Question regarding Asperger's and hormones

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You have THAT right! DemonAbyss10 is TOTALLY WRONG! First of all, the adrenaline is NOT off the charts because, if it were, he would probably not be typing here, and would be trying to get it lowered. My testosterone is HIGH now, TESTED as high, and I am NOT agressive. I have known women that were VERY agressive, and clearly did NOT have high testosterone. There ARE some obvious signs.



A LOT of things could do that.

this was interesting, http://dontdatehimgirl.com/news_view/wh ... e-164.html



They don't sound like good guidelines. High testosterone does NOT lead to smoking or drinking! If anything, it REDUCES the likelyhood! And it doesn't cause risky endeavors, it merely helps to overcome inhibitions due to fear or a lack of confidence. But it doesn't make you STUPID!



NOPE, SAME effects, except wiith regard to atrophy, fertility, etc...., only they are MORE sensitive to it. Apparently, a lot of the fertility returns to normal relatively quickly if women go off testosterone, if it is exogenous. That isn't true of men. Of course ENDOGENOUS testosterone in males is a sign of fertility. Again, THAT is not true of females.



Well, I know mine is high now, and I am no less AS.

I have no knowledge of Inositol, I take Metformin for my PCOS.

re: smoking and high testosterone -

I dunno about the testosterone, but I do know that nicotine and caffeine have an adversarial effect on one's Cortisol levels. They temporarily boost cortisol, but they also put an added strain on the adrenals, thereby reducing the amount of cortisol you have in the long run. For me personally (and I can only speak for myself here) this explained why I would chain smoke so badly when stressed and why coffee never kept me awake, but actually made me sleepy. That's a common phenomenon with Adrenal issues, whether early stages of fatigue or the more severe insufficiency. The minute I felt any undue stress, I went diving for a smoke. Once I got on enough Cortisol, my smoking need went down dramatically. So like I said, I can't speak for anyone else, but for me it absolutely had an effect.

I know that is a lot of quoting, but I felt it was necessary. You make interesting points about your testosterone being high. I studied the effects of the different hormones at university but that was years ago so without doing further research some of what I posted could be subtly wrong.

The things I would research are effects of genetic variations such as individuals with women with XXX sex chromosomes [Triple X syndrome,http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triple_X_syndrome] based on what I learned at university and try to remember what my university lecturer was talking about.
Impulsivity
all the effects of testosterone and if alcohol had any effect
[if anyone wants to do this research then post it on here]

There is a lot there, high testosterone leads to impulsivity [the equivalent to overcoming inhibitions] and this may lead to someone making purchases rashly, eg something they don't need, decide on the spot to buy and purchase. The same people may not make rational choices whether to smoke or not. Please explain why high testosterone reduces the likelihood of risky behaviours.

High testosterone leads to people seeking to undertake active pursuits eg competing

Acne can be caused by high testosterone levels in both genders.

Okay, I don't have any actual science links to throw out here, but I'll go digging for the study I'm about to reference:

* Most of the population, whether assigned male or female at birth, have the same hormone receptors. Overall, responses to hormones are the same for anyone, unless they have something like androgen insensitivity syndrome, and people who have AIS are XY whether they're assigned male or female. This is why hormone replacement therapy is an effective treatment for trans people.

* There was a study done to determine if testosterone actually causes aggression and competitiveness. One group of women was given a placebo and another was given testosterone. At least some of the women who received the placebo were told they received testosterone, and behaved more aggressively and more competitively. Women who were given testosterone without being told actually became calmer and more likely to be "fair-minded."

I'll try to dig that study up, although right now I can't get google to get it.

Well, a lot of times universities don't really teach even according to the university, but rather to the "teacher" or the book.



Has anyone really compared, or even come up with a BIG studdy on XXX chromosome people?



I didn't say it reduced the likelihood of risky behaviour, merely that it didn't cause stupidity, or even more thoughts of it. Smoking is often blamed on stress and energy. Well, testosterone reduces stress and increases energy. SO, it gets rid of those reasons.
Too many figure that people on testosterone are aggressive, and may have tons of fights, etc... I think science bears out that it merely reduces fear, etc... so a personn that WOULD fight, even without testosterone, is more likely to.




YEP, but not ALL. Again, it removes a hindrance. and competition is not always dangerous.



YEP, but not all with acne have high testosterone.

Now THAT sounds like a good study! If they are given what they think is estrogen, or water, they are not likely to change their behaviour unless they ARE affected! Too many forget that!

ALSO, if they feel they got testosterone, they may feel it is a good excuse, may feel they can heal faster and be stronger, and be more likely to do what they ALWAYS wanted to. If they got in trouble for attacking another, they could always blame it on "roid rage"!

And I HAVE known men that CLEARLY had plenty of testosterone, tested and or were STRONG and perhaps even took exogenous testosterone, that were nice and fair, and plenty that clearly didn't, always losers, weak, etc..., that were really NASTY! I think testosterone has REALLY gotten a BAD rap. I'm NOT saying that testosterone makes you a great guy, ONLY that it doesn't by itself make you BAD.

I'm slightly over average height and definitely don't have young features. I'm fairly harsh and old looking; I'm 20, but people assume I'm in my late 20s. My adrenals are ok, as far as I know. I actually had excessively high adrenaline production at one point. I'm a wild animal not a tame one, lol XD. I have a few mild signs of lower than usual cortisol such as draining of blood from the head when standing and need for heavy salt consumption to keep my blood pressure up, but they're pretty mild, I don't get sickness or fatigue or anything.

If you have a sympathetic doc, you could ask for a test of your Renin, Aldosterone, Sodium, and Potassium (RASP). Find a baseline, and go from there. "Normal" doesn't always mean "optimal" in my opinion, and if you're less than optimal, sometimes supplementing can help with that. I do know low blood pressure can sometimes be a hypothyroid symptom, but it can have other causes as well. I've always had normal to high-ish BP so never really had to deal with that BUT I still had the dizziness upon standing as if I did have low BP. What I did was start taking unrefined sea salt, instead of table salt, or salt substitutes. Not only did it help me sleep, it helped with the bloating feeling I had so much, swelling in my fingers/toes, face..

If there's a whole foods market or health store near you, maybe you could ask if they carry it. Otherwise you can order it fairly cheaply online yourself. I get mine from celticseasalt.com. It's unrefined, which means it hasn't had the trace minerals taken out of it. My husband loves it, and we don't have any regular salt anymore in our home.

Thanks for the advice. I don't feel I need to do that though. I eat pure sea salt same as you, no bad s**t in it.

I'm definitely not hypothyroid, lol. I have a crazy high metabolism. I can go out in subzero conditions in a short sleeved shirt and not notice ill effects.

Awesome.

I drink maybe 1/4 teaspoon in a glass of warm water every night. It doesn't even taste very "salty." lol

And other studies have shown the opposite. I actually pointed one out when a similar point was made in another forum... though that topic has been lost to a server issue.

Even though the jury is still out on testosterone and aggression (and keep in mind that, IIRC, taking hormonal suppliments tends to do things aside from just elevate that hormone), we do know that people with XYY chromosomes are much more aggressive than those with XY (they also produce more testosterone), and that those that produce more testosterone are more aggressive than those that produce little. The only explanation for that aside from coincidence (unlikely, given the scale of tests) is that the two are linked in SOME way, though not NECESSARILY in that testosterone causes aggression (for example, aggressive emotions could cause an increase in testosterone, which, IIRC, builds muscles, which is useful for aggressive people, or some factor affects both at the same time).

Actually, there is more than one possible explanation for that, which includes the fact that there is an entire extra chromosome which may have an impact on development and lead to a tendency for more aggression. That would make it correlation, but not causation.

The study:

http://scienceblogs.com/notrocketscienc ... selfis.php

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19997098

My suspicion is that there may be other factors at play in the studies you mentioned, that may explain the difference.

The point is that they ARE connected, even if testosterone isn't necessarily the cause (the whole point of the last half of that paragraph).

This aside from the issues with the study (which don't necessarily make the conclusions false, just questionable), most notably the point I made before about how injections of hormones don't just affect that hormone.

Furthermore, it had them guess whether they were given it or not, rather than told. Hormones affect different people differently (there is no absolute amount of a particular hormone that will produce an absolute effect), and they felt an increase in aggression, etc, then they would be more likely to believe that they were given testosterone. And a WHOLE lot of other problems...

Sorry. I shouldn't rant about the flaws in that study. Like I said, it's not necessarily true that testosterone causes aggression, but passive studies (that only measure testosterone levels and aggression) have shown that they are linked in some way. Again, whether or not testosterone causes aggression, they ARE linked.

I was diagnosed with PCOS at age 19. Have had the worst possible menstrual cycle ever since it started and over the years, it got worst and worst.
My hormones are definitely a mess.
It never shows up on a test - result come back within range
However, I feel better and a huge difference when I take herbs and supplements to address hormone imbalance.
*shrug shoulders*

I've taken inositol. It helps me with the anxiety and be a little more mellow and relaxed. Help me sleep also.

I also have secondary unexplained infertility. I grow facial hair like a man. I display a lot of symptoms of adrenal insufficiency and masculinization. I build muscle really fast.. Have oily acneic skin. Large pores (when i eat meat only, which for the most part, i try to stay on a vegetarian diet).

I'm seeing a doctor in May who's an endocrinologist who's looked into those hormonal links with asd. I really can't wait to see her.

Oh and there's also something to do with insulin resistence... so again... seems to be the adrenals.
I've been 5'9 since the age of 13. I grew up super fast!

I'm sure there's a link to it all!

Yep, I can vouch for all of that, with my condolences! I joke that I am a walking pharmacoepia because of all the stuff I take. Mostly supplements, since I loathe multi vitamins. I prefer to supp only what I'm deficient in and in proper amounts that are actually well above the "RDA". Magnesium, Selenium, sea salt (unrefined), potassium (prescription), D3, and B12/B5. Insulin resistance is common with PCOS. I'm borderline, which is why I take Metformin, 2250 mg per day.

Most Endos I've seen (and there have been a few) are clueless when it comes to real, practical HRT involving Adrenal Fatigue or Insufficiency. Most Hypothyroid patients I've met have better luck with Osteopaths, oddly enough, but even there it's bloody difficult to get someone who isn't afraid of Hydrocortisone to treat AF. If it's not blatant Addison's or Diabetes, they don't like to get involved, liability fears. *wrinkles nose*

That you are taking natural elements and you ARE feeling better is what I'd consider the single most important thing. Labs can be rendered useless by any number of mitigating factors; how much sleep you had the night before, what time you took your meds previously, IF you took your meds, if you smoked before having blood drawn, caffeine, stress. ALL play a role. As it does in the endocrine system itself. If you have PCOS, chances are some other hormones ARE out of balance since they are all interconnected in some fashion. Nothing can function without optimal adrenal output, thyroid, sex hormones, growth hormone, nada. The body just can't survive without Cortisol. There's a certain protocol to fixing these types of problems, just from the patients I've known, and the way my doc treats.

Adrenals, thyroid, sex hormones, growth hormone. The basic premise is that as you move down the 'line' (if you will), you can find sometimes that if you balance out the most necessary hormone functions, the other ones can sometimes even out on their own. My nurse friend has her son on Cortisone, and dessicated thyroid. He had super low growth hormone, and wanted to treat that, but our doctor (we have the same one) said "let's hold off and see how he does after treating his adrenals and thyroid first". Sure enough, within the last year his GH has literally doubled, and is very close to what it should be for his age and gender. And without having to take meds for it; it was all balancing his two "biggies" - Adrenals and thyroid.

Another friend from the thyroid forum tried for years to conceive, and was very hypothyroid. Once she supported her adrenals and thyroid, cleaned up her food supply and water supply - guess what? Yep, she's having a baby!

The late Dr. Broda Barnes stated in his book "Hypothyroidism: The Unsuspected Illness" that MOST of his female patients who came to see him didn't come to be treated for Hypothyroidism. They came for any number of other reasons. Migraines, fertility issues, menstrual pain and irregular periods, body pain, what we know now as Fibromyalgia, CFS. With trials of dessicated thyroid (before the advent of Synthroid, mind you), their body temps went up, their blood pressure came down, they went on to have children, healthy children at that, and live pain free for the most part of their lives.

I'm not saying that works for everyone, but I feel confident in saying a majority experience similar results, just from what I've personally experienced and known from other patients I've met.

Now whether or not this applies to someone with AS, I couldn't tell you. I have no way of knowing if the patients I've met have any illnesses on the Autism spectrum.

well, um, ifthis counts... i am 29 as of today, and I am female. I am also an aspie. I get hot spots on my body, mostly my head and about ten minutes ago my back just FLARED THE F&&K UP for some reason.. it feels REALLLLLY good though? I was thinking the other day taht maybe I get so mad soemtimes because of testosterone... I can;t figure out whether I should keep taking evening primrose or not beause of that. my doctor won't really do many tests for me...he WAS NICe enough to tset me for polycystic though, which was negatory. )) I feel like he thinks I'm hypochondriac. ;( which i am not. haha. I ahve been RIGht orclose to it about every diagnosis so far. but anyway, yeah.. does that help? maybe it's related to... thbis? O.O my ,and to a lessesr extent my fingers, get REALLY COLD easily and my legs tingle painfully/fall asleep a lot. but then I am person who sits adn does cimputer work all day... so... that really doesn't help my already wierd leg veins. but... geez. when your'e tired of walking around your own neighborhood and you can;t work and live with your parents still, what gives? my head also gets reallllly hot and fuzzy sometimes, but that might just be allergens I have yet to completely eliminate from my environment. man, GFCF + paleo diet REALLY works wonders. I just wish there was, you know, more food we could eat on it. like the nono foods. ;( it's not much fun to eat anymorre, but if I eat teh nononfoods I get psycho.

does that help at all?