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Danimal
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14 Aug 2011, 3:22 am

I was an exchange student to Japan. It is true that trains run on time and that there is an exactness in many things they do. However, Japan is not Aspie paradise. They have many, many social rules, many of them unspoken. They will not tell you if you are rude or offensive. You will simply find yourself silently avoided. They are more tolerant of Westerners because they don't expect foreigners to understand Japanese culture.
Germany is definitely not Aspie paradise. I was stationed there for 18 months. They are very exact and have lots of laws. They also have lots of social rules and customs. You can grossly insult a host if you bring the wrong color of flowers or the wrong kind of wine.



paperoceans
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14 Aug 2011, 4:01 am

Danimal wrote:
I was an exchange student to Japan. It is true that trains run on time and that there is an exactness in many things they do. However, Japan is not Aspie paradise. They have many, many social rules, many of them unspoken. They will not tell you if you are rude or offensive. You will simply find yourself silently avoided. They are more tolerant of Westerners because they don't expect foreigners to understand Japanese culture.
Germany is definitely not Aspie paradise. I was stationed there for 18 months. They are very exact and have lots of laws. They also have lots of social rules and customs. You can grossly insult a host if you bring the wrong color of flowers or the wrong kind of wine.


At least you know they're insulted 8) I did not live in Germany, I lived in Austria. And you're gonna have to be very close with a German if they invite you over their house. I'm sure they'll get over the insult since to be invited over--you have to be considered good friends. My German friends and I get annoyed with each other and sometimes feel insulted, but we verbalize it ASAP and it's over and done with. Strange thing, even when I think I'm being very mean, they don't notice and kinda shrug it off.

That's my experience with living there though :wink:

But the reason why I prefer those two countries is there is no "filter". People say what they mean and I never have to guess or try to figure out how they really feel, 'cause they will surely tell you without you even having to ask.



cyberdad
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14 Aug 2011, 7:26 am

Artfuljin wrote:
anyone else notice japanese culture has asperger characteristics.

There are two elements of Japanese culture that is unique
- Shintoism
- Zen

At the heart of these is a sense of serenity and closeness to nature that transcends the martial history and corporatism of Japanese society. However look deeply and it's really a form of narcissistic self purification that is obsessively ritualized and reinforced by a unsaid obedience to social norms that defies the mind of even the seasoned western visitor (that includes Tom Cruise). As a result Japanese culture is not free thinking as our individualistic western culture and to open minded individuals this may be a hardship to undertake not unlike joining a religious cult.

And yet shintoism and Zen have a closeness to nature that is quite beautiful and manifests in their art, ritual and design. But I digress, all of this unfortunately has very little to do with Aspergers.



Reindeer
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14 Aug 2011, 8:49 am

I actually want to live in Japan I have begun to learn myself japanese :3

The best of Japan is it's rude to look directly into someones eyes! <3


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Artfuljin
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14 Aug 2011, 9:14 am

Danimal wrote:
I They will not tell you if you are rude or offensive. You will simply find yourself silently avoided.


these are the similarities i can relate with I do the same thing to people i find rude or offensive but its simply because i dont really know how to respond to it emotionally.



Artfuljin
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14 Aug 2011, 9:16 am

Danimal wrote:
I They will not tell you if you are rude or offensive. You will simply find yourself silently avoided.


these are the similarities i can relate with I do the same thing to people i find rude or offensive but its simply because i dont really know how to respond to it emotionally.



syrella
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14 Aug 2011, 10:39 am

Reindeer wrote:
I actually want to live in Japan I have begun to learn myself japanese :3

The best of Japan is it's rude to look directly into someones eyes! <3

You sound just like me. Haha. I found out about the eye contact bit and I thought... finally! A culture that understands!

It's not Aspie paradise, as other have said, but I do wish you well in your endeavors. Japanese really is a fun language to learn and Japan is a beautiful country to live. I definitely enjoyed having that as one of my interests.


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Gedrene
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14 Aug 2011, 11:17 am

What a load. I can get non-verbal cues quite good. It is just mine are different.



Buck-oh
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14 Aug 2011, 12:56 pm

Dantac wrote:
Buck-oh wrote:
I kind of find "interested only in superficial things" to be kind of a judgement call.


Go to a mall frequented by 12-14yr olds and just listen to the subject of their conversations.

Now imagine that same thing but with 24yr~30yr olds.

I can understand small chat or 'for fun' chat but when they do this 24/7... well you get the idea.Remember though: this is their 'group/public' persona. Once you split one of them from the group and get to know the person they switch to the 'smarter' (for lack of a better word) persona.


It could also be that the things they like talking about are all likes the group has in common. The girl may actually enjoy discussing clothes, tv shows, music, boys, as much as she enjoys talking about "deeper" things.

The conversational dynamics of groups are quite different than of families or one-on-one. Group conversations are aimed at a level where everyone feels comfortable contributing. If two girls in the group suddenly start having a debate over the "Big Crunch" vs "Heat Death", and the other members of the group have no clue what they're talking about, it excludes the other women in the group from the conversation.

Talking about topics outside the group norm is similar to ignoring children during an "adult discussion". It can come across as confusing at best and patronizing at worst.



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15 Aug 2011, 6:01 pm

syrella wrote:
Reasons why it might not be are that the communication style is anything but straightforward. People do not tell you the truth very often there. It is almost always said indirectly, especially if it is an insult. There are different levels of politeness depending on who you talk to. If you speak to a superior, you must be polite. Sometimes even tiny gestures can be construed as rude. A lot of the communication that goes on is left unspoken. Often it is not what you are doing but what you are not doing that gets you into trouble.


Yup this is the exact reason why I dont care for the Japanese. I grew up in a place where there was a high japanese pop. While local japanese are different then the ones from japan, much of the japanese culture still pervails. A lot of communication gets left unspoken. I've recently gotten into asian pop and I heard that asian celebs get bashed by fans if they show something subtly disrespectful in their body language. However I do think that if an aspie were to grow up in the culture and basically be a chameleon, imitate all the body language, study it extensively, etc. They could pass off pretty decently. It would take a considerble amount of being a chameleon and not being yourself.

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Ai_Ling wrote:
maybe in old style Japanese culture. As a female aspie, Id find moving to Japan as not fun. The girls around my age seem to be super cutesy, airheaded, submissive and materialistic. Where I live, I see a lot of Japanese tourist, the girls...ick. Ok I'd imagine some aspie guys might really like that. But as a fellow female, i wouldnt really care for the excessive ditziness.

I definitely ran into this as well. Most of the Japanese girls I met were not interested in having philosophical discussions or anything serious. They were more interested in clothes, make-up, gossip, and celebrities... same stuff they are into over there. Even the guys are extremely interested in "facade". In Japan, it is all about "image"-- how you appear to people. I've noticed that they tend to care more about how they look doing something more than they care actually doing the task well or efficiently. For example, if you are student, you go to the library and study. It doesn't matter if you just go there to sleep. So long as you can say "I was in the library", that is all that matters. In other words, so long as you LOOK like you are doing the job properly, that is what matters. Obviously it is more complex than that, but that was one trend that I noticed.


Thats pretty much my limited experiance with Japanese girls. When I talk to them, there very pleasant but theres just a huge lack of depth. This does not speak for them academically, asian countries have good reps for very good academics and intellect. The asian steriotype is that we're all geeks and super smart. Coming from a female perspective whos asian american born, I would not want to be friends with these girls. But I realize it could be a test in refining my politeness. Manage to become acquinted with girls like this and not ruffle their feathers.