How people "argue" with you

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Often, it seems, I find myself in an "argument" when I thought I was merely reasoning or explaining my point of view in a logical manner. I say "argument" in quotes as these "arguments" usually start with one or two of my family members (the same one or two every time) misunderstanding/assuming what I've said/done, I have fumbled/said the wrong words, or I simply stated an opinion that differs from their's while stating that I respect their opinion, but I don't agree. Then I have to explain what really happened or what I really meant. Very quickly they get angry and just stick with their original thought no matter what I say or they believe that I meant what I said even when I try to explain what I actually meant.

The one family member resorts to ad hominem and says my physical health issues are "stupid" even when the subject had absolutely nothing to do with health. They both tell me to "just drop it" or "you never let things go". This usually comes as a slap in the face as I realise they think I've been arguing with them. Before that's said I'm calmly trying to explain, after I'm furious on the inside and hurt that they won't even give me the benefit of the doubt and let me explain. So I do what they want and stop talking because if I don't I'll cry, and I'm horrible about emotion which just makes them all the more angry with me and they tell me I'm being ridiculous.

To make everything worse its usually some incredibly random insignificant issue, though they act like I just murdered their favorite pet. Which is why I try to explain in the first place: most people wouldn't get angry (at least it seems extremely illogical that they would) and I realise too late that they are actually upset by it and that I shouldn't have even spoken in the first place. For example, I said someone "pushed me over" and quickly tried to say I meant "bumped me and that pushed my body over to the other direction". But they said, "but you said pushed, they never pushed you! You're exaggerating, don't try to deny it!" And after calmly explaining again and letting them know I don't even care, I was just explaining what happened, they get all upset and tell me I never let things go. Then, bang! I'm thoroughly confused as to why they are reacting this way. There a lot of other examples that become something out of a trivial matter, even one's where I obviously state its my opinion and I respect their opinion and that I may be wrong, but somehow I've still offended them or was "arguing" because they said the shoes were green and I thought that perhaps they were really blue. (Not a real event but there have been many just as ridiculous as that.)

I am tired of being silenced, talked over, and ignored. I listen to them talk about gossip and things I don't care about at all but often, they don't give me the same courtesy. I really wish that I could just be quiet and not speak to them but I can't bring it upon myself to be rude. Honestly, I am just so tired of people telling me I should talk more and to share opninions only to be told to shut up...

I'm sorry its so long and pretty much a block of text! I tried to keep it short, but it seems I was unsuccessful.

Parents do that.

They brow beat you, and spend money on therapists to cure you because "YOU ARE UNABLE TO DO X!! !! !! !" .

And then on alternate days, they brow beat you, and imply that you're a sicko, because...."YOU CAN"T STOP YOURSELF FROM DOING X!! !! !! !![the same X you are supposedly unable to do].".

Or my parents did anyway.


But its a two way street. If you never speak, but then when you DO speak you have no filter and innocently say rude things then I might act the contradictory way the people around you act.

Or even if you dont say obscene rude things you may not know subtle things like...to say "Are you SURE it was a green shoe? Coulda sworn it was a blue shoe" in a submissive respectful voice. Instead of saying "I know for a fact that it was a blue shoe" in a tone that sounds like you're issuing a Papal Bull.

Maybe thats the issue. Or maybe its not.

But I suspect that there is some subtle thing that you do when speaking that ticks people off when you dont mean to tick people off that you need to work on.

It hard for us on the web to judge.

Must ask what they mean by that when they do.

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I think there's something you're misunderstanding.
When you listen to their s**t gossip, it's not a two-sided thing, unfortunately.
As in: They may know that you don't care, BUT you don't get anything for self-sarcificing and listening to their s**t.
It doesn't work that way.
It's the power of the majority.
And if the majority decides that it's gossip time, then that's what's gonna happen -- full stop.
If majority doesn't care about the subject matter, it's on to the next topic.
You don't get talk-whatever-you-want-"rights" for enduring it.

I completely understand, I've been dealing with this breed of irrational people for far too long. They sure do love their logical fallacies, don't they? I usually have to remind myself to not try reasoning with them, because it's a losing battle. So I avoid them whenever possible. Of course, some are immediate family members, so this isn't always feasible. With people that can't be avoided I speak as little as possible and I analyze what I am about to say before letting it out of my mouth.

Slightly off topic note: I see from your signature that you are also an INTJ . Greetings, fellow logical female!

Thank you for sharing. I think most of us can relate, to a greater or lesser degree. Arguments are always emotional things, which maked them very difficult to understand at all, beyond understanding that somebody is mad. I often find that people aren't even mad at the person they are arguing with -- it merely serves as a proxy, for emotional release. I'm sorry you are having such a tough time.

I experience this too, but it is either because I am uncharacteristically nervous and when I'm nervous I tend to chatter to try and compensate for it, and since I have to chatter about something, I will often check and double check instructions, then make sure if can't be done some other way, or make sure I understand why it can't and what will be the consequences if I don't do it in the specified way, etc.
That or I am trying to understand every angle of a situation to maximize benefit, so someone gives me an instruction and I clarify everything about the instruction to make certain I understand completely and comprehensively so I can do my upmost best to perform it properly.
Then I get told to "stop arguing and just do it." As if I'm meant to obey immediately and without question or comment. I don't care who gives me this attitude, whether or not they believe themselves superior to me or not, I consider it basically disrespectful and will tell the person (very respectfully in turn) if they want to continue communicating with me, it is not going to be in a disrespectful manner to either of us. There is nothing wrong with communicating that clearly and simply making sure everyone understands that it is not argument, it is a difference in communication styles, and everyone has to accommodate each other for things to go smoothly, it is not just up to you to conform to their styles.

I noticed that many people around me feel hurt when i disagree on a given subject. Then they put themselve in a defensive or aggressive attitude.

It is as if their opinion and the subject discussed is only one thing. Then, they feel you are attacking them if you have another opinion. They also think that if you have another opinion, it means that you don't like them, that you are their enemy, which triggers high emotional reactions and less ability to analyse your point of view and present theirs on base of logic.

When you present a different opinion, maybee, like me, you are discussing the subject only, not willing to attack the person.

I don't know well how to do, to present my different opinion, without the other person feeling attacked. Sometimes, i am saying things i really appreciate with this person, recognise the person's qualities, in the middle of the presentation of my opinion. This often works very well, but not always...

When you disagree with someone, you are challenging their place in the social hierarchy. If they are used to being above you, they won't take it well.

Right or wrong is irrelevant, it's all based on who's in charge.

I think it is also true, i think you have a good point, there is a hierarchic stake in social relationships, which is the base of a power game.

The thing is, if you are discreet and modest, most of people consider that they are standing above you on a conceptual hierarchic scale.
What is on the top of this scale? Money? Physical beauty? Talent?

On the other hand, if it is the case of well-established hierarchy (at work, or in a family - parents/children), I think that seing the relationship in a hierarchic way, is always a loss of efficiency, a loss of creativity:

When someone, standing higher on the hierarchic scale, considers that standing higher, any other opinion is a threat for his/her hierarchic position, and then is closed to the other's opinions;
The result is that people on a lower level fear presenting new ideas, it prevents from joining freely ideas and experiences (which could otherwise bring up well-thought and well informed original solutions, organization and decisions).

This is the cause of a lot of people grumbling about office politics, etc.. However, it's important to note that the hierarchy is extremely efficient from the point of view of the people at the top: they get what they want with a minimum of effort.

Also, these hierarchies can become ends in themselves. Many people simply don't care about other things as much.

I have worked in some very competitive companies where managers and directors were systematically asking opinion and experience of people "below" to ensure that their decisions would make sense in practice, before implementing them.

Everyone who's replied has had some pretty good points that I could do well to remember.

They also love double standards (though that is an entirely different topic...) Both people I usually have this problem with are immediate family, so I really need to remember to remind myself to not try to reason with them. Two of my other family members think similarly to me and I can reason with them in a way that actually makes sense, I think that's why I forget not to try with the other two.

Greetings to you as well! I like your choice of avatar



I do this all the time! Often in the form of questions. I like to make sure I understand the instructions I'm receiving perfectly. I also then get told to "stop arguing and just do it" or they'll say to get on with it and not to over analyze it.

There is power of majority.
There is also power of Truth.

It is indeed useless to prove a liar that he/she is lying.
But i find it important to shed a light on the Truth, when people are attending your conversation, and could not see the lies.

Last edited by LaetiBlabla on 17 Jan 2016, 7:25 am, edited 2 times in total.

I am confused. Do you want to learn how to communicate better?

Body language and facial expressions can change the tone of your conversations. With practice, you may be able to communicate better and avoid all the unnecessary anger.

Try nodding your head, yes, and agreeing. Then, elaborate on your concern or opinion. It usually works for me.

They like to make me out to be the fool by insulting my intelligence. I try to avoid arguments at all costs.

I'm going to have to echo this for several reasons:

What is your presentation? I always thought I was being calm and rational. Turns out, what I tried to put out, came out all wonky and mix that with the body language and facial expressions that are out forth, well, maybe 'they' are not as much at fault as I once thought.

I don't agree that it's all our fault either. As for double standards, doesn't everybody? Most are things people are unaware of just like how you are presenting yourself.

I have trouble with that all the time. I would rather learn how the world works and join it rather than sit back and complain.

Venting is also good, but it can get to where it's useless and can become it's own crutch.

I too want to pin down the logic of anything. I don't have to be right. But me being wrong doesn't make the other person right either. And, I am usually arguing the logic and not with the person. But, that can be an alien concept to many people. Couple that with the body language and other issues, it can be perceived as arguing. Also, the ability to let things go (and I am the worst about this) draws the line between informed debate and arguing.