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StarTrekker
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07 Nov 2012, 9:29 pm

I know the concept, that it's when people understand how others are feeling, but I'm confused as to how it works. People say it's weird when you only feel empathy for people who have had similar experiences to you, but how can anyone understand how someone else is feeling if they've never been where that person is themselves? That is something I just can't wrap my head around. There is also some disagreement as to when it's normal to feel empathy or not, such as when some big tragedy happens to a bunch of strangers on the news; some people think those who feel nothing are cold, others think it's perfectly normal because they didn't know these people, so does anyone have a clear answer for what would be normal in a situation like that? I'm struggling with this because I have no idea whether or not I experience empathy "normally" -- I thought I did, until I heard that others can actually experience it for someone whose experiences they haven't shared. Anyone have any thoughts on this?


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07 Nov 2012, 9:33 pm

It's being able to see yourself in others. In their position/state. I have never had my leg mutilated in a terrible accident but I would still feel empathy if I saw it happen to somebody else, because I know it would be a horrific experience.


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07 Nov 2012, 10:01 pm

Wouldn't that be sympathy though. I think I can feel sympathy, but not empathy. I might feel bad that someone has a mangled leg, but I cannot think what they are thinking or put myself in their shoes.


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StarTrekker
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07 Nov 2012, 10:11 pm

I was sort of wondering the same thing. In that situation, I can imagine how the other person might feel; afraid, in pain, frustrated, etc, but I'm not sure if I would actually feel those things myself.


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Sanctus
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07 Nov 2012, 10:13 pm

For me, empathy is something very vague. I really don't know whether I feel it or not. Of course, if I look at someone that's sad or hurt, I'll know that this person feels bad. Is that empathy? Simply knowing what someone else feels right now? I don't know.



jacked
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07 Nov 2012, 10:52 pm

I have no idea what empathy is. It would be nice for someone to make a video!

On one hand if I like you I can realize what things would cause me anxiety and imagine that those situations cause the same for you. I avoid anything that would cause you anxiety. I want great things for my friends and family. I want them to succeed and enjoy life.

I have very bad anxiety, if you couldn't tell.

On the other hand if someone is really mean to me like a constant bully that tries to excite my anxiety, I can watch him get thrown through a wood chipper while I eat a twinky. I wouldn't do it myself but I could watch.

So I guess that would be what it's like to not have empathy
so it must be the opposite of that.
I was told I have no empathy, I have the need to be accepted and it was a better replacement.
But I watch the people I associate with because I could easily be manipulated into doing bad things without empathy.



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08 Nov 2012, 2:23 am

I have found that some aspies have more natural, cognitive and emotional empathy than many non autistic people I know, just that their ability to convey that is often seriously impaired.

I often see posts here where some brave aspie has bared their soul in a post only for another poster to bypass the pure emotion and offer a critique on comprehension or miss-spelled words. This is a great example of being empathically impaired.



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08 Nov 2012, 2:38 am

It's a lot about knowing what someone needs, and if those needs should trump your own at that moment.



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08 Nov 2012, 3:54 am

I dont do empathy, but i do sympathy.



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08 Nov 2012, 4:00 am

The most hideous of monsters.



AspieJay
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08 Nov 2012, 5:19 am

Sympathy is a mutual sorrow for the situation....empathy is where you understand the emotional pain of others. This may be a really shoddy example coming up but it's the best I can do at this moment....

The Example
Let's say that you are unfortunate enough to be involved in an accident where the rest of your life is wheelchair-bound. People who pass you by, whilst you're in your wheel-chair, will have sympathy for you because they wish you could walk.......people who empathise attempt to share your viewpoint and imagine life in your shoes and how it would make you feel.

Sympathy = Feeling an emotion for the scenario
Emapthy = Visualising the feelings from your point of view

I'm sorry if I may be a little incorrect with y example but I hope it makes sense.


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08 Nov 2012, 5:50 am

I've wondered about this because having AS I'm supposed to lack empathy, but it's not one of the traits I feel I really lack.

I have heard empathy is linked to imagination, and that people with autism lack one because they lack the other. If you can't imagine what it's like to be someone else, can't imagine something you haven't directly experienced, they you can't empathise.

I don't have problems with imagination, despite being AS in so many other ways, which would seem to fit with this.

I have terrible trouble understanding other people's thoughts and feelings and actions on one level. But I can recognise that people feel differently from me. And I can recognise that sometimes people feel the same thing I'm feeling, too. I think that's the first stage of empathy - recognising other people's feelings.

Being able to imagine what it's like to feel as another person does - even without direct experience to go on - is the next stage. This is harder for me, but I can often do it, especially if I try to summon up situations that are perhaps a little similar. Or I try to imagine how I'd feel if I'd had different experiences. Or if I'd not experienced something that happened to me - how did my worldview change from that experience? I imagine how, if I lacked that experience, I might not have the same feelings about something that I currently do. Then I can imagine how another person who also lacks that experience would feel differently.

Sympathy implies feeling sorrow for another person. Empathy has connotations of that too, I think, as the word is used. Not just recognition but, through recognition, the ability to react sympathetically and in an understanding way.



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08 Nov 2012, 7:30 am

I never really know if I'm good at empathising with people or not. Let's say someone I know loses his or her job and they tell me about it. I will then say something like "oh that's too bad" or "sorry about that" (which is some sort of learned response I guess). I then understand the situation is s**t and I really think it's too bad he/she lost his/her job. But I feel no feelings. It's the same when for example my mother tells me that she really doesn't like her job. I recognise she's in a bad situation but I don't start to feel angry or sad for her etc. So I think it's bad but I don't really feel anything. I don't really feel what they're feeling. Doesn't mean I don't care about them. Does that make sense?

Also, I should add that when I see documentaries about children getting bullied etc I get really angry and I feel sorry for them. I've been bullied so I know how horrible it is. It's easier to get emotional then.

Does this mean I'm good or bad at empathising?



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08 Nov 2012, 12:45 pm

Id go also for the ability to know and correctly interpret others feelings.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/empathy

Wed have some kind of empathy towards aspies especially for stress/anxiety feelings, being unfairly judged feelings, obsession related feelings, and further more
Some we probably even share with other NT people in depression and other "mental conditions".

I would even go so far and say that NTs empathy towards aspies is impaired as well. How should they know if theyd never experienced it?

Our perception and experiences are just simply so different that we have difficulties.
And the reason is that we do not start reading emotions of others when we are young in the normal way(sensory overload or something like that as a cause)

Well NTs would probably even say our feelings are wrong or theyd comment on that with some other crap.

Actually I am tempted to say we are just different and not really "impaired" just a bit more different than Arabic and Japanese people.

I mean that I want to see how a japanese gets along in egypt or an arabic in japan, haha.
Are all arabic and japånese people impaired?
Well they arent, just that japanese are probably not very friendly towards arabic living in japan
and vice versa arabic make quite mean jokes about japanese friendliness in egypt.

well maybe not that good example because that is not really generally true, but just you could probably say that japanese culture and arabic culture are quite different and that this can probably lead to difficulties of same kind

Wed understand their feelings of being outside of society and what thatd mean = empathy

EDIT: Well I guess there is still some big difference in our empathy and that of NTs (I might be though wrong, due to lack of experience). Intuitive feelings recognition, thats probably not our strength. I mean if wed see a different aspie being bullied, would that cause immediately similar feelings? I dont know, maybe it does



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08 Nov 2012, 12:57 pm

Why are people here stupid enough to believe that NTs have ''universal empathy'', meaning to me that they can put themselves in other people's shoes even if they haven't faced the same experiences? If any of that was true, wouldn't Aspies be more understood? :roll:


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08 Nov 2012, 2:22 pm

I wonder if this is related to your question, since there was a thread about autistic doesn't dream, but meaning to say that the dreaming part in autistic constantly idle instead of switching on and off like in NTs. So here is something I read about empathy and analysing. Could the analysing part in the brain be more active instead of empathy part in the brain for people on the spectrum?

Quote:
Washington: Personnels at the helms of affair in institutions take a note. Empathising with people can diminish your brain's analysing ability, according to a pivotal study.


When the brain fires up the network of neurons that allows us to empathise, it suppresses the network used for analysis, found a new study led by a Case Western Reserve University researcher.

source: http://kalvimalar.dinamalar.com/news-de ... 0203&cat=1