Are you poor?

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I'm quite poor, since I'm on public assistance b/c the city doesn't think I can work. Still waiting for my SSI appeal to get a hearing. It takes a long damn time.

I'm somewhere between poor and middle class. I view myself as being working class.

I think there's a difference between whether you are poor in terms of comparative income for your country vs whether you feel poor. I am poor, though not the poorest, in comparative terms, but I'm not champing at the bit for material possessions.

I think attitude of mind dictates whether you feel poor as opposed to whether you are objectively poor.

Class-whise, I'm upper working class or lower middle class. Income-whise I'm in a fairly low bracket (working 75%, partial disability pension), but I'm a one-man household and I'm very good with money. I sometimes feel I'm living above my means, but I own my 3-room apartment and I've been doing good for the 6 years I've been living on my own.

I think the official definition of rich comes from putting together the value (market value, not sentimental one!) of things the person owns after they reduce the amount of debt they have from it.

Like, let's say your debts are 10 000 for examble. You make 1000/month, most of it going on living expenses, so you pay the debt very slowly. However, you also collect paintings and some of them are valuable and their value is still raising. Like, let's say you had one that was worth 5000, another that was 16 000, third that was... 35 000. If you'd sell all these, you'd get 56 000, which is a good amount of money. Even if you paid off your debt, you'd still have 46 000 left. I don't know what it is that you collect, but if it's something that's value has risen over the years and you could easily sell it for a good price, then it's understandable if people consider you rich.

Of course, it's also possible that they think you're rich since you can afford to buy stuff that you want but don't necessarily need... personally I wouldn't call it a sign of someone being rich, but it is a sign that you're better off than many others who struggle to pay for the food and meds they need.



No kidding. Here in Finland you can often hear "ei ne suuret tulot, vaan ne pienet menot." Which means "not the big income, but the small expenses." Sometimes those who earn less can actually travel more and do other stuff they like because they keep their daily expenses under control so much better than some who earn well.

South Sudan is the poorest country, and poverty there means basically starving. In the us it means not having much luxuries. Only a small miniority is extreme poor in the us.

Time to explore my interests and frolic in the countryside, minimal responsibilities (= less stress), couple of bashed up musical instruments, small bunch of faithful friends, internet access at home, clunky (but good enough) old PC, privacy when I need it, etc. = I'm rich.

Bank account, home-owner, car, foreign vacations, flashy clothes, latest phone, wild partying, TV, credit cards, etc. = I'm (relative to most of my peers) poor (currently receiving disability benefits).

Overall = I'm rich (and damn the depressive bit of my brain that tries to convince me otherwise.)

I'm a graduate student, and my stipend pays 30,000 a year. That places me solidly in the second quintile (20-40%tile) of american society, but I don't feel poor. Probably because I'm a single guy providing only for myself and not trying to raise a family of 4.

No...
I was lucky...

I was intermittently homeless from ages 19 to about 21. As for employment, I've been a full time entomologist since about age 23, and so I have not had a problem with homelessness since. Until the age of 31, I was "very low income" (26th percentile). Although, with my most recent job change two years ago I more than doubled my pay and finally escaped that. Right now I make more than the average income for a single person in the USA (61st percentile). For the first time in my life I feel like I can breathe a little. The best part to me is being able to afford better food. It's a good feeling. Although technically my household income is still less than average, since I live alone. This week I interviewed for a job that would be a 60% raise from what I am currently earning (which would have put me in the 80th percentile). I don't think I got it, but just the fact that I made it that far is so much more in life than anyone ever expected of me (including myself). I feel confident in my role in society these days. People seem to value my contributions. That's a big change from how I felt 10 years ago.

I think a big factor in how income for people on the spectrum translates to homelessness is the support group. First of all, whether or not a person has a support group is important. Second, the relative wealth of that support group is another important factor. I was lucky to have a pretty great family, but part of why I ended up homeless for a little while was that we were all actually homeless and without employment at the same time.

A holdover from my mentality in those days is that I always make sure to have a car, even if it is a terrible one. I figure if worse comes to worst, I am well practiced at living out of a vehicle. It feels like a safety net.

I call it Voluntary Simplicity. I try to live on a sustainable input, and manage to do it on an average level for the world. In Canada, this is called poverty. My AS mother was astonished to learn that she was living in poverty - she was still doing everything she wanted, and had been considered rich as a girl.
I spent most of my life either studying or trying to start a business from nothing, so I kept expenses down for that as well. Learning to live on little money takes away the harsh edges of poverty. I usually managed to buy at bulk rates, and find a great deal on rent. I fix buildings and household goods. I used a bicycle for everything, even vacations until a business required a car. Using it landed me in a place where I need it now, but the rooms are cheap, yet I seldom need to drive. It only costs $200 pa for parts and depreciation, because all the glamour has worn off. I was surprised to learn that there is a strong pecking order among car owners, to their NT minds.
One thing I have never owned is a TV. Even listening to a radio, I noticed that even though I never considered the products advertised, all the ads start out telling me that I'm not happy without them, and the effect is insidious. I avoid heavily advertised products. I notice that the staples I buy to eat never go on sale or get promoted, because they are good value.
Don't fall for the standards of the TV people - there will always be far richer people in material goods. To feel wealthy, live within your means and help others.

I wouldn't consider myself poor. I'm working class. I work full-time and my wage is close to minimum wage, but I've managed to save over $5,000 in the 12 months I've been working. I do live at home but I'm keeping a close watch on the rental properties in my area, waiting to find a place that's ideal and affordable to move to.

I am kinda poor. I have a part time job but it doesnt even cover my bills. So I'm dependent on my parents.

I get those points, but at what actual amount do you become “rich”? It seems to be greatly dependent upon the person making the determination. I would prefer a more concrete answer than that.

Some of the things that I have collected over the past thirty years have greatly increased in value, some have not. If I sold everything right now, I would be in the black (positive amount) with all debts paid. However, some of that is to be used for retirement funds, so cashing out now would put me at a net loss over a long period of time. My family have been pressuring me for years to stop collecting “old junk”, as they see no value in what I enjoy.

I have a few things that I need to have authenticated. I bought them on the cheap expecting them to be fakes, but some knowledgeable people that have seen them said that they are likely the real deal. I still value them in my head as fakes until proven wrong. If any of them are real, I would likely have to sell them because I could not afford to insure them.

I don't think there is a concrete answer; it depends too much on individuals and how they view things... I would consider myself very well off if I earned what my half sister does (around 2000 euros after taxes), yet she always complains about how little she makes. And she has a partner to share the household expenses with her, too.

A recent study in the US found that beyond $70,000 pa, money could not buy any more happiness. Richer people live increasingly isolated lives, trying to avoid the rest of us. We just get snapshots of their best times, and try to imitate that instead of enjoying what we have.

One time, a King was often distracted by the sounds of a poor man who had a shack set against the palace wall. He had many friends, and he would entertain them with singing and joking. The King almost never felt that happy, and asked the Seneschal what he might do about the man without seeming cruel.
"Just give me 99 silver coins, and I'll take care of it" the courtier replied.
He took the bag of coins, and left it for the poor man to find when he woke up.
Sure enough, he was really happy to find the money, but he wanted to make it an even hundred. So, he went to work that day, and never partied again.

That said, living with a reserve one is willing to spend is much less stressful than being one payment ahead of life on the street. Having lived on very little, I know I can do it again. I am expecting the numbers of refugees from climate disasters and wars to increase for years, so even if I don't have to move again, my neighbourhood will change around me.

"In the community regulated only by laws of demands and supply, but protected from open violence, the persons who become RICH are, generally speaking, industrious, resolute, proud, covetous, prompt, methodical, sensible, unimaginative, insensitive, and ignorant. The persons who remain POOR are the entirely foolish, the entirely wise, the idle, the reckless, the humble, the thoughtful, the dull, the imaginative, the sensitive, the well-informed, the improvident, the irregularly and impulsively wicked, the clumsy knave, the open thief, and the entirely merciful, just, and godly person." John Ruskin, 1862