Is identifying ASD culturally-dependent?

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Tripodologia
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01 Mar 2017, 7:22 am

As a yet-to-be-diagnosed adult with ASD traits, I've been wondering for a long while now about why haven't I faced the pressure and difficulties that some of you in here have had to endure throughout your life. I never quite had disruptive behaviour, neither at home nor at school, but there are some things that I've always done that seem pretty autistic and I've never been called out because of them.

For one, I've always had trouble with eye contact. Particularly when I have to use a lot of cognitive effort (when explaining something, at a meeting at work, etc.) I have the tendency to look sideways and not directly into the eyes. When I'm staring at a face, I tend to focus on the mouth. However, I've never in my life experienced the "look me in the eye!" thing.

When excited, I tend to rub my feet, clap, and repeat sentences if I find them really amusing or funny. I have never encountered any issues because of this.

I sometimes stim in public (even though I only became aware of it being stimming recently); i.e. I walk back and forth inside a room, I repeatedly pinch my lower lip, I repeatedly bounce my leg up and down, I rock sideways while standing. I have also never received any comments on this (other than people touching my leg to quiet the bouncing down because I was making them nervous, or my mother calling me off on repeatedly playing with a pen for the same reason). I also know plenty of people that do similar things, i.e. crack their knuckles, bit their nails (this is extremely common in Spain, for instance, and it kind of drives me nuts) are don't seem autistic in the slightest otherwise.

I have lived in Spain, Germany, and now Denmark. The culprit of my negative experiences due to my traits was perhaps Germany, where I was kind of trained by my ex into good behaviour and was made to feel I was very rude, and that I treated those who loved me badly (i.e. I'd experience shutdowns often). In Denmark, however, people seem super laid back and even if I exhibit these behaviours in public, they don't really seem to care.

So, I wonder, is this "socially accepted behaviours" particularly strong in i.e. USA, as compared to some places in Europe? How culturally-dependent do you think the identification of some traits as "abnormal" in people with suspected ASD is?

p.s.: I have plenty of other issues, i.e. sensory issues (very low tolerance to noise, light, and touch), anxiety, premature and elaborate speech when I was a kid, social issues, many executive function issues, etc. However, none of these seem to have been disruptive enough for those around me to suspect of anything other than me being weird.


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SaveFerris
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01 Mar 2017, 7:35 am

Tripodologia wrote:
As a yet-to-be-diagnosed adult with ASD traits, I've been wondering for a long while now about why haven't I faced the pressure and difficulties that some of you in here have had to endure throughout your life. I never quite had disruptive behaviour, neither at home nor at school, but there are some things that I've always done that seem pretty autistic and I've never been called out because of them.


I feel sort of the same way as you , I am also waiting on an assesment but compared to everyone here I faced very little pressure & difficulties throughtout my early life ( up until 19 ) , my problems only became apparent when I abused drugs.

I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that if you had a good stable background with supportive family and friends , your ASD traits might not be very apparent to anyone.


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kraftiekortie
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01 Mar 2017, 8:16 am

I find it to be "culturally-dependent," in that Asperger's/autistic-type behaviors, especially of the "high-functioning" variety, are often attributed to "being spoiled/being a brat" or "being a brain" in many "third-world" type countries.

And even amongst many people in "first world" countries who have "old-fashioned" notions pertaining to peoples' behaviors.



Tripodologia
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01 Mar 2017, 8:35 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
I find it to be "culturally-dependent," in that Asperger's/autistic-type behaviors, especially of the "high-functioning" variety, are often attributed to "being spoiled/being a brat" or "being a brain" in many "third-world" type countries.

And even amongst many people in "first world" countries who have "old-fashioned" notions pertaining to peoples' behaviors.

What do you mean when you say "first world" and "third world" countries? None of the countries I mentioned are what is commonly considered a third-world country. I think that the perception of someone "being a brain" may also depend on how accepting the environment is of "weirder" behaviours, as SaveFerries pointed out.


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kraftiekortie
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01 Mar 2017, 8:40 am

I'm talking about "culturally-dependent." I've been to a few "third-world" countries (e.g., Trinidad and Tobago), and have noticed these attitudes. I've also known people from "third-world" countries who have these attitudes.

"Third World" comes from the Cold War Period---when the US and their allies were seen as being of the "first world" and Russia and its allies were seen as being of the "second world." Outside either orbit, if you will.

I don't disagree with anything you stated.



Tripodologia
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01 Mar 2017, 8:49 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
I'm talking about "culturally-dependent." I've been to a few "third-world" countries (e.g., Trinidad and Tobago), and have noticed these attitudes. I've also known people from "third-world" countries who have these attitudes.

"Third World" comes from the Cold War Period---when the US and their allies were seen as being of the "first world" and Russia and its allies were seen as being of the "second world." Outside either orbit, if you will.

I don't disagree with anything you stated.

Ah, thanks for the clarification! I'm still curious about the role that culture (between similarly-developed countries) has in certain traits being considered abnormal or just mildly weird. What is your experience, being from USA? (and I'm aware even within a country, there may be vast differences depending on location).


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kraftiekortie
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01 Mar 2017, 8:51 am

My experience with perceptions of autism and of "weirdness" have varied widely even within my city (New York City).

There are some who are hip to the latest "developments" pertaining to autism and Asperger's

Others are in the dark ages. They might even believe that a severely autistic kid is "possessed by the devil" or some such nonsense.



SaveFerris
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01 Mar 2017, 8:54 am

Although there may be some credence in culture being an issue , I believe social class makes a bigger difference.


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kraftiekortie
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01 Mar 2017, 8:56 am

In the US, social class does play a paramount role in perception.



Tripodologia
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01 Mar 2017, 8:56 am

SaveFerris wrote:
Tripodologia wrote:
As a yet-to-be-diagnosed adult with ASD traits, I've been wondering for a long while now about why haven't I faced the pressure and difficulties that some of you in here have had to endure throughout your life. I never quite had disruptive behaviour, neither at home nor at school, but there are some things that I've always done that seem pretty autistic and I've never been called out because of them.


I feel sort of the same way as you , I am also waiting on an assesment but compared to everyone here I faced very little pressure & difficulties throughtout my early life ( up until 19 ) , my problems only became apparent when I abused drugs.

I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that if you had a good stable background with supportive family and friends , your ASD traits might not be very apparent to anyone.

That's interesting. I'd say my family is really accepting of my quirks (there have been instances when my siblings have inquired in an annoying way what my issue was or why I was upset, when there was nothing wrong... I was just being "too little expressive" for their taste!). Also friends know I'm weird but generally accept me how I am. I have lost also lots of friends for being considered weird, though, and just unable to deeply connect (with few exceptions) or participate on social conventions or showcases of affection (physical and verbal, etc.). These same issues seem however to carry big problems for other people as I've seen around here and other ASD-focused sites.


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Really enjoyed being a yellow-throated woodpecker while it lasted.

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Your neurodiverse (Aspie) score: 139 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 67 of 200
You are very likely neurodiverse (Aspie)


Tripodologia
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01 Mar 2017, 9:11 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
In the US, social class does play a paramount role in perception.

In which direction? Does perception increase as social class does, because of the strong focus of higher social classes with "acceptable manners"?


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kraftiekortie
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01 Mar 2017, 9:13 am

Usually, people who are relatively more educated tend to have more tolerance of "difference," in general, than people who have a relative lack of formal education. They read up more on the latest trends. And that includes the "new notions" of autism. I'm not saying, in any way, that autism is "fashionable"--because it really isn't.

Obviously, there are exceptions to this rule.



Tripodologia
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01 Mar 2017, 9:14 am

SaveFerris wrote:
Although there may be some credence in culture being an issue , I believe social class makes a bigger difference.

Maybe also career and profession have some influence? I'm for instance a scientist, and generally people seem to think that all scientists are a bit weird. However, here in DK, people are extremely laid back when it comes to socially-acceptable things, and I've read that some people from USA find Danish people to be really rude.


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Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 67 of 200
You are very likely neurodiverse (Aspie)


kraftiekortie
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01 Mar 2017, 9:16 am

Actually, Americans don't find Danish people to be rude; they tend to think of them as "lacking passion" in some way.

Americans, on the other hand, are frequently seen by Europeans as being "rude." And "loud, obnoxious."



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01 Mar 2017, 10:18 am

In the USA, if you are gifted and share your gifts with others, people will overlook your autism.

A normal person rarely produces exceptional work, and usually is very possessive of that work. They may spend their entire life making sure they get credit for what they have done. A gifted person has the ability to crank out exceptional work all the time. You might say their brain is designed to do that.



kraftiekortie
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01 Mar 2017, 10:23 am

I would say that an especially discerning person would do the above.

Most people, unfortunately, throughout the world, care little for giftedness. What they are concerned about, primarily, is conformity.