Job references

Post Reply New Topic

I think the concept of job references is very unfair because it assumes that people can NEVER change. Once you get bad erferences you will NEVER be able to get that job again, thus you would never be able to get good references to change that state of things.

Also, a lot of references is subjective, not objective. So as aspies you make a bad subjective impression, leading to bad references.

Now taking that aside, even if you do something objectively bad quite deliberately, once you have done it, you can not change what you did, so again you are in a position of an aspie. You NO LONGER "intend" your past action to be the way it is, but you can't change it, just like aspie doesn't intend to come across as bad but they can't change it. I know many of you will find this comparison silly because a bad behavior of NT is a choice. BUt think of it this way. Suppose you are NT, and TEN YEARS AGO you chose to do something bad. All these 10 years you SINCERELY regret it. You became a saint! Yet, you can't do anythign about bad reports. No one knows you became a saint since they have to give you a job in order to see it, and you can't get a job because they don't know you changed ... vicious cycle ... Wouldn't you feel like an aspie being STUCK with consequence s of what you did 10 years ago?

The other unfair thing about bad reports is that it tends to target ppl who are honest. For example, it is very common among waitresses and waiters to spit in the food of rude costumers. Most of them are sly enough to be able to hide that. BUt the few HONEST ones who didn't try to hide it, they get in trouble. So if everyone else spat in the food all the same, do they REALLY get in trouble for spitting in the food? No. They get into trobule for not being clever enough trying to hide it! And not being clever enough to hide it is part of an aspie trait. Or think of this waiter or waitress. Suppose they RESENT people who spit in the food behind custumer's back, and as part of a protest against such a dishonesty, they find a rude costumer and spit in their food right in front of them. Then they get fired. While all the other waiters and waitresses who do that behind the back don't. I really wish it was in reverse. At least the one who did it in front of custumers was HONEST so he is a level higher than others. But NT social GAME is all about faking, which is why it is the way it is.

I will now like to leave you with a saying. I don't nkow who originally wrote it, but I think in a lot of cases it is rigth to a point:

Great minds and hearts talk about ideas and feelings
Average minds and hearts talk about weather and events
Small minds and hearts talk about other people and criticize them behind their backs

Well, job references that are being given BEHIND YOUR BACK (you are not allowed to see them) are products of SMALL MINDS, and the system that requires them trains people to develop SMALL MINDS as well.

You're right, if they misunderstood your actions they would incorrectly describe you to your new potential employer.

So if possible, use positive job references where they understood you.

If not, then you can always have friends or family make up a job, and try to explain things about how the new employer could misinterpret you.

I only have one real reference thats about halfway good
He would say I am a hard dedicated worker and that I will come in when ever you ask me to,
but then he would say I am too "shy" and have poor customer service.
eh...

Job references are not the only bad thing, but there is also the job history, if you have been fired many times in the past that is going to look really bad.

1050, 1086, 1089, 1081. Those are numbers relating to Russian characters.
That means grim right?

Just dont list the bad ones on your resume.I have more good than bad.The only actual "bad" one is from a fast food place in
Red Deer where I was laid off.I just don't list that job.I have plenty of good references from Vegreville and I have only been in Red Deer for a year so I could easily say that I was just in school and living off employment insurance and student funding during the year.Now it looks like I will soon have a good Red Deer referemce on my resume when I do my paralegal jobsearch after graduating college because of the job im at now.I have many high school teachers and former bosses from Vegreville for references and next year I will have my current job AND my college instructors, who really like me. Im not too bad with people...IF they give me a chance....in which so far, overall I am very lucky.

That is again a discrimination against aspies. NT-s are the more likely ones who would avoid listing certain thigns. Aspies on the other hand are very naive and open, and then they are punished for being so open.

I agree, but there is a way around it.You can ask the friends of your parents to be a reference, or teachers whose classes you excelled in acedemically.

I am an aspie, but the whole not listing bad jobs was something my Dad told me if I got laid off or something, and to keep my mouth shut about it so I did it.It helps to seek advice from parents for things you don't know or are unsure of.My dad has always been there to provide advice and guidance.

Okay but suppose they ask you at least 3 references. You decided to list 4 good ones and 1 horrible one, instead of just 3 good ones. Then you POINT OUT TO THEM that you had an ABILITY to only give 3 good ones, you just CHOSE to be HONEST. So it wasn't lack of ability, it is a volunteer honesty. Then you ask them why are they rejecting you for honesty? What will they say?

Yes thats right! Can you tell me how did you find out they are related to Russian, rather than some other language, and ESPECIALLY how were you able to decode it?

As for meaning of the word "Косой", literally it means someone with lazy eye, but it is often used figuratively to refer to someone who is clumsy. Say, you are playing basketball, and someone in your teem was clearly going to get the ball into the basket, and last minute ... Ooops, he misses it ... then you scream "Косой".

Also, sometimes it is used as a nickname for someone kids are making fun of. Actually when I was in a fifth grade the biology teacher had that name. I was into writing poetry at that time, and someone asked me to write a poem making fun of biology teacher, and gave me the first line. I wrote the other 3 lines, and the short poem that I got back then is my signature

Just want to clarify the unfairness. Yes, the idea of "just don't show bad references" might adress practical side; but it doesn't change the underlying philosophy of people, namely that it is okay to talk behind people's backs. That same philosophy leaps in areas such as gossip, and in this case no one asks you who is allowed to gossip to whom. Gossip has affected my reputation when I did ph.d. in physics, and it was very hard to find advisor because adult 40+ year old professors were gossipping to each other on how I am a bad physicist or not a serious student. I think if they weren't being asked to give references to others so often, they wouldn't have been trained to gossip, and they would have known that gossping is what teenagers do, not professors!

Think of a moral message of all that.

1) Your past employeers are encouraged to talk about you behind your back

2) You are encouraged to lie and not give complete reference list

In other words, it is a game of lying and talking behind ppl's back. Whoever wins the game gets a job. Do you really think this is fair?

I have used special characters before for different purposes, and in the process I learned they were numbered using & # (number of character) ;
I also I knew Russian characters where in the lower 1000s, where as Latin characters start from the 0040s

You can also press alt + the number to get a character.

I used your numbers and simply typed out Косой, then I went to a website to translate the word.

I am a bit stymied by your post because any corporation and any smart ex-employer will only answer 3 questions:

Did XX work for you from YYY date to ZZZ date?

Was this person's attendance acceptable?

Would you rehire this person?

If an ex-employer answers any other questions, they risk being sued, because anything beyond the 'facts' is subjective, and unless you were given XX number of warnings by HR for unacceptable behavior, your ex-employer is at huge risk.

Several years ago, I was 'forced' to resign from a job -- new boss wanted to get rid of me and I walked right into it -- and I was really worried about how this would affect job prospects.

Got a great job with a company that REALLY checks everything -- no problems.

The third question is subjective. What if there is some subjective reason the answer to this is no, such as your being unpleasant due to your nerdy AS traits, or that there is too much bad gossip about you to want to rehire you?



I have a specific example where, after answering "no" to whether they will rehire the person, they went on to tell reasons why not. Wouldn't that qualify as "information beyond the three questions asked" ? From that post, no one sued her for giving that extra information! That example is one of the responses to this post ( http://www.wrongplanet.net/forums-posti ... 28189.html ) Here is an exact quote:

Aren't there languages besides Russian and latin



Are you saying I should shade a number and press Alt + Because when I do that, nothing happens. So what exactly did you do?

Sadly true.

People who have no issue with being dishonest get away with a lot of stuff and get good things they don't deserve while an honest person appears to be routinely punished for being honest.

It's even worse with the risk of being sued. I can tell you that there is no good reason for a past employer to not give a great reference if they liked you. So, if someone checks and gets the basics about your working there, it works against you if other applicants have past employers who gush about how wonderful they were.

It's widely known that a phone reference that includes an opinion on an employee is not a serious thing. It's known that nowadays this kind of references is currency: if the recommender owes you favors, you're the best (however much you may have screwed up in your previous job) and if they harbor any hidden ill feelings about you, they'll fry you in this kind of phone reference. Yet, prospective employers base themselves a lot on phone references, because if you were cunning enough to have someone owe you favors, then you'll be a good employee (seeing as today all that's required from employees is that they be good politicians).