Should having friends be a "fundamental right"?

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Robdemanc
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25 Oct 2010, 7:04 am

It sounds like an odd proposition. What would this "right to friendship" mean in legal terms? Could you take someone to court for not wanting to be your friend? What about friends who fall out? Would that be a police matter?

I think children need to be taught to be more understanding and tolerant. We need to do away with this social nich cliques and grouping people so actively in schools. That is what creates our fragmented and intolerant societies. In Britian we have anti social laws. So if someone is behaving in a very unfriendly way (i.e. they do not stop doing something when asked by a fellow citizen) then they can be charged with being anti-social.

I wonder how many aspies have been given ASBO's (Anti-Social Behaviour Order).



Robdemanc
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25 Oct 2010, 7:12 am

Sparrowrose wrote:
space_cadett wrote:
Sparrowrose wrote:
Avengilante wrote:
The notion that 'The Ministry of Happy Mental Health' is going to send an agent to your door with a couple of smiling idiots and say "Here are your personal government-issued friends" so that you can automatically live happily ever after is just ridiculous.


Actually, they do just that in England, according to what I've read. The professionals are called "befrienders" and they're just one of the support staff that some people with asperger's are able to get.


That's really pretty amazing. I have to admit I've wished there was some kind service where you could get someone to go see a movie with you or a concert. I would even be willing to pay someone for my own convenience if I thought they might actually enjoy hanging out with me a little... :oops:


To be honest, I would love to have a befriender, even though I'd know it was an artificial situation. A befriender would not only help me feel less lonely, but they could teach me important things about boundaries, how to make new friends, etc. Often someone with a befriender willt ake them to the pub or a social club meeting so the befriender can act as a sort of "social wing man", helping the individual learn how to approach and befriend people on their own.

http://www.autism.org.uk/our-services/s ... nding.aspx


I absolutely love the sound of this befreinding thing. I reckon in the UK though it will be a much sort after service and the befreinders will end up overloaded more than the Aspie or Autie! Also it kind of sounds like an escort service for us. LOL



leejosepho
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25 Oct 2010, 10:26 am

XFilesGeek wrote:
I doubt I "desire" the same food as an African tribesman.

The *type* of food desired is not the question there.

XFilesGeek wrote:
Someone not wanting to be your friend is neither right nor wrong ...
I most certainly do not [have an obligation to "be there" for others], especially if the "other" is some random person who I don't even know demanding that I "be there" for him/her.

The obligation to at least consider the other person's well-being exists whether or not the other person might be demanding anything.

XFilesGeek wrote:
The qualities I look for in a friend are quite extensive ...

The question I am trying to address or propose here is more about what we have to offer others than what we might be expecting from them.

Robdemanc wrote:
It sounds like an odd proposition. What would this "right to friendship" mean in legal terms? Could you take someone to court for not wanting to be your friend? What about friends who fall out? Would that be a police matter?

No, nothing like that. The idea here is simply that we all really do need each other and we do well when we love others in the same ways we love (continually think about and do things for) ourselves.

Robdemanc wrote:
I think [we all need to learn] to be more understanding and tolerant. We need to do away with this social niche cliques and grouping people ...

Bringing your thought into the immediate, that is my point. The OP is simply asking for an opportunity to not have to have to try to deal with all of that.


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TPE2
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25 Oct 2010, 10:54 am

Robdemanc wrote:
We need to do away with this social nich cliques and grouping people so actively in schools. That is what creates our fragmented and intolerant societies.


My personal experience is the opposite: that one big group is usually more intolerant than many small groups and cliques.



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25 Oct 2010, 10:57 am

Robdemanc wrote:
I absolutely love the sound of this befreinding thing. I reckon in the UK though it will be a much sort after service and the befreinders will end up overloaded more than the Aspie or Autie! Also it kind of sounds like an escort service for us. LOL


The befrienders are all volunteers so they can take as light or heavy a load as they feel comfortable with. They only spend a few hours per week with the autistic or their family and sex is not involved.


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leejosepho
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25 Oct 2010, 11:06 am

TPE2 wrote:
My personal experience is ... that one big group is usually more intolerant than many small groups and cliques.

You have just made it possible for me to see there is more than one view or perspective there. Just having "one big group" has not actually been suggested, yet such a setting certainly could be (or could at least seem) quite intimidating where our own smaller "circles within" might seem more inviting.


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Robdemanc
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25 Oct 2010, 11:59 am

Sparrowrose wrote:
Robdemanc wrote:
I absolutely love the sound of this befreinding thing. I reckon in the UK though it will be a much sort after service and the befreinders will end up overloaded more than the Aspie or Autie! Also it kind of sounds like an escort service for us. LOL


The befrienders are all volunteers so they can take as light or heavy a load as they feel comfortable with. They only spend a few hours per week with the autistic or their family and sex is not involved.


Well its a great idea. I would want someone to answer lots of questions for me about the NT world. And I reckon having a social class or group that met regularly to learn social norms and stuff like that would be a very good support function for AS. I still think we should have a regular class in school to enable children to learn social stuff formally rather than just leaving kids to learn their own intuition in social situations.



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25 Oct 2010, 12:30 pm

jc6chan wrote:
I believe having friends should be a fundamental right of each person. Of course, if the person does not want to have any friends, it should be respected. But I think we should have a system where there is "default friendship" and unless someone is really not interested in being your friend, two people should be friends by default.


Who's going to get picked to be your default friend? Some random person? How well would that work, tell me?

What if you are chosen to be some complete stranger's default friend?! How would that make you feel?



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25 Oct 2010, 1:53 pm

Does your University have any clubs to join where your could meet new friends? Maybe you could find volunteer activities so you wouldn't be so lonely? For instance, I didn't win many games at the chess club--but it gave me a chance to meet other people once a week and work on my social skills in a relatively easy environment. For most people, the University environment is the last chance they get to easily meet folks.



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25 Oct 2010, 2:04 pm

Who_Am_I wrote:
jc6chan wrote:
Ok, so if something is wrong with your body, a person has the right to go see a doctor (I guess this is only totally true for universal healthcare) and see whats wrong. If a person is depressed and they feel that talking to someone would make them feel better why don't they have the right to a set of "friends" to talk to?


Because it would violate other peoples right not to be their friend.

There's a saying "My right to extend my arm ends where your nose begins."


Very well put. Basically in terms of human relations, Whoever does not want the relation comes up trumps.



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25 Oct 2010, 3:21 pm

jc6chan wrote:
hale_bopp wrote:
Is this thread a joke?

not really. I seriously feel like a victim of society for not having real close friends.


Have you sat down to ask yourself what you are doing wrong or what causes people not to like you? I am one of the weirdest persons my friends know and I am still able to attact friends. THey will sooner or later will stop hanging out with me because I stopped coming around or did not want to leave the house. This is why I have no friends right this minute but I am comfortable knowing I will make new friends in the future. So you pretty much figure out what you are doing wrong and do your best to correct it. All I have to do is become more sociable when they come around wanting me to do stuff with them. It was not that hard for me to figure out. :wink:


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25 Oct 2010, 6:53 pm

Who_Am_I wrote:
jc6chan wrote:
Ok, so if something is wrong with your body, a person has the right to go see a doctor (I guess this is only totally true for universal healthcare) and see whats wrong. If a person is depressed and they feel that talking to someone would make them feel better why don't they have the right to a set of "friends" to talk to?


Because it would violate other peoples right not to be their friend.

There's a saying "My right to extend my arm ends where your nose begins."


+1

I'll file this idea of a "right" to have friends along side of such others as "I should have fundamental right to have a girl/boyfriend." and I "deserve" to have a girl/boyfriend.


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25 Oct 2010, 6:57 pm

well. i had some bad experiences in childhood with my parents forcing me to be friends with other kids.

it is much harder to stop being friends with someone than it is to avoid them in the first place. once you are sorta friends, it is kind of hard to break up without moving away or pissing the person off.

i had periods of time in my life when i did not have any friends at all, but i would acknowledge that having a husband and child means i am much less lonely now.

to the OP: i would say NO to friendship being a fundamental right. i see it a lot like i see love relationships - put out enough feelers and some success may folllow. but maybe people need to work at it and not expect people to approach them, or even to always meet them halfway.


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25 Oct 2010, 8:22 pm

If I was forced to be your friend I know I would do to you what I did to my enemies when I worked in a resteraunt and that was too spit in their food and drinks then give you a nice smile when you reentered the room to finish off your food or drinks. I would also be the biggest backstabber you ever met. My goal in life would to be to stick it to you in the worst way possible. :idea:


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25 Oct 2010, 11:06 pm

I think having government mandated friends would be detrimental if anything, you would get use to only having fake interactions with people. Deep down you would never be able to escape the knowledge that it all was a lie. Trying to learn how to interact from an interaction that is completely artificial like this seems so futile.

When people are self serving, at least it is honest and you can try and learn how they work. When people feel obliged the interaction is such a constantly adjusting lie it will make your head spin.



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25 Oct 2010, 11:30 pm

In school teachers do this by putting you into 'study groups.'

It doesn't work. One person takes the dominant position. Two other think 'meh' and draw body organs on their arms. And you sit there and long for recess.

You cannot force people to be friends. All my friends and I have things in common, or I've met them through friends and found them nice and interesting. What if the person was an a**hole? I wouldn't stay friends with them. My friends are caring, open minded, maybe a little immature but they're not jerks. This world is full of many jerks, so we have to sift through them and find our true friends.

A group of people brought together by consequence. They're only familiarity was their difference. Well I've been hurt so many times but I know I'm not blind. Because when everything seems so bleak I know my friends will always shine.

My brother wrote that lyric. The best part about friendship is remembering what made you become friends in the first place.


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