women are afraid to report rape because society does little or nothing to support them, and society does little or nothing to support them because women do not report rape.  It is a vicious circle, and both sides places all of the blame on the other.

However, it is fair to point out that It is easier for individuals to act than it is to change society.

I can understand why women fear men and the double standard is there for a reason.

Yes it's sad that even decent men have to face this problem from women and be treated like predators or that they have to watch what they say to women or watch how they say it so their comment isn't perceived as sexual. But if they understood history about men and women, they would understand why this fear is there.