What Autistic Girls Are Made Of

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Someone mentioned this article in another thread. I thought it was interesting because there seems to be this myth on Wrong Planet that just being female is a free ride to having it easier, whereas this research suggests otherwise.

"The difficulty may continue into adulthood. While some men with Asperger’s marry and have families, women almost never do, psychiatrists observe. A 2004 study by two prominent British researchers, Michael Rutter and Patricia Howlin, followed 68 high-functioning autistics over more than two decades. The group included only seven women, too small a sample to reach solid conclusions about gender differences, Rutter and Howlin caution. But 15 men — 22 percent of the sample — rated “good” or “very good” for educational attainment, employment, relationships and independent living, while no women did. Two women rated “fair,” compared with 11 men, and the other five women were counted as “poor” or “very poor.” None had gone to college. None reported having friends or living on their own. Only one had a job. Undermined by anxiety and depression, women with autism appear to be more often confined to the small world of their families. "

Taken from:
What are (autistic) little girls made of

I don't want another debate about whether women have it harder or not. What I'm asking is do you relate to this?

i haven't ever lived independently, really. the closest was when i lived with a roommate (then my sister) at age 18 to 19, but my boyfriend lived in a flat across the parking lot so he was available to help with whatever crisis i had.

i dropped out of high school but then went back to university later on as a non-matriculated student.

i have had about 30 jobs in 25 year. i am chronically underemployed and sometimes unemployed for stretches.

relationship-wise, i do fine. i don't keep friends too well, though.

i consider myself to be doing ok in a lot of ways, based on people's experiences in my aspie groups and on WrongPlanet, but not as well as i would like.

I think it's certainly relatable to a lot of us here.

The issue as I see it is that usually it is only the more moderate and severe forms of AS and ASC that will be picked up in women - which will naturally skew the results. Those who are mild or who are moderate but hide it will won't be accounted for in things like this and therefore are underrepresented, due to the male focus in the field.

Yes, I most definitely relate. I was told that, from the perspective of my family I am seen as
1. weird, 2. politically wrong, 3. 'not lazy', but 4.a failure and disappointment.

I think women are under diagnosed because women are better at copying the "correct" behaviour. This was the case for me, anyway. But I have struggled with depression and anxiety for years and cannot live independently. I moved back in with my Mom a couple of years ago.

I read the article from the same post, I think . I felt it might have skewed the adult women somewhat negatively. Not to say that they are exaggerating challenges we face, but I think with the right support and knowledge women can live better than the description( if they are as dissatisfied with their circumstances as the author seemed to present).
I dropped out of college in the first semester, but I did manage to support myself independently for almost a decade. I started out minimum wage, living out of a hotel for a year, and donating plasma for money twice a week. I also had a lot of job jumping with low paying service jobs. I worked up to a more livable wage at a factory job that was well suited for me. I started out with a fear that I wouldn't be able to make it, and it seemed sketchy when I was living off of oatmeal and peanut butter for weeks. Realizing that I could find ways to cope and adapt really gave me a sense of accomplishment, but I also feel fortunate.
I only had one real friend during that time, but I dated occasionally and eventually met my now husband. We're coming up on our eight year anniversary, and I think we approach things well as a team. Making and keeping friends is still a large issue that I'm still exploring.
Did the women rate themselves, or was it done by amount of "milestones" reached? If depression and anxiety were keeping them from their personal goals it's more alarming than if they are content with how they're living their lives.

I think everyone has a different experience and is affected differently by the symptoms / traits. I only found out that I was an Aspie about 6 months ago, and only unofficially (I'll not try to get a formal diagnosis, at least for now). I've been reading a lot about ASD as it's still new to me, and what strikes me as a woman is the lack of research on females, when it comes to women and girls that sentence is the standard: "too small a sample to reach solid conclusions".

My own experience is full of ups and downs, overall I believe I'm managing well, although not easily. So I relate to not having friends, but I managed to get through college and I always lived kind of alone, even when I was at my parents I felt that was the case. My experience is patchy, I'll try to explain.

- Education
I was a star pupil until I became a teenager, the I "imploded" and ended up with me dropping out. I went back and finished the equivalent to my A-levels 3 years later once I was "calmer". I do have a BA(Hons), I started about 5 years after my A-levels in another country (UK), and I did it part-time, I almost imploded again in the end, but had a partner and a very good friend to help me to pick up the pieces, this time time around I was saved by them.

- Employment
I go from hero to zero in an amazing speed. Let's say I have a good CV, but had to work even in a factory to survive in the past. I live very far from family support and I'm not entitled to financial help. I walked away from my last job, I handled my notice for reasons that only now with the diagnosis I comprehend. I'm trying to establish myself as a freelancer with very little luck for almost one year now, spending my savings and pretty worried about the future.

- Relationships
I always did well relationship wise. Luckily I found someone who love me and didn't got bothered much about my weirdness, routines, etc., so I'm in a long term relationship at the moment (16 years).

- Living independently
I left home when I was 19 years-old. I felt that I was on my own all my life, so I can cope, badly sometimes but I survive. I never fitted in anywhere which made me move countries 3 times already, I'm moving again, but hoping this will be the last time because now I know why I don't fit in, so I accepted I never will. Apart from my partner I'm pretty much alone, I don't have childhood friends, very little adult friends (not sure if any I can count on, surely not where I live now) and I only see my family every 3 to 5 years.

So right now I live alone, have a degree and a partner, but I'm doing pretty bad in the job front compared to my qualifications, relating to people is a struggle and always will be.

Sorry, hope I didn't bother anyone to death with the details and didn't go too offtrack.

Yes, I related. I thought being obsessed with really girly books like the Babysitter's Club and Babysitter's Little Sister series as a kid was really weird for an aspie so I'm glad the article included this clinical observation:

This is another sex difference that Lord sees among her patients. “I don’t have any real data, but a lot of high-functioning girls are real readers — not great on subtleties, but they like fantasies and the ‘Baby-Sitters’ series,” she says. “The boys are much less so.”

Thanks for posting this article, OP. It was quite interesting.

That's the article that made it click for me.

I've moved around alot too. Never seem to fit in anywhere. I was doing well at school but I dropped out before finishing high school. Higher Education scared me because I would have had to travel into the city and I never had gone in on my own before. It was too much.

I was an avid reader. I liked Nancy Drew Mysteries. Would rather read than spend time with other people. I'm no good at math, but was top of the class in English.

I had playmates as a child, but have no lifelong childhood friends. I had a few friends in my early 20s, but they've all got married. Moved on and now do things with other couples. I don't feel like I fit in with them. I feel left out.

I went to college as a mature student once I found something I actualy wanted to do. I was underemployed for a long time.

I've not had any long term relationships. I can't imagine I ever will. I don't seem to be suited to it. Don've know why.

I'm having a similar problem right now. I imploded in high school, but I didn't drop out. I graduated basically because my family pushed me to. Right now I'm in college, and I'm imploding again. I really want to get a degree, but I don't feel I'm able to do it, and I wanna be a translator, but the BA itself is in teaching, so I have to do my practicum and thesis focused on that, and I really, really can't handle teaching. I don't know what to do .

I heard that females with Asperger's tend to develop depression more than males with AS.
Whatever. I'm not depressed, and I've never been. Also my self-esteem is not below-avarage.
I can't relate to other girls with Asperger's. They all seem too serious, depressed and willing to please people compared to me. I'm completely different.

It's good you had your family support and didn't drop out in high school. And I'm sorry to hear that you are having trouble to finish your degree, hope you find a way to see it through and become a translator as you want.

Yeah, I would think this information is heavily debatable. Women are vastly underdiagnosed so perhaps the ones that are, are more severe. Its hard comparison to draw when theres a wide range on autism on the severity scale. For me, so far I'd probably rate my outcome as good. Probably in a few years, very good. I went to college, will be starting grad school later this year. Employement, yes I have held a job. My main problem with jobs is the social part and it depends highly on how my boss has perceived me. I have gotten anywhere from very good to very bad as employment goes. As for relationships, I have been in a couple. As for friends, there hard to find but possible. Independent living, I did live independently during college with whatever conviences living on campus provides you. 100% independent, not yet but I can.

I happen to find your comment ignorant and highly offensive (and this is coming from someone who doesn't have depression).
Depression is not a choice for many of those who do have it. It actually comes back to brain chemistry.

The imbalance of serotonin is primarily responsible for depression.
Men can store 20 times more serotonin than women can. On top of that - they can process serotonin twice as fast.
Take into account on top of that that autism is known for having markedly more dopamine and less serotonin than usual within the normal population.
I think you can see how this can create a lot of problems - not just depression but sleep issues (since melatonin is made from serotonin primarily) and anxiety issues.

Implying it is solely a choice for these women is pretty damn offensive.

You can't be serious. I am serious because the are times I need to be, and this forum in most places is a place to talk about how it affects every facet of our lives-- which in many ways can be serious.

You know what? I would also like to second Kjas in the fact that people don't choose to be depressed. I too am astounded by your ignorance. I have felt naturally depressed for most of my life and, like Kjas has pointed out, because our brain chemistry seems to lean that way, I have also struggled tremendously with sleep issues.

As for self esteem, I don't know what response you are desiring except a "well-- good for you!" because many of us have struggled with self esteem issues for various reasons. I think the biggest reason I struggled with it was because I was mainstreamed in a very raucous urban school environment-- and especially because my AS flew under the radar for so long because it is more mild that people couldn't quantify what was wrong with me right away so they labeled my deficits with other more asinine words. That is what it was like to be public schooled before AS was added to the DSM, and doubly so before there was any awareness around anywhere about it. If that isn't true for you, then "good for you". Just realize that there are people out there that have had a different experience than you and to respect that.

Probably the most offensive ignorant implication you make though is that we are people pleasers. In what universe? Do you even know me at all to even make such an assumption? Actually, if you even bothered to read my posts on these forums you realize that I am anything but. Goodbye.