your thoughts on self-sabotage

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(Wasn't sure which forum this topic should go in). If you have, or if you know someone who has self-defeating behaviours, what are your thoughts as to the possible causes?

One self help book I read a while back had an explanation that I thought was interesting- they said self-sabotage becomes a default behaviour if a person is lacking positive internal guidance, if there is no "internal coach" as the author put it. I was left with thoughts like "that's all it takes?" and maybe there's no such thing as neutrality in life.

In my case, I can see one possible reason but it's difficult to describe in a way that makes it clear. This idea has been percolating: I was so detached from reality (which brings up a separate question- is that a typical autism/AS trait...I think at least you can say that we are easily detached from social reality) that self-destruction was a way of finally connecting with the world. As if there was a desparate part inside saying "anything, any connection, no matter how negative, would be better than this" - better than just drifting through life unattached.

What are some other ideas ?

I'm interested in the self-sabotaging phenomena. I think your description regarding internal guidance sounds plausible, although I can't really say because I can't think of any examples in life where I have self-sabotaged. I gather it is a self-defence mechanism to avoid a meltdown.

As a metaphor, let's say NTs speak and understand chinese whereas AS don't. I imagine it would be like if someone gave me a sheet of paper with chinese writing on it and the person handing it to me said "take care of this for me" (in english so understandable). I just wouldn't be able to deal with it at all of course, and if the person said "hey, what's happening with that piece of paper" and kept getting irritated I would eventually chuck a wally and storm off, avoiding that person for as long as possible.

self-fulfilling prophecies are all ego based. It comes from the illusions your mind creates for you and the identity your mind creates for yourself. You allow yourself to believe you are not capable of something and the self-defeating behaviour begins.

As for meltdowns from the previous poster.... I find self-defeating behaviours tend to cause my meltdowns.

Another idea. When bringing up the topic of self-sabotage with a friend, he came up with a more basic explanation which probably makes sense in a lot of cases: emotional immaturity combined with frustrated attempts at trying to reach a goal. Maybe one of those factors would have to be more at the extreme end: either severe frustration or severe emotional immaturity.

I think that's accurate, except in my case it was the opposite in a way - I allowed myself to believe that I was capable of too much and so ended up crashing into reality.


That's a good one- the foreign language metaphor explains how frustration can happen with AS/ PDD-NOS, etc. I could use the metaphor something like this: basic social rules or manners were like a foreign language that I didn't understand - and I had no awareness of that which made it worse.

Or perhaps the metaphor could be modified some- if I receive the sheet of paper with writing that I don't understand, common sense would compel me to realize what's going on- that I'm not tuned in socially, that I have a problem of some sort, that I need help. But instead the writing becomes a murky gray cloud and I don't realize anything, don't seek help, and just keep blundering through life- until eventually I self-destruct.

A lot of times people have engaged in self defeating behaviors to the point of huge breakdowns were they'd get hospitalized and then at that point get the help they need.
Or on a less extreme scale, at least get the help in the form of a therapist, outpatient, etc.

This is common in the mental health world. Sometimes people may even get locked up in jail, then sent to the local civil hospital for treatment.

I've read that Borderline Personality Disorders will self sabotage when they have been making progress, as they have a fear of losing that support that's currently there once they do better. However it's likely other diagnosis may do it to different degrees.

When you mention being detached from reality i can identify with that as it's something i've always done. I think of it as an ASD trait.
There are cases where self destruction has led to people getting the help they need, however it seems on the extreme end, yet it happens sometimes, likely more often than not. Sometimes i think it's that the pleas for help have been missed and an individual can get into a desperate or severe situation and then the system gets involved so they get help.

Sometimes we have to help ourselves and seek out those therapy or psychologists who can help us. Finding a good therapist can be hard, sometimes it's a process. I've been through at least 8 different ones before i found a good one and he was awesome! I was his patient for years until he retired.
So now i have a new therapist and am slacking since i need to make an appointment. I need to give myself that kick in the butt sometimes.

The thing is i don't consider my detachment from the world at times a bad thing at all. It doesn't hurt anyone and is calming to me, sometimes i need it. It seems a coping type "skill"? (not sure of word to use) yet it works for me.
Now if i were to never talk to anyone and literally cut off the whole world, including my gf then they would get scared. That would be bad.

Isolation for example. There are times when i isolate myself away from other humans. There have been times in the past where i did this for months on end and then some and it seemed to worsen my symptoms.
Yet isolation in moderation might be okay. I guess it depends on the individual.

I suppose what I do would be considered self-sabotage by you lot....

I consider it civil war against my ID ... and to a lesser extent, my Superego.
What they want is different to what I want.
They try to get what they want... and if I don't want it, then I generally try to inhibit their ability to do so.
If they get too pushy about it... I punish them, generally in ways that only make a difference to them.


The end result is that my Superego is sneaky, deceptive, and stays silent 95% of the time..... while my ID is a broken, vicious mess of destructive urges and acute paranoia.

And me? ... Pretty much too busy trying to destroy the other driving forces in this brain to bother getting anything else done... not that I really give a toss about anything besides destroying this gestalt.

That makes sense. As soon as they start to improve, they can see losing their support group, and so start to self-sabotage and maybe not even be aware of it.


I like that idea. Self-destructive tendencies are really just a plea for help. For someone who has no idea how to ask for help, or what help to ask for, or who to ask, self-sabotaging behaviour could be the voice of unmet needs inside getting desperate.


To just accept being detached- that shows a healthy presence of mind. When I think about that I realize just how much envy I had. No matter what the situation, the grass was always greener- for example I'm the quiet kid off to the side, envious of other kids are talking and having fun. Or later in life, never feeling like I've found a place to live where I feel like I belong there.

A great metaphor. Internal civil war. If all the competing drives, desires, motivations inside cannot hold a council to work it out...

Besides the concept of id/ego/superego, maybe there are some other mental maps - other ways of visualizing the different parts of the psyche- that would lead to less strife.