Do you think being logical makes it seem like you don't care

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lostinlove
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15 Feb 2015, 5:12 am

Do you think being logical makes it seem like you don't care?

I can best describe this in an example. Me and my ex have had a very on and off relationship and I think many problems have been caused by my Aspergers traits and the fact that he doesn't believe I have AS. I have always said that I will not chase him and if he says he doesn't want to be with me then that is the last he will hear of me. His ex always chased him even though he told her that he didn't want her and I just don't see the point in this. He finished with me on wednesday and after initially pushing him when he split up with me on the phone (I wanted to make sure he really meant it as he has split up from me before and changed his mind) he said that I did't make him happy and he thought that he didn't make me happy (which is untrue) The next day I messaged to say that as I don't make him happy and that I want him to be happy, it is an easy thing for me to never see him again. Is this the point at which 'normal' people chase to prove that they loved them all along? I'm wondering if I just made it look like I never cared?

Also he says that I play games, an example is that when the relationship was starting to fall apart, but the sex was still good I asked if maybe we should stop being together and just meet up for sex. That seems quite logical to me as that is how the relationship started and that was the only bit we were still both enjoying. He said I was playing games by asking him that.
I do need to point out that I do love him and if he wanted to be with me then I would do anything I could to be with him, but there is absolutely no point in pursuing someone who is not interested.

Has anyone had any similar incidents? or maybe some non relationship ones?



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15 Feb 2015, 5:22 am

That guy has issues. Asking you to have casual sex with him and then accusing you of playing games? This guy is not worth your time.



lostinlove
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15 Feb 2015, 5:32 am

It started as casual sex 18 months ago, but had two periods of being a couple for 6 months each. Yeah I admit that he probably has his issues, but I'm really concerned with my behaviour, I still think that I care about people, but how I go about things and word things might make it seem like I don't.



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15 Feb 2015, 6:18 am

I think you can care too much about caring. I used to.

Relationships to me were always on or off.

Don't like to say this but why did you text him the next day?

He had already said you don't make him happy so why would he want to see you again?

Why even bother about what his ex used to do?

'Normal' people don't have a need to prove their love after the relationship has finished.

'Normal' people don't suggest casual sex after a break-up, they go get pissed and find a one-night stand

I learned eventually that to have expectations of any relationship beyond fidelity was wrong.

Like I said, you can get lost in the caring, it helps to set your own parameters and ask yourself if there are ulterior motives for wanting to be in a relationship so badly.



guzzle
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15 Feb 2015, 6:21 am

MindBlind wrote:
That guy has issues. Asking you to have casual sex with him and then accusing you of playing games? This guy is not worth your time.


Read that bit again, OP was the one suggesting casual sex as the relationship was falling apart :|
Quote:
lostinlove
an example is that when the relationship was starting to fall apart, but the sex was still good I asked if maybe we should stop being together and just meet up for sex.



lostinlove
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15 Feb 2015, 6:35 am

I text him because when we had spoken on the phone and I couldn't get my words out properly, plus he owes me money from booking an event which I need back in order to book myself.
I agree, at the point that he said that I didn't make him happy I said that I wouldn't see him again, but he has a habit of changing his mind on this subject and this is what I don't understand.
I bother about what his ex used to and still does because she assaulted me in her pursuit to get him back.
TBH I don't think I want to be in a relationship badly, the whole thing is really stressful, however the time we spent together was enjoyable.

BUT these are side points, in essence I suppose what I've been getting at is that I can bluntly state my intentions and this is not always very well received in the way it is intended.



lostinlove
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15 Feb 2015, 9:18 am

Another example: If something bad happens in my life, ( e.g. fall out with someone, something requires mending leaving me with no cash, losing something etc) I may initially get overly upset, but then very quickly move on to something else, for example get immersed in a special interest. I don't see the point in wasting the energy getting upset with something I can't change and so try and put that energy into something else, but sometimes I think that maybe it looks like I was never that bothered about the thing in the first place, which is untrue.


I think I am struggling to get across my original point because I seem to have got bogged down in the intricate details of the situation I chose as an example :(



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15 Feb 2015, 9:36 am

For me, being logical leads to a degree of certainty that others seem to find intimidating. While I like knowing what is really going on, others seem to like filling the gaps in their knowledge with their own beliefs ("God did it") or with their darkest fears and prejudices ("It's a conspiracy lead by the One-Percenters to keep the rest of us as slaves").

Finding out that the city-wide power outage was actually caused by a squirrel shorting out a pair of high-voltage lines seemed to disturb those who had already made up their minds - they seem to find reality insulting.


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lostinlove
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15 Feb 2015, 1:15 pm

Fnord wrote:
For me, being logical leads to a degree of certainty that others seem to find intimidating. While I like knowing what is really going on, others seem to like filling the gaps in their knowledge with their own beliefs ("God did it") or with their darkest fears and prejudices ("It's a conspiracy lead by the One-Percenters to keep the rest of us as slaves").

Finding out that the city-wide power outage was actually caused by a squirrel shorting out a pair of high-voltage lines seemed to disturb those who had already made up their minds - they seem to find reality insulting.


Yes I think that true, I like to know with certainty what is going on. My work friends have noticed this and say that I see things as black or white (or on or off). I suppose people can find that certainty intimidating, I can see that people like to hang on to the possibility of something occurring (like the ex in my original post) when I would just like to either way know what is happening. Maybe that is the real issue with me, that I am stressed by the uncertainty.

Haha! A squirrel shorting out the lines! I like it when things actually have a simple conclusion like that, makes much sense than the conspiracies people make up.



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15 Feb 2015, 1:29 pm

lostinlove wrote:
Do you think being logical makes it seem like you don't care?

I can best describe this in an example. Me and my ex have had a very on and off relationship and I think many problems have been caused by my Aspergers traits and the fact that he doesn't believe I have AS. I have always said that I will not chase him and if he says he doesn't want to be with me then that is the last he will hear of me. His ex always chased him even though he told her that he didn't want her and I just don't see the point in this. He finished with me on wednesday and after initially pushing him when he split up with me on the phone (I wanted to make sure he really meant it as he has split up from me before and changed his mind) he said that I did't make him happy and he thought that he didn't make me happy (which is untrue) The next day I messaged to say that as I don't make him happy and that I want him to be happy, it is an easy thing for me to never see him again. Is this the point at which 'normal' people chase to prove that they loved them all along? I'm wondering if I just made it look like I never cared?

Also he says that I play games, an example is that when the relationship was starting to fall apart, but the sex was still good I asked if maybe we should stop being together and just meet up for sex. That seems quite logical to me as that is how the relationship started and that was the only bit we were still both enjoying. He said I was playing games by asking him that.
I do need to point out that I do love him and if he wanted to be with me then I would do anything I could to be with him, but there is absolutely no point in pursuing someone who is not interested.

Has anyone had any similar incidents? or maybe some non relationship ones?




Both of mine thought i was playing games but I think it's a misscommunication between the two. There is projection involved too.

Imagine a scenario where an autistic woman loves to be held or rubbed. She likes the tightness and the softness on her in certain spots when she is rubbed. She gets into a relationship with a guy and he does all these things to her and she moans and enjoys it. The man reads that as her wanting to have sex and getting all sexual so he waits for her to make the move to have sex with him but she never does. The man ends up with blue balls and this "game" keeps continuing and he starts to get frustrated with the "game" she keeps playing.

Apparently liking being rubbed and held is a indication for sex. No wonder autistic women are more vulnerable and why they may be accused of playing games. This is what I always did with my ex's and my second one learned this does not mean I want sex while the first one refused to figure it out and I had no idea I tortured him unintentionally. Luckily he never laid a hand on me because the last thing he wanted was to be accused of rape so he was cautious. There should be more men like that. Wow, I finally had something nice to say about my ex whoo hoo. (Not sarcasm)


I am not sure how it was a "game" when you wanted to break up but still see him for sex. But I have noticed a pattern with one of my e'x's that anything he didn't like, he called it a game. Perhaps your ex didn't like what you asked so he called it a game which makes no sense to me. Why do some people call it a game when they don't like what was said to them or what someone is doing?


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lostinlove
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15 Feb 2015, 2:59 pm

League_Girl wrote:

Both of mine thought i was playing games but I think it's a misscommunication between the two. There is projection involved too.

Imagine a scenario where an autistic woman loves to be held or rubbed. She likes the tightness and the softness on her in certain spots when she is rubbed. She gets into a relationship with a guy and he does all these things to her and she moans and enjoys it. The man reads that as her wanting to have sex and getting all sexual so he waits for her to make the move to have sex with him but she never does. The man ends up with blue balls and this "game" keeps continuing and he starts to get frustrated with the "game" she keeps playing.

Apparently liking being rubbed and held is a indication for sex. No wonder autistic women are more vulnerable and why they may be accused of playing games. This is what I always did with my ex's and my second one learned this does not mean I want sex while the first one refused to figure it out and I had no idea I tortured him unintentionally. Luckily he never laid a hand on me because the last thing he wanted was to be accused of rape so he was cautious. There should be more men like that. Wow, I finally had something nice to say about my ex whoo hoo. (Not sarcasm)


I am not sure how it was a "game" when you wanted to break up but still see him for sex. But I have noticed a pattern with one of my e'x's that anything he didn't like, he called it a game. Perhaps your ex didn't like what you asked so he called it a game which makes no sense to me. Why do some people call it a game when they don't like what was said to them or what someone is doing?


I failed to see how it was a game as I thought I was being logical, that was the only part we still both enjoyed, therefore why not continue it? someone suggested a one night stand, but as I have issues around people touching me that's not really an option.

I totally get where you are coming from with the being rubbed and held thing, I see it as meeting a need separate to sex, but still being sexual for me, however with my ex I didn't mind if it ended up with us having sex as I got what I needed from the whole thing if he stroked me first. His sex drive was much lower than mine and he would just hold and stroke me if that's what I wanted and he wasn't in the mood for sex. Though I could totally see that it would be a problem if you didn't want or enjoy sex and I have to admit that there has been a few times where it did lead to sex and I wasn't intending it to...



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16 Feb 2015, 8:01 am

I've been told at work before that I'm rude. While for me, I try my utmost to be polite and considerate. Yet they say I'm rude? wow. I never saw that coming.



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16 Feb 2015, 8:14 am

GregCav wrote:
I've been told at work before that I'm rude. While for me, I try my utmost to be polite and considerate. Yet they say I'm rude? wow. I never saw that coming.


Maybe it comes down to body language and not what you say/do?



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16 Feb 2015, 8:50 am

Logston wrote:
GregCav wrote:
I've been told at work before that I'm rude. While for me, I try my utmost to be polite and considerate. Yet they say I'm rude? wow. I never saw that coming.


Maybe it comes down to body language and not what you say/do?


I think it has more to do with the "filling the gaps" that Fnord was describing and the strange reality that most people lie almost continuously about almost everything and expect you to lie too. When you say something logical and straightforward, they conclude that you must mean something else and then "fill in the gaps" with bizarre fantasy. This is the situation when you get accused of "playing games" for being very direct and straightforward.

I have tried to deal with this by keeping my thoughts to myself as default reaction, but when you have to express yourself (as in the OP's case) it is really hard, because honesty is almost never believed. I wish I knew how to do that sort of conversation better, but I have had the same kind of miscommunication and I have no idea how to avoid it.



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16 Feb 2015, 8:53 am

I echo this. It's almost like people need scapegoats. Nonsense to me!