OMG extremely nice book

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Invisiblesilent, that's how it works in the world, yes. But if I'd known this before my late forties, I would've freaked out it's so terrifying. The status of the speaker makes the "facts" true or untrue.

Their is no gain by posting such things. What is the reason you post "For what?", For what do you say for what? can you answer please. It's really astonish me someone of 29 said this to me.

“Arrows of hate have been aimed at me too, but they have never hit me, because somehow they belonged to another world with which I have no connection whatsoever.”
Einstein


"I" just express what "I" feel about many people, if "you" don't like it "you" don't have to post.
It looks to me Einstein was right about everything "he" said, however, "he"'s ignored like people who don't believe in rational arguments, but follow blindly authority.

“The Press, which is mostly controlled by vested interests, has an excessive influence on public opinion.”
—Albert Einstein

“I have to apologize to you that I am still among the living. There will be a remedy for this, however.”
—Albert Einstein

“Of all the communities available to us, there is not one I would want to devote myself to except for the society of the true seekers, which has very few living members at any one time.”
—Albert Einstein

I agree with Einstein.

This book was a huge eye opener. I feel enlightened having read it. I new my brain was different but hadn't realized just how different until I read this book. It was the first time I have ever been sad for NTs.

The part I find most worrying is that this effect appears to be the primary driving force behind political policies and decision making. I spend a good deal of my time studiously NOT thinking about these things because I tend to get anxious, terrified and ANGRY in equal measure when I do :/

Two thing I want to learn you, nothing more. I can't say everything in dept.
But I think it is really important for autistics.

THINK FOR YOURSELF, NEVER LET SOMEONE SAY SOMETHING ABOUT YOUR NEUROLOGY WITHOUT EVEN RESEARCHING ITSELF.
TODAY I WOULD SAY 95% OF THE RESEARCH PUBLICED IN PEER-REVIEWED JOURNALS ARE NOT SCIENTIFIC.

Quote of einstein:

“A person experiences life as something separated from the rest - a kind of optical delusion of consciousness. Our task must be to free ourselves from this self-imposed prison, and through compassion, to find the reality of Oneness.”

We are not according many people an individual:

As the Moon, during the referenced-corpses of her eternal movement around the Earth, was of a self-awareness, she would completely convinced that she was moving from himself.

So would a being, endowed with a higher insight and more perfect intelligence, looking at the man and his actions, laugh at the illusion of man that he acts from his own free will. (Albert Einstein)

u

Bought it and am going to read it now

Antoine de Saint-Exupery said it in The Little Prince: the way you dress is more persuasive than your ideas.

You shouldn't try to not think about it, on the contrary, you should have it always present in your mind so that you take it into account when relating to NTs. Eg: in the workplace, it's known that if you want to introduce a new idea / procedure / course of action, you have to first be able to sell it to the most influential person. That's often the big boss, but by far not always. The big boss is also influenced, by the most influential employees. So if you're good at pinpointing who the influential person is in the field you want to introduce a change, you have to first flatter and pace and pander to that person, and only when you have them on your side, can you go on and ask for a meeting with the decision makers to present your idea.

Surrender the pain you feel, and maybe you'll automatically accept it easier.
Escaping from pain is only more painful in my experience.

Simple:
I looked at the tread so far and could not locate anything constructive you said.
I was curious if the poster maybe meant the OP, and merely got the name wrong.
So the answer to this : Their is no gain by posting such things. is pretty simple;
I did not understand why he would thank you, so I asked for the reason.
Because I like to learn and understand things... Kind of like Einstein even!

Here are some more questions I have!
-“I have to apologize to you that I am still among the living. There will be a remedy for this, however.”
—Albert Einstein

Are you insinuating I want you to die? Because boy, that is kind of an extreme conclusion to come to when I merely asked a simple question to clarify something SOMEONE ELSE said!

“Arrows of hate have been aimed at me too, but they have never hit me, because somehow they belonged to another world with which I have no connection whatsoever.”
Einstein

Oh, so my curiosity is an arrow of hate? Wow, that sounds mean! How mean of me to ask a question!
You know, if he had answered and THEN I'd have posted something mean you might have had a point. Sounds more like YOU (in your appearant other world where they do not exist) are pointing one of those mythical arrows at ME.
But that might just be my autistic side misunderstanding this vague barrage of quotes?

“The Press, which is mostly controlled by vested interests, has an excessive influence on public opinion.”
—Albert Einstein

Yes, Albert, completely true! Look at Fox News for example. Oh, Paxfilosoof, what does that have to do with my question?
The best I can come up with is a faint connection that asking a question (which happened) is something the press also tends to do?
But being curious is hardly a vested interest, nor was I interested in influencing the public opinion.
Because, hey, most NT's don't form their own opinion but just accept what the group (leader) thinks.
But here on WP I'd assume everyone would just read the thread and form their own opinion (on this book).

My question would help in doing that, nothing more. More info = a better founded opinion, no?
Maybe you had posted a great review and then later edited your message to leave it out again, and I had missed that original review?
Like I said; the question was just for getting an answer. I don't care about your reputation one way or the other, and if you think my reply had something to do with influencing that I'd apologize...

EDIT: Oh, you ARE the OP.
Sorry, my bad. I thought I'd remembered the member with the tiger icon started this thread!
Never mind my original reply then, I TOO want to thank you for the recommendation!
But my reply to yours still stands... Don't be so defensive, just said "I guess he thanked me for suggesting the book ".
Then I'd have re-checked the OP and directly apologized to you....

I suppose it's good to be able to understand the NT way of thinking, but I don't think I could ever emulate it fully. Saying things I know are inaccurate is physically painful for me, and I fear thinking this NT way would dull my ability to think logically over time. It doesn't seem worth it - not even if it comes down to keeping a roof over my head or not! I'd rather be homeless and honest (although I'm lucky enough that, at the moment, that isn't the choice I'm presented with).

So I suppose I agree with you, paxfilosoof. If you use LGBT rights movement as an example, yes, we're in for quite a struggle, but they have had some success in spite of all the opposition. I'm afraid of what might happen to us, though, as we become more visible and, probably, controversial. Look at the trend to label us a monsters who lack empathy. Scary.

I just interpret "for what" as an attack (quote 1). And I just wanted to know why you said that. Because I didn't see any reason to ask such question, because the person was just nice for thanking me for the book.
I thought you said that because you didn't like the book. Sorry. Hence, why I just used some quotes of einstein (quote 2,3, ...) to illustrate that people need to look for themself, and not only for what is being said. And I beleive I was annoyed by your earlier posts, because somehow, when I say something many people don't agree with about autism (scientific community, and others) I always being said to hate "neurotypicals". No, I'm just trying to show that their are others thought about the subject, mainly that autistic people are not always some kind of disorder but just a difference.

No I'm not insinuating that. I interpret this quote of Einstein that he felt very different from the average person. He felt very isolated and lonely in his life, still he was famous. Many people were saying that he was abnormal. hence, why he apologize that he is still among the living(I quote him for the same reason, sorry but I'm still among the living and you don't have to accept my critic answers but I personally think their is some truth in it, see earlier posts about autistics and neurotypicals). He didn't felt he was wrong or something, just different. I used this quote as an example of the book, which is why I say that many neurotypicals using autism as a way of controlling some autistic people. My personal experience just tells me, that many autistics are used by neurotypicals and labeled as learning disabled. And I don't think that's fair. I think it's just a different way of being, and yes I ignore the DSM, and soem research into autism. Because personally I think when something is seeing as bad in a society, the research into it can show everything about it. But when we don't just look at the bad things, you'll see that the negatives in one area can be compensated by positives in another area.

I mean that this is the same with the research in autism and press is even changing autism researchers. I interpreted your question, as an attack, because I just don't really see the connection with curiosity(and I've read your earlier posts also, hence, the truth seeker). I'm personally just trying to put autistic people in a better light, of course autistic people are not always the victim or what else I made said in earlier posts.
I think eventually we need to accept that many autistic people are being ridiculed, what the book is also trying to say.
Of course autistic people and neurotypicals can be bad, When I'm saying that neurotypicals do ... I'm not saying every neurotypical do ... Just that a percentage do ...

I fully agree with what you said. That's why my posts look sometimes "hate to neurotypicals", but it's not.
I'm just the other way of the extreme way of thinking of autistic people. I have an autistic girlfriend and it looks to me that we don't have more problems what soever, and the statements of many people that it's a social disorder or whatever people call it, is not very accurate, it's the way of looking at it in a neurotypical way. I'm looking at it in an autistic way, and people attack me for this reason as an "neuroypical hater".

I'm really scared about the neurotypicals who always want to change other people (many neurotypicals want to do that).
Everything I say, people don't have to accept it. But I just want to be at the other end of the way of looking to autistics, because like you said: now it's a trend to say autistic people lack empathy. Probably it was a trend some years ago that some people are not social (introverts, full of autistics), and it look it's now a fact that autistic people lack communicating ability. Which is not the case, and I think intense world theory explain something of that.

http://ianology.wordpress.com/2012/07/1 ... and-happy/

It reminds me of my girlfriend, and it looks it's not only in my situation the case.

It's like the abortion porblem. First people only abort people who'll suffer very much. Later people abort because they've a child what the parents percieve as a defective child(influenced by society). Isn't it very sad, parents are now starting to hate their autistic child and prevent it by abortion, instead of just trying to understand why the autistic child is doing something. It starts with A. and it ends with Z.

If society is not open for chance at looking to autism, it's automatically that autistic people are being percieved as defective.
It's like the animal kindgdom, our society is not open for animals, and every person almost say that the dead of a animal is not very bad. But when we whould live in a country were almost everyone is a vegetarian, people would see that animals have equally rights to live on this planet.

Originally the book was recommended to me by Blindspot149 about a year ago (many thanks). I must admit this book is my favorite autism related book right now, I often recommend it to other autistics I come across.

The models of NT thinking and NT group dynamics may appear frightening at first glance (I know someone IRL who really doesn't like the world the book depicts), but for me, it helps me immensely not only with understanding NT ways of thinking better but also to laugh off some of my past and present issues with extreme and ridiculously stereotypical NT-ish behaviors surrounding me, mostly at my workplace but also in my family. Eventually it empowers me to use more NT-tricks in practice without feeling miserable about them. Apparently some people really do need them.

Kenjitsuka, I'm not having a go at you, but everyone is entitled to an opinion. There's no need to attack someone who disgrees with you.

We've all been brought up in different ways, and have had different experiences. You don't know the experiences of the others' here. For all you know they could have been attacked by NTs for all their lives. Probably most people here have. Although it is wrong to place the blame on NTs, sometimes it's very hard when it's mostly up to the aspie to come across as friendly. Only every now and again do you find an NT who is willing to accept someone for who they are. I'm not attacking NTs by saying this - it's a fact of life for many of us that we have to put on a front, in order not to "creep" people out, or push people away, lose jobs etc. It's upsetting and stressful and affects us everyday. It is why we have a disorder in the first place. We shouldn't blame NTs, but we shouldn't blame ourselves either. It should be a 50/50 situation, but sadly it's not.

And, paxfilosoof wasn't even attacking NTs. S/he was just saying to try to talk to people who are similar to you, and to those who don't accept you, it's OK. I disagree that NTs are trying to control people with the label of "autism" too, but instead of attacking and using sarcasm, why not debate?

Paxfilosoof, again sorry for the confusion earlier.

This is a bad and scary thing indeed. I think however that they do this a) unconsciously for the most part and b) that they only do this out of fear.
Because they fear what they don't know, and the only thing they do know is how they act and how they think.
So I think the NT is just manipulating everyone as best as he can to be more like himself, not just ASD people but as many NT's as well.

I think this is covered in the book after Scene 6 or 7.



Is this a metaphore?
Because you can only detect autism after being one year old, no? So I don't think people would get an abortion because of "autism", because I don't think it's possible to detect before birth?

About the book:
I am not done yet, and I do find some concepts baffling. This probably means it is accurate, because I think that about many NT thinking and interactions in real life as well.
I had some good discussion with the NT who helps me with practical matters, about what I had read so far.
She said "Yes, those are all bad things NT's tend to do. That's why I love working with ASD people so much, they are honest and fair and don't care about status etc.".

Last edited by Kenjitsuka on 21 Aug 2012, 12:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

It's my personal experience that people use it when they feel attacked by me. If I just let neurotypicals be who they're, of course they wouldn't use it.
When I was 12-15 my parents told it to teachers (and teachers => children). And I had only more problem because of that. Teachers couldn't accept me, and when I had a different perspective on something it was always "me" who was bad/incorrect. They never understanded my perspective, and they didn't really cared about it. When I explained it even very simple, they still said I was making things up. Just because I don't believe everything people tell me, doesn't mean what I'm saying is false. It's obvious to me that I'm being discriminated by extreme forms of neurotypical people, even teachers. When I'm giving some critic, they always defend themself by saying, "you're autistic, please shut up". They just can't accept that I'm not ignorant.