Can people with Aspergers have a Learning Disability?

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For an AS diagnosis you must have at least an IQ above 70. So if you have had besides autism a normal development (learning to talk at a fairly normal time etc.) you can still have mild cognitive impairment. But everything under IQ 70 is clearly either classic autism or PDD-NOS, depending on the severity of the symptoms.

Actually you can have both, lower IQ and an LD, but that's more difficult to sort it out, because the LD must be independent from the lower IQ. Meaning that a person has IQ 70 for example, but has difficulty to read even a singe sentence properly, eventhough the person got normal education. In this case you can suspect after making tests, that the person has both.

In the US, "Learning disabilities are most often defined by describing a discrepancy between ability and performance. Children with learning disabilities are of average to above-average intelligence (or IQ), but performance assessments and standardized tests indicate that their classroom achievement fails to match their evident ability. Because learning disabilities relate specifically to classroom performance, they are rarely identified before a child enters school and confronts academic instruction."

Note: it is one of the more prevalent handicaps estimated to reach 5-10 percent of the population. That being said, it became more recognized with the emphasis of academic achievement since the 50s onward.

People with LD:

"Winston Churchill: had a learning disability.

Walt Disney: had a learning disability.

Edison: Had a learning disability. He couldn't read until he was twelve years old and had a very difficult time writing even when he was older

George Patton: This World War II General had a learning disability.

Nelson Rockfeller, former Vice President: had a learning disability, dyslexia.

Werner Von Braun: had a learning disability and often flunked his math tests in high school.

George Washington: Had a learning disability. He could barely write and had very poor grammar skills.

Woodrow Wilson: U.S. President from 1913-1921. Had a learning disability -- was severely dyslexic

Other famous people who have learning disabilities are Cher, Tom Cruise, Whoopi Goldberg, Greg Louganis, Bruce Jenner, H.G. Wells."

Last edited by Briarsprout on 21 Oct 2013, 9:56 am, edited 3 times in total.

If there's at least one standard deviation's difference between your verbal and performance IQs, that should be dxed as a Learning Disability, in the IQ > 70 sense used in the US. That should not be termed borderline MR to my understanding.

I'm not an expert in this area, but I believe the trend in dx amongst Clinical Psychologists in the US prohibits the comorbid dx of MR and LD. LDs are to be specifically dxed when the IQ is average or above. --Not that there's necessarily a realistic difference with such an arbitrary cut-off.

Please correct me if I'm wrong. That is hearsay from my mother who, now retired, was a clinical psych and did testing and dx for these kinds of conditions.

I guess that's a bit a matter of interpretation and what's typical in the country and so on.
I was also tested how high my IQ is when I got dx with dyslexia.
But I once talked with a woman who worked together with intellectually impaired ppl and she explained to me how you can differentiate between MR alone and MR + LD. It depents how good you are supposed to read and write or calculate etc. with that IQ you have as an average. If you IQ is just mildly impaired, but you can barly read and write than those problems can't be explained my the mildly IQ impairment alone. And to me this explenation makes a lot of sence actually.
But I'm unsure about the officiall guidlines. So it's possible that in those cases the guildlines state not to dx a LD in addition. I can't tell you for sure. But some psychiatrists seem to do so anyway.

If I would have a child with intelectual impairment, it would still have a high propability to have dyslexia in addition to it, because it's running in my family. So it should be possible to have both.

In the US by having dyslexia you are learning disabled. Learning disability is a header for a series of sub-disorders which relate to processing of information. Please reach the operational definitions I have given.

I know and I used that definition.
I just talked mostly about dyslexia as an example of LD, because I know most about it.
By the way the correct term for that diagnostic category is learning disorder.

As people had stated numerous times, LD is not mapped to MR in the US or Canada.

You are using the UK definitions which is causing confusion in the discussion. The UK I believe makes the definitions as you describe and as people have pointed out.

But I don't think 5-10 percent of the population is MR or intellectually challenged. This is why operational definitions are important and why I laid them out clearly. In the US / Canada LD is mapped to processing disorders ie "input in, input out disorders" if I was to use a computer analogy. )

This wikki is out Europe and is using their definitions:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Learning_disability

But in the US/ Canada it are defined as learning disability. They should most likely use universal operational definitions when possible or define them for research if differ. But if you examine most links on the web they will define it as LD as seen out of the US/ Canada. If you go to the US/ Canadian libraries you will not see the strong link with MR.

As I have seen misunderstandings on this site as to what LD is I am being clear and try to expand what I believe it and educate further. Like autism is is a neurological disorder. I believe I have read when they do brain scans of LD individuals they can "see" the brain working differently. Often, ironically, they excel or are gifted in certain areas. For example, I can read off the charts. I cannot be strongly evaluated as I am off the scale in reading (which I did not learn until around 8-9). When tested they have very highs and lows which is part of the definition too of ld I believe sometimes.

http://www.ldonline.org/ldbasics/whatisld

"A learning disability is a neurological disorder. In simple terms, a learning disability results from a difference in the way a person's brain is "wired." Children with learning disabilities are as smart or smarter than their peers. But they may have difficulty reading, writing, spelling, reasoning, recalling and/or organizing
information if left to figure things out by themselves or if taught in conventional ways.


Dyslexia – a language-based disability in which a person has trouble understanding written words. It may also be referred to as reading disability or reading disorder.
Dyscalculia – a mathematical disability in which a person has a difficult time solving arithmetic problems and grasping math concepts.
Dysgraphia – a writing disability in which a person finds it hard to form letters or write within a defined space.
Auditory and Visual Processing Disorders – sensory disabilities in which a person has difficulty understanding language despite normal hearing and vision.
Nonverbal Learning Disabilities – a neurological disorder which originates in the right hemisphere of the brain, causing problems with visual-spatial, intuitive, organizational, evaluative and holistic processing functions."


A learning disability can't be cured or fixed; it is a lifelong issue. With the right support and intervention, however, children with learning disabilities can succeed in school and go on to successful, often distinguished careers later in life."

Last edited by Briarsprout on 21 Oct 2013, 11:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

I just wanted to throw in a chart.

Again, the operation definition I am using...

In the US, "Learning disabilities are most often defined by describing a discrepancy between ability and performance. Children with learning disabilities are of average to above-average intelligence (or IQ), but performance assessments and standardized tests indicate that their classroom achievement fails to match their evident ability. Because learning disabilities relate specifically to classroom performance, they are rarely identified before a child enters school and confronts academic instruction."

Or as someone else defined it as:

"If there's at least one standard deviation's difference between your verbal and performance IQs, that should be dxed as a Learning Disability, in the IQ > 70 sense used in the US. That should not be termed borderline MR to my understanding."

When one is using the US definitions. So 70 - 100 is within normal range of human experience.

That being said, the IQ test is not a good indicator of success or achievement in my opinion.

As to people having Aspergers and LD in conjunction I believe yes under the US/Canadian definitions.

Read:
http://www.amazon.com/Asperger-Syndrome ... 184310895X

This author was diagnosed as having LD first and Aspergers later in 20s I believe. I also recommend this book, as an aside, too. It really helped me.

Also, btw, he is studying for his PHD.

No, but it can be a useful tool in helping to identify a (US definition) learning disability, even beyond using VIQ v. PIQ, but even the subtests can be used as indicative. In the case of an LD, the full scale IQ is probably not exceedingly useful as a predictive means of intelligence and academic/career success.

But then what numerical score ever is?

This is why I stated within normal experience and not normal standardized deviations for clarification.

I personally do not hold much weight with IQ test either or it indicators of achievement. Also, there are different types of intelligence such as social intelligence etc and as you note. People with a higher level of social intelligence do in fact tend to be successful achievers, within business etc, from what I read, interestingly.

DSM V definition of learning disabilities for those who are interested (North America specific).

http://www.ldworldwide.org/educators/st ... insistence