Cause of social issues - your experience?

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Hi all!

Most of us have some type of problems on the social scene, but there are many possible reasons why social situations are challenging for autistic people! I'm really interested to hear about what your own personal experiences are.

For example, I personally find social cues very intense and overwhelming, I get exhausted in loud or messy environments, have trouble with new environments, and misinterpret NT people's words because I take them too literally. All these things cause social problems, but have nothing to do with a lack of empathy!! In fact, I feel a lot of love and loyalty for others, but I just can't always execute the behaviors that show it.

So aspies out there -- what do you think the roots are of your social challenges? What are your social strenghts? We are all unique! Can we capture the diversity in this thread? Do the poll if you feel like it

Thankful for input!

Love,
E

I just have no interest in things people talk about. I don't know how to join in or how to start a conversation. People have to come to me first and then I have to know when I should stop talking so I don't ramble on. I do fine with one and one but in big groups I have troubles. Plus I get anxious because I don't know how to act so I keep to myself. Also I try to not interrupt. I don't think my lack of eye contact affects me because no one seems to care about it so I am sure that comes off as shyness. Plus I don't want to ask any personal questions. Plus I can talk loud.

For me, part anxiety and part 'wanting deeper conversation'.

I have to script what I say to avoid saying something stupid. Often this is hours, days or weeks in advance, but often with friends (when I'm supposedly more relaxed) I have to script in the seconds before I say something because the conversation is natural and it's less likely to be small talk.

What I want is deep conversation on a topic, so that we can really get into the conversation and share our thoughts and opinions, but what I tend to get is conversation that flits from one topic to the next. People are always moving on and my scripting can't keep up. Often, this results in me jumping in and cutting the conversation off because I feel like I need to complete what I was saying before we move on, but this can mean me talking about something that everyone else has finished talking about or it can mean literally jumping in when someone else is saying something. I also struggle because I'll often repeat myself, and I think that's for the same reason - my mind is on a conversation and I need to see it through, and if it feels like the conversation's moving on I tend to bring up the same sentence again in order to try and steer it back. Both the jumping in and the repetition, I'm aware of after they've happened. I almost immediately realise, often because of the look of shock on the other person's face, but I can't stop it from happening if I intend to actually speak to people. I guess I could stop talking completely, and therefore stop scripting, but I'd imagine a conversation in which I didn't talk at all would be just as weird for whoever I was talking to.

In scripted conversations that have been planned in advance, I'm better until things stray from what I've planned, but still not perfect.

I see my talking as this:

There is an extremely eloquent, thoughtful and well-spoken person inside me. My mind is that person. However, somewhere between my mind and my mouth there is a large brick wall with small holes in it. No matter what my mind has thought up and how many wonderfully interesting sentences are in there, when they move to the wall a majority of the words get stuck and only a few filter through. Every sentence that makes it out of my mouth is likely to contain far fewer words than it was supposed to, and will be all clumsy and damaged, often stammered out a little or with lots of 'erm' and 'uh' added...and sometimes, those words take so long getting through the holes in the wall that they're already too late for their place in the conversation and end up just being said anyway.

Nice analyses! So for both of you it is to a large extent about the interface between you and the others (in addition to the anxiety). That it's challenging to continuously update the erratic, unpredictable input from the other party and adapt the 'output' dynamically. And whatever comes out, comes out in a suboptimal or reorganized way, or at the wrong time or with the wrong tone of voice.

Do you feel that this is an issue of speed of processing rather than actual ability - that you can do a whole lot better with just a little bit more time to think in conversations? I greatly prefer written communication for that precise reason... and I just can't seem to both listen and form my responses at the same time, unless the topic is very familiar and I'm not stressed.

But then there's also the rigidity/logic that ArielsSong describes - that people are so irrational and jump all over the place. I have that too, get confused all the time. Sometimes I think they change the topic because I said something wrong, but often that's probably just that their flexible brain made an association and forgot the topic.

I'm guessing that the anxiety levels might have been much better if our communication style was better understood by others, and we'd gotten more help to navigate the neurotypical world at an early age (and if perhaps neurotypical could navigate the autistic world!). Now many of us have a life-time full of social failures that colors every interaction - hard to get over even though we can keep trying!

I think your comment about the speed of processing is an interesting one. I am so much better at communicating online because I am working on my pace and at my own terms...but, I do write very quickly online. It's as though when I'm typing, my brain and my hands link perfectly - I don't need the extra time to process anything because my hands immediately get the message from my brain, like the wall isn't even there. When I'm talking, that just doesn't happen. All that said, when I discovered that I might be autistic I did wonder if I could make my 'inner voice' get through by slowing down and thinking for longer before speaking, then somehow working through each word that's in my head until they're all out of my mouth. I haven't found a way to try this out, because I guess that involves a long silence after someone else has asked a question until I'm ready to reply, and socially that's just not going to work.

Yes, I often wonder why topics change as well. I think we're talking about something interesting and really getting down to the more in-depth conversation, where the value lies, and suddenly people are talking about something else and back to the shallow 'top layer'. As soon as things get more serious again, they move on.

And yes, lifelong social failures play a huge part. On top of whatever struggles you naturally have, every conversation becomes a terrifying mess when you've spent your entire life failing socially. Even the ones that end up going well are tainted by 'what if they're now making fun of me with someone else?'.

This is why I do love online conversation so much, in forums like this. I can pick a topic of my choice, get my thoughts out, and often people go into detail (like this) rather than stopping at the top layer of any conversation.

When we are alone with a keyboard and screen the whole context is so much simpler. There is basically nothing else in the situation that needs to be interpreted/evaluated, except for our own thoughts and the content of the conversation. And there is no need to coordinate behaviors such as facial expressions and timely smiles and body language. That frees up a lot of brainpower. It's social interaction distilled to a bare minimum -- but this bare minimum is like the golden core of conversation I think, the actual content! I know they say that non-verbal cues make up a huge part of communication, but I'd say if both parties stick to the topic and don't use between-the-lines communication, then writing is totally sufficient, because words are powerful. Like you, I find that in any situation, I function better if I'm in control of the pace of things. I think this is why writing is so fluent but conversing is not. I still have the problem that my writing gets misinterpreted by neurotypical people though! With real interactions, I did manage to get a little bit better by working on getting more relaxed (yoga, rest, etc), because then I have more energy to process things faster, but in real life I'm usually not relaxed/focused enough to really succeed

Regarding the difficulties that neurotypical people have with staying on topic... I think we really are different in the sense that we're really good at being hyperfocused, zooming in onto something and digging deep. That's not something that 'normal' people do well. On the upside for them, they're better at navigating complex environments/situations where the ability to generalize and switch attention is very useful.

My social challenges are rather complex. They're more like social anxiety symptoms and general shyness, and maybe a few minor oddities about me thrown in, which all mixed together makes me more socially awkward than you'd think. I may be able to instictively read body language and stuff, but that still doesn't make me 100% socially skilled.

I'm on my break at the moment, so I will post again later to go more into what social issues affect me.

Ok, the options above weren't really good at describing what I feel in particular, but I chose what matched the closest.

I would say that one major problem is processing speed. I am not able to "in the moment" figure out what others are trying to say, analyze their body language, analyze things which are going on in the room, and figure out the proper response. Now I probably shouldn't have to think so hard about what others are saying, or what body language means, or what is appropriate to say next. Processing speed shouldn't be that much of an issue. But even with normal social abilities, I think I would still be a little lost at times.

Another problem is general lack of social understanding. I don't get things. I know generally what things are appropriate and expected. I have good manners. I am not completely ignorant. But I often miss the point of what others are saying when it's implied. People say things, and I have to try to interpret what it is that they are trying to ask me, or what point that they are trying to make. So I respond inappropriately. I also, up until just a few months ago, did not know the purpose of small talk, did not know how to make small talk, and did not use it. I also did not know to ask others questions of themselves. These are pretty basic things that most NTs understand. As long as I've been alive, I never before picked up on these basic social skills.

I am also impulsive, honest, and genuine. That is not good for most social interactions. There are things that people naturally know to keep to themselves. I do not have this natural instinct; I have to remind myself constantly to just shut up. It's a lot of work, and I do not always manage to keep this in my mind as I'm conversing. I would say that part of it is poor executive functioning; that little voice in my head that should be helping me to be responsible and remind me of things is not there doing its job.

I do not make normal eye contact. I can look at people I know, but I still tend to stare off into space, especially when I am trying to listen or to talk about something which requires concentration. So it's really two parts: discomfort from eye contact, and distraction from eye contact. I think I have auditory processing problems, so that I can be easily distracted while trying to talk or listen. I won't understand what's being said, although I will hear it. I can't understand words well with background noise, either.

I could go on and on about this. It's really not one problem. It is many separate things that combine to make socializing difficult. Being interested in intellectual topics rather than typical conversation, getting distracted by things, going off on tangents, speaking too quickly, becoming overemotional, repetitive movements or "fidgeting", etc. It's all of these things and more.

Here's a list of things that make me struggle socially:-

-hyperactive behaviour (sometimes, not always), which can make me come across as annoying or odd
-inattentiveness
-not asking enough questions, so looks like I'm not interested in them. I know when to ask them something, but I just don't, one reason is because I don't always know how to word it
-can complain a lot (although not as much as I used to)
-unsure of how to do things like trying to find out gossip without coming across as nosy
-not knowing what to say to people I don't know very well
-get really shy and nervous when in authority, this is why I cannot work with the public. I often fear conflict.
-having not a monotone voice as such, but more of a weak voice, so knowing I don't always get heard makes me feel more shy
-being TOO tactful, because I worry too much about hurting other people's feelings. Believe me, this can sometimes be a nuisance to my social life, especially being afraid of declining (saying no), but I'm fully aware that this will lead to being took advantage of
-I don't like certain expressions, like people going "sssshhhh", so sometimes I go a bit too quiet if I know I might be shushed for whatever reason lies in the situation at the time
-I am shy in general
-I have all symptoms of social anxiety.

See, told you my social issues are a little complex.

I didn't vote in your poll as there are not enough options.

List of my issues (in particular order);
-I have next to no concept of body language and facial expressions and all that jazz.
-I don't know how to small talk, or keep a conversation going. (If someone else carries the conversation completely then I'm okay)
-I'm really easily distracted.
-I have tics, which derail things slightly or a lot depending on what they are.
-I make next to no eye contact.
-My speech gets jumbled up a bit.
-I'm quite bad at keeping up with a conversation.
-I hear absolutely everything, so I'm usually listening to other conversations too so I get a bit distracted.
-Often I only think of something to say about something after that part of the conversation has moved on.

There's probably more but I can't think of them at the moment.

The outside world is overwhelming, noise, lights and people.

People are exhausting per se,.not interested about what they say, they mostly talk about people and esp. other people.

^ hard to focus, fatigue, headache and even nausea. Ambivalent feelings about humans.

Social cues can be overwhelming. One one interactions are better.

I wonder if that wouldn't be more spd + social inattentive add.

I still need prompting to say hello and bye in new situations (somewhat aloof) and forgetting eye contact, focused on sensory input included.

I can't get a word in edgewise. I watch the ball go back and forth and can't figure out how to say anything.

I do awkwardly get thoughts in eventually, but I seem to break the easy flow of everything when I do.

They might be doing something to coordinate all of this with their eyes, but I'm certainly not looking at anyone's eyes.

My reasons are an ever-changing mix of all of the above, but for the most part I just don't have a lot to say to people. I try to think of something and nothing really comes to mind, or else I know what I want to say but it takes me a long time to put it into words.

My sensory problems have a lot to do with it, especially my auditory processing, makes it hard to have a conversation if I can't understand what people are saying. And hard to go out and do things with other people if I can't tolerate the environment I'm in, and worse I start feeling resentful because they seem to be enjoying themselves and not understanding how miserable I feel.

I am really limited in what I can eat, and the types of restaurants I can go to, and having meals with people is a major part of socializing with them so that has a huge impact on my ability to have a social life.

Even if I am in the perfect environment though, it's just hard to have a conversation with most people because I don't relate to most of the things they talk about, and I feel like they don't relate to the things I talk about either. It can feel like having two totally different one-sided conversations where the other person just keeps making one wrong assumption after another about me and I have no idea how to correct it.

I tend to not have much relevant to say and most people generally don't care usually as a result.

I keep being misinterpreted by other people. The people that misinterpret me the most are my family due to cultural differences. I also have to be extra careful at work now if I want my job to last, due to body language issues. I'm also making a point of visiting with my family once a month instead of once a week.