Are you proud of having Asperger's?

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I'll never be proud of "having" anything.

I have never felt proud of myself, even when things have supposedly gone well.

I don't understand the feeling of being proud.
I don't understand how others can be proud.
It seems horribly selfish and egocentric.

People probably mean well when they say "I should be proud." of something that I've done. They never explain to me properly why I should be proud. This has confused me and made me feel very angry. Why "should" I be proud anyway? What good would it do?
Why can't I just say to myself that I did a good job and leave it at that?

Is it possible that my mental "software bundle" doesn't include a "proudness" program?

If so, then surely it's unreasonable for people to expect me to be proud, if proudness isn't an emotional setting that I came preinstalled with?

I can do angry and happy very well and strongly.

But I don't understand the concept of "proud".

Lots of relatives and close friends that I had never openly expressed that they were proud about anything. Does that make them "defective"?

I just wish that people didn't expect me to be proud of who I am and brag about what I've done.

If people just accepted who I was without telling me how brilliant/stupid I was and constantly demanding that I sell myself by being "proud", my life would be a trillion times easier.

Awards and people telling me that I should be "proud" have hurt me and not helped me.

All of that social pressure to have a feeling that I was never "designed" to have and is completely out of character is a major reason why I am so depressed now.

I feel as if I have disappointed a lot of people who, deep down, probably don't really care anyway.

I understand how you feel. They are many on the dole who are on it just for the money and don't want to work. That's why we use the word dole bludgers. Do they use that in the UK too? In Australia it's difficult to get on a pension. I know people with depression and physical injuries that have been struggling to get on it.

Funny thing is when I did my disability assessment I was too honest and didn't think I'd get the support. But I got on it and ever since someone at the disability job network has been working with me to get a job. I still get really down about not working. I'm 24, next month I'm 25 and the most I've earned is $160 on a once off photo shoot. Self employment didn't work for me. I had such stress from band photography I gave it up professionally. Now I'm back to just a hobby. I really want this stage lighting job because it's technical and I only have to deal with a few people. If I don't get that I don't know what I can do. I got turned down by an electronics shop and I liked the way the staff we're experts at a certain area.
I also feel like I've regressed considerably so I don't know what that will do for my employment future or even if there is one.
But being this old and not having one job that pays wages yet does make me feel pretty useless, but I have my interests to keep me busy. My inattentive ADHD symptoms are also impairing and I'm a bit nervous telling an employer that I need to take medication. I'm a completely different person on them; positive, energetic, talkative, inventive, etc.
And if anyone needs someone to draw diagrams of the human brain give me a call. That's all I've been doing lately.

Aha!
What do you think people are doing on this site then? In my opinion the exaggaration of having AS has gone too far. I've even been convinced that AS apparently affects how the person physically looks, on one of these threads. Now I think that's going too far.

I wish I could exaggerate my symptoms rather than actually experiencing them.

The phrase "proud member of the autism spectrum" baffles me.

When I was little, people didn't refer to me being "on the spectrum" as a compliment.
They said it because they thought that I was a problem child and there was something "wrong" with me. They never gave me a fanfare for it or rolled out the red carpet. Maybe for other things, but certainly not for me supposedly having some amorphous and vague "syndrome".

Now I hear about people being "conglatulated" for having Aspergers.
I felt angry and irritated after reading Attwood's works even though I know that he genuinely wants to help people.
I feel upset when I read about "genius" traits.
It made me feel woefully inadequate for having to stay at home with minimal social contact to look after my disabled relatives. People might ask me questions about why I'm not doing anything, but the truth is that I'm trapped socially and logistically.


However hard you try, it's never good enough and some logistical or social issue always gets in the way. What's the good knowing a lot about different subjects if you can't apply what you know because of circumstance and society.

Being proud doesn't stop people around you from getting drunk and bullying you.

Nobody ever congratulated me for "having" AS.
Congratulating me wouldn't help me with life's logistics or me being harassed.

Asking me how this all makes me feel is about as useful as a chocolate teapot.
I feel angry after people say that being assessed for them was a relief.

It wasn't a relief for me. When I was little, people were openly hostile towards me. My family claimed adamantly that there was "nothing wrong" with me. That I was just a bit shy and that it was all a big mistake.

I wanted it to be a big mistake because, from the beginning, I never thought that there was anything "wrong" with me. I thought that the world was far too overcrowded and full of distractions.

This is why I'm not proud.

I struggle to understand how people can be proud of their condition.
Perhaps in many cases this is just a defense mechanism.

It baffles me because I was never told to be proud of my supposed condition.
I was told that my handwriting was abysmal, my spelling was awful, my socialising style was "wrong" and my motor coordination wasn't good enough.

I was told that I was a "failure" at having friends, despite the fact that I had several.
I had deep meaningful relationships with others. If they said I was a good friend and a good listener, how could I be a failure? I made friends with a wide diversity of people.
They usually initiated the conversation while I listened. Lots of them were very grateful for me listening to them and helping them. Many people said that I was a brilliant listener. Maybe it wasn't always a conventional conversation, but these people said that I was a good friend.


How could I be "proud" of well meaning adults writing me off from the get go?
Because I supposedly "failed" at making friends?
"Failure to form peer relations at developmental level."

Clearly I can't have been a complete failure if some people said that they genuinely liked me!

Well said, AmberEyes. That's what I've been trying to say about how I feel of AS, but other people kept arguing back at me saying all I'm doing is ''groaning about it instead of doing things with my life'' - which isn't a very helpful answer. The important thing is you and me (and others like us) are trying, but it's not always our fault if we don't succeed.
We are all individuals, and we all have different opinions about having AS. Obviously you have explained your feelings better than I have, and I liked the way you put it. I know how you feel too.

I don't exaggerate my symptoms either. I tell the truth - there are lots of symptoms I do not have, but the symptoms I do have are difficult to ignore or ''put aside'', since they are getting in the way of doing things. Loud noises phobia, for instance.

This is what this site was created for - it's for us to open up and explain how we feel about different things - not being told to ''get a life''. That is wrong, and if some people on here can't handle the fact that some adults on the spectrum find this and that difficult, then maybe they should go onto a different thread for people on the spectrum who share the same sorts of talens and experiences. This forum is not for insulting and criticising, because that doesn't get anyone anywhere.

Hi AmberEyes. I thought I would take some time to respond to your post about being proud of Asperger's. I realize that Asperger's affects us uniquely. To some it can be misery, and for others like myself it's not misery. My wish is that everyone with Asperger's can find their happiness in it. Realize that although many are miserable with it, look around at the number of unhappy NTs. Unhappiness and misery affects all types of psychological conditions/differences.

A lot of people are baffled by this. I have explained pride with autism in a lot of posts. There are two types of pride. One type is the "bad" kind where a person is proud because they have done something better than others. Then there is the second kind---being satisfied with what one has done (but not feeling like they are better than others). I have the second kind of pride. Asperger's has created special intense interests in me that has allowed me to learn various musical instruments (because of the fascination/obsession with parts of the instruments), research roller coasters and build models of them, etc. I am satisfied and happy with myself in learning these musical instruments and in building roller coaster models. It is a lot of fun. Therefore, I have pride (second kind of pride) in my Asperger's because it has created these things in me.


Overall, people not on the spectrum are mystified by autism. They see it as a little understood condition that can harbor some interesting things---the obsessions with things, hidden talents, withdrawn social behavior, stimming, etc. (although not all autistic people do this---but that is how many see it). None of us can truly know how it feels to be the other, but as strange as it seems to some, I do not find it offensive at all to be called autistic. My youngest son has Asperger's and has an IEP at his elementary school for it. He is mainstreamed, but has accommodations for it. The teachers have commented numerous times at how amazed they are with him and the ways he thinks. He does well in school, and has his own little group of friends that are similar to him. He is happy. We are happy.


A lot of this has to do with the fact that we are saying, "Congratulations on finally realizing what it is that makes you unique." I wandered around for years wondering why I was so different. When I finally learned of Asperger's and got diagnosed, I felt very happy. I now knew why I was like I was. And I was not alone. The genius traits seem to be savant traits. Not all have those. I have heard it said that around 10% of autistics have savant skills.


People come in two types---extroverts and introverts. I am introverted---probably because of Asperger's. Socializing has always felt so awkward, so early on, I quit socializing. I do not desire to socialize because I find my special intense interests to keep me happy, and I don't want to be bothered when I am working with them. However, I do love my family, and I enjoy having them around me. Being an introvert, the social isolation does not bother me. But I can understand where an extroverted person would find uneasiness here.



With my music I began a music ministry at local area churches. I perform alone. I have my own special way of presenting my program (with what is comfortable for me). They don't have to book me, but so far I have gotten a lot of bookings. I don't hide my Asperger's from the congregations. In fact, I tell them I have Asperger's. I call it a blessing from God. My therapist encouraged me to use acting skills in communicating with people. And I realized that I have done this a lot in my life anyway. I act out my feelings in what I need to say to people. Perhaps you can try acting when presenting yourself with subjects you need to talk about. There is some written on this technique and it has helped me.


No, it doesn't. And bullying happens to NTs as well.


Again, we are all different. Unfortunately many people get harassed---and often times those who are different can be easy targets. But even NTs get harassed. As for being congratulated---I realize the point you are making here, but just to have some fun, how many times do you hear an NT person getting congratulated for being NT?


I would like to have a chocolate teapot right now---you got my chocolate craving started. Again, the relief thing is just the relief of knowing, "I am not alone," and "There is a reason why I am the way I am." It is natural for parents to feel like there is nothing wrong with us. But my philosophy is that there isn't anything wrong with us---we are different. It takes both NTs and we with autism to make the world function properly.


Again, the pride I experience (and I feel many do that claim pride) is the second kind of pride I mentioned earlier---being satisfied with oneself. I am going to make a rude comment about the bad handwriting and spelling, and wrong socializing and motor coordination. I say to them, "So what!" Who are they to judge? You are a human being with rights. Just because we with autism do not behave in the same ways as the NT majority doesn't make us wrong. I bet that if the majority of people on earth were autistic, then psychologists would call NTs a disorder.


You had several friends, and so did I. Apparently whoever told you that you were a failure was wrong. I don't know why there is such a huge deal put on socializing. From what you have said in this quote---you sound remarkably nice and someone that would make a great friend. I have read many of your posts here at the WrongPlanet, and you are a very respectable and nice person in my opinion. I don't think you are a failure at friendships.



No, you are not a failure. Early on in school, I got the teacher comment, "Needs to socialize more with peers." But, I had a best friend and a few others along the way. We are different, and we need to socialize in a way that makes us comfortable. And you had friends that seemed to respect you---you are not a failure.

I don't know if any of my comments are helpful or not. I just wanted to explain how I see it. Don't think my life is all wonderful, because I have challenges like the rest of us. I think what I try to do is think of my life as a hand of cards. There are good cards, and there are not so good cards. I try to play the good cards. Socializing is not a good card for me, but special intense interests are. So I don't socialize much. But when I have to socialize, I rely a lot on acting techniques---pretend you are on a set of a TV show or movie and act it out---act out what is in you that needs to be said.

Thank you for reading this.

Thank you.

I am confused because the diagnostic criteria says:

"Failure to develop peer relationships to the appropriate developmental level."

In my country, years ago, this statement was also included in the assessment criteria.

When I was little my family and I found this statement very hurtful and unhelpful.
Being told that I was basically a failure as a human being from the get go crushed my self esteem. I'm sorry, but this is why I feel angry whenver I see that statement now.

Who gets to decide what's the way "appropriate" to socialise anyway?

This statement also blithely assumes that everyone is supposed to reach the same style and level of social development. I look at the diversity of characters and tempraments in the world and see that that's clearly not the case.

Some of the deepest and most enriching relationships I had were with shy, introverted people. People supposedly below their level of "appropriate" social development. I have learned many things from people like this. Some with genetic conditions. People who had recently moved in from other cultures.

There must be thousands of people out there who were below the "appropriate" developmental level for socialising. yet somehow still managed to do a lot of things and have relationships and families. I'm not saying that any of this is easy, but it can and does happen.

Like you mentioned with your son, they tend to socialise with people like themselves. But then, don't we all?

As you said that would be a case of less of us and more of them.

This is what's bothering me about all of this and I know it shouldn't bother me.

Maybe a perceived "lack of social ability" can be exacerbated by environmental factors too: intense academic pressure; noisy/crowded playgrounds and classrooms; clashes between languages/cultural values/nationality; harassment; gender conflict; standardisation
and conformity (expecting everyone to behave in the same way and do/like the same things).

Maybe expecting everyone to reach exactly the same social level is an unrealistic and counterproductive goal?

Your son has friends, so he's not a complete failure at socialising.

The statement in the criteria is confusing to me because, to the casual reader, it does seem to imply a complete failure. This may be true for some people, but it doesn't seem to be completely true for me. I don't want people to get the wrong idea.

So, am I a partial success at socialising?

If I have deep atypical relationships based on one to one listening, does this mean that I'm a success at relationships that should theoretically have "failed"?

I just felt like I was being compared to the wrong model all along.
This model might be helpful to some people, but it hasn't been helpful to me.

Before I came across this site, I was completely unaware (given all of the negative conditioning I received when I was little) that there could be people like you out there who could be gifted, teach others who were gifted and at the same time be labelled "socially disabled". You do very good work.

I'm sorry, but when I was growing up, people around me had very narrow definitions of "success" and "failure".

Thank you for opening my eyes.

Just because I wasn't bullied in school, doesn't mean I wasn't left out in school. How can I be proud of this? People keep advising me to ''stop blaming all my problems on AS'', because I can't do that. AS is to blame for all my problems. When I write things like, ''I have a perfect friendship going once, and suddenly they turned against me'', people will most likely write back, ''that's because you've probably done/said something to them what you were unaware of''. That's to do with having AS which is not being socially aware of how you've upset someone. Who can be proud of that? And with this ''stop following me'' thing. That is a very big shame, and a lot of Aspies here have probably experienced this at some point in their lives. I used to be told to ''stop following me'' by NTs at school, and I was all like, ''what am I doing? How am I following you? What am I doing what's any different to anyone else? I'm just trying to be friendly! You're NT - that's what you want from people! I'm not doing a single thing to do with following - I am hanging out with you!'' when actually, to them, I'm probably doing about 6 things to do with following/clinging what is invisible to me. Is that anything to be proud of? And all this doesn't stop in the playground. It goes on and on in different ways, right through adulthood (unless I just sit locked up in a cupboard all my life, which is not what I am planning to do).
On some threads I can accept, and think, ''oh AS isn't all that bad,'' but when I get onto the social subject, I start dwelling on it again, and feeling embarrassed and ashamed of myself about what I do socially wrong.
In a way, I think it's easier for males with AS, because sometimes they are more able to emotionally detatch themselves from the NT world and get swallowed up in their special interests. But for Aspie females, it is slightly harder because all females crave social attention that much more than males, and it even runs in Aspie females too. I can't seperate myself from the NT world because most of me is too aware of it. Even my obsessions are focused on people, (eg, men I fancy), and that is the way I'm made - can't change it. I stick out like a sore thumb because I don't wear make-up (because of allergies), and I can't wear proper fashion (because I am sensitive to certain types of clothes, and my feet are sensitive to most fashionable shoes), and I'm also shy (which I cannot change), and I'm even not very acedemically clever. I may have a special type of interest in the weather - but it's mostly around winter time, simply because I'm checking for snow all the time. I hate the snow, and I have to rely on buses, and I'm frightened to slip over in the street in front of people.....OK, I won't go into all that because I wrote about my snow fear in another thread.
All I want to do is socialise, but I'm too shy to. AS is like a vicious circle, especially for females (other females - don't take this as a stereotype - I'm just thinking that I will be a bit different if I was born an Aspie male).

The only thing I am glad about, though, is I may be extremely shy when I first meet other young people in my peers, but I never come across as odd to them. At college I didn't have anyone take the piss out of me, and I had some very bitchy childish people in my college group, who took the piss out of others who were on the spectrum, but never me.

That's because I don't stim, and I don't do things like trying to avoid cracks in the path, and I don't wave my hands about, and I don't do anything Aspie-like, except be shy.
It's when people really get to know me, like get involved with me and my life, is when they'll start realising my differences. My differences don't come out in normal day-to-day communication.

But this doesn't make me proud of having AS, because this part is nothing to do with AS. I'm just glad I'm not the sort of Aspie to stim, or speak in monotone, or avoid eye contact, or never smile, or live in my own world. I never have been.

But that doesn't mean to say I'm not on the spectrum. I get very, very anxious about silly little mundane things, I have an obsessive fear of loud noises, I have meltdowns (at home only), and I have poor anger management (at home too), and I have special interests over the weather and men, but I don't tend to keep talking about those when I'm with friends/meeting new friends.

My AS just seems to come out in other areas.

I am 22 and i was diagnosed with AS at 5 and for the next 12 years i didn't have a problem with it (i even kind of used as a mark of id) I had no real close friends (i still don't) i only had who people who i thought were close friends but they just exploited me and didn't fully care like a Best friend would do. When i was 16 i fell in love with this girl and i just became such a doofus in my pursuit for her affections and i even flat out told her i loved her but she spurned me and the summer i turned 17, i realized that having AS was not good. Sure super focus on my hobbies and a good memory is a plus but it would be never as good as finding someone to love. i also realized that AS also hurt my friendship skills to the point that after a while many of my friends would ignore me or even deliberately avoid me. which brings me to this latest story:
eventually after 3+ years of fruitless courtship i gave up on her and i then found someone new at college and i tried to not jump the gun with this one. originally it turned out she was going to move to a different college with her BF, so i just let it go. the next year she returned however and she broke up with her BF. i didn't want to be scummy and swoop in right after and ask her out. so i waited. In relation to AS, we started out as really good friends, i even deluded myself into thinking best friends. but as time flew by, my AS kicked in and things have been going down hill, facebook has made it worse because i would constantly try to chat with her or message her and i just f****d up royally. about a month ago i asked her out and she said maybe but in my stupid enthuasism i kept telling her good job on the wins in v-ball she had that weekend. she eventually said that not only would she not go out with me, but because i was overwhelming her she threatened to stop being my friend on facebook (i probably think she would go as far as to stop being my friend alltoghether). it was not the shooting me down that got to me (i knew it was a long shot) but it was the threat of losing her as a friend that just me wished that i was dead. (seriously my chest hurt like one of those alien things were going to burst out) my death wish said out loud made my friends put me on suicide watch. I have not spoken to her since....i don't want to think about life without her as a friend...

Of course it's my fault she reacted that way. this was not the first time i overwhelmed her (even though i just was trying to be friendly). if i didn't have this stupid f*****g AS we could have been best friends and maybe something more. I know that we're different in other ways she is a beautiful v-ball player who likes sports and having fun and i am a overweight guy who is not a fan of sports. but i sincerely don't believe in leagues or being with someone who is similar. truth be told i don't want to be with a girl who is like me because her AS traits would just remind me of what i hate about myself. this girl is beautiful but that's not why i fell in love with her: it was because she was so nice to me in Prof. W's history class to me and there were those days where we would talk at her dorm room door that i cherish about her. she moved off campus and i tried to keep that friendship alive but i failed miserably and now everything is ruined. even worse i think that this fallout has being going towards other friends of mine. i don't want to lose her friendship or any others but i just don't know what to do. Sometimes i even doubt if her or any others would be sad if died or feel guilty if i killed myself.

I keep reading that autistic guys don't get married or even find girlfriends that well and when they do, they most often end in divorce. some people tell me not to worry about finding a girlfriend but it's not fair when NT guys who are complete jerks find girlfriends and they treat them like crap. I know i can be annoying and overbearing but i am just trying to be nice. still even if my intentions are good, it is all my fault that i sent her away....

In conclusion, while i am okay with other people being proud in their AS, i aboslutely not proud to have it. I either wish i didn't have it, there was a cure, or just i was dead. i can't be proud of something that will most likely leave me to die friendless, unloved old and alone.

Last edited by HSTfan on 05 Dec 2010, 10:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I dont think i am proud to have Asperger's.... but i am proud to have finally found the reason of why i am so awkward and different ... it makes life a bit easier because i can anticipate things that would make me panicky (now i can avoid it) and i understand more things about myself than ever before.

Pride is quite possibly the most useless invention of human society. It engenders a feeling of entitlement and superiority on those who have it. It motivates people to belittle the accomplishments of others while overstating their own. People have pride in things they had nothing to do with (like what conditions they were born with or what social group they belong to or nation they live in). Why should anyone be proud of what they are; it isn't as if they chose it. People's pride has been manipulated into causing hate, war, terrorism, and even genocide. There's a reason why it's one of the seven deadly sins.

I'm content with who I am, and I am pleased with my accomplishments, but I am also displeased by my failures and shortcomings. I don't think that's pride, as much as acceptance.

@ Zur: Ohhh God, yet another "This is socially constructed and therefore doesn't exist" theory. Pride itself came from our nature, while it's society that tells you what you should be proud of. It doesn't mean pride itself doesn't exist. It means social norms are opinions rather than facts.

Anyways, I don't have pride in Asperger's because it has nothing to do with my character. I pride myself in my character. I can be a whiny little b***h with the sense of entitlement of a two year old and that would have nothing to do with AS. That has to you with how you react to AS and life's challenges in general.

I don't consider AS a part of my character. It's my character that allows me to take the best advantage of it's gifts, as well as the grit it takes to overcome it's obstacles.

I kinda just accept it. I'm not proud or happy about it except that I like being kinda eccentric and it does help me to think outside the box when it comes to music. I'm happy with what aspergers has done to me musically I guess.