Page 1 of 2 [ 29 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

Gammeldans
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

Joined: 13 Dec 2018
Gender: Male
Posts: 300

20 Oct 2022, 1:49 am

Have you ever been told by a professional (so called ASD expert) that you have problems with generalisation?
Why would we have difficulties with it and NT not?
Do we over-generalise or under-generalise?
Professionals are often very non-specific.
Why do even have to see how we are as problems?



autisticelders
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 23 Feb 2020
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,276
Location: Alpena MI

20 Oct 2022, 4:47 am

how frustrating!! !!


_________________
https://oldladywithautism.blog/

"Curiosity is one of the permanent and certain characteristics of a vigorous intellect.” Samuel Johnson


Gammeldans
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

Joined: 13 Dec 2018
Gender: Male
Posts: 300

20 Oct 2022, 4:51 am

autisticelders wrote:
how frustrating!! ! !

:?:



himmellaufen
Blue Jay
Blue Jay

Joined: 3 Oct 2022
Age: 31
Gender: Female
Posts: 96

20 Oct 2022, 5:23 am

frankly speaking, depending on the context, autistic people can both over-generalize and under generalize

for example, when talking from black and white morality standpoint, they can be too judgemental, not taking others pov into consideration example "all rich people are greedy". or they can undergeneralize, when they look at the world from pov of their niche expertise or when they focus on a detail too much without seeing the big picture.



timf
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Oct 2013
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,111

20 Oct 2022, 6:31 am

Have you ever been told by a professional (so called ASD expert) that you have problems with generalisation?

First I would wonder why someone would express a declarative opinion about me. While many people feel free to comment on others today most have learned to keep their opinions to themselves or risk a punch in the mouth. I have to assume that this "expert" is someone being paid as a therapist.

One might respond, "I am sorry I don't understand. Are you saying I am not general enough or that I am too general. Your statement might be seen to reflect a problem with generalization".

Occasionally someone who presents themselves as an "expert" can have something useful to say. This doesn't sound like one of those times.



shortfatbalduglyman
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 4 Mar 2017
Age: 41
Gender: Male
Posts: 10,447

20 Oct 2022, 12:26 pm

Overgeneralization versus pattern recognition

It appears that neurotypical extroverts make overgeneralizing statements, as well as "black and white thinking" and jump to conclusions, a lot more often than my worthless corpse does.

But not everything is the way it appears

Not a representative sample

Not a controlled experiment

"Always", "never", "people", "can you". Neurotypical extroverts tend to be a lot less specific in their statements and actions, than me. And they talk a lot more and a lot more enthusiastically than me. Overgeneralizing about a group of people or about one person. (Situational versus dispositional)



Gammeldans
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

Joined: 13 Dec 2018
Gender: Male
Posts: 300

20 Oct 2022, 12:41 pm

shortfatbalduglyman wrote:
Overgeneralization versus pattern recognition

It appears that neurotypical extroverts make overgeneralizing statements, as well as "black and white thinking" and jump to conclusions, a lot more often than my worthless corpse does.

But not everything is the way it appears

Not a representative sample

Not a controlled experiment

"Always", "never", "people", "can you". Neurotypical extroverts tend to be a lot less specific in their statements and actions, than me. And they talk a lot more and a lot more enthusiastically than me. Overgeneralizing about a group of people or about one person. (Situational versus dispositional)

What does Situational versus dispositional refer to?

Are you saying that professionals must say that both NTs and ASDs have difficulties with generalisation?



Dear_one
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Feb 2008
Age: 76
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,721
Location: Where the Great Plains meet the Northern Pines

21 Oct 2022, 10:09 pm

"All generalisations are worthless, including this one."
- Mark Twain



Gammeldans
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

Joined: 13 Dec 2018
Gender: Male
Posts: 300

22 Oct 2022, 3:46 am

Dear_one wrote:
"All generalisations are worthless, including this one."
- Mark Twain

What did Twain mean by this quote?



Dear_one
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Feb 2008
Age: 76
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,721
Location: Where the Great Plains meet the Northern Pines

22 Oct 2022, 5:23 am

Gammeldans wrote:
Dear_one wrote:
"All generalisations are worthless, including this one."
- Mark Twain

What did Twain mean by this quote?


Generalizations are often misleading, but still worthwhile.



shortfatbalduglyman
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 4 Mar 2017
Age: 41
Gender: Male
Posts: 10,447

22 Oct 2022, 1:49 pm

Dear_one wrote:
Gammeldans wrote:
Dear_one wrote:
"All generalisations are worthless, including this one."
- Mark Twain

What did Twain mean by this quote?


Generalizations are often misleading, but still worthwhile.


__________________________

"Often misleading" . Correct. Not "always misleading".



naturalplastic
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Aug 2010
Age: 69
Gender: Male
Posts: 35,189
Location: temperate zone

22 Oct 2022, 3:33 pm

Gammeldans wrote:
Dear_one wrote:
"All generalisations are worthless, including this one."
- Mark Twain

What did Twain mean by this quote?


A statement like "all generalizations are X" is itself a generalization.

If X is "worthless" then that means that SOME generalizations are valuable.



Gammeldans
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

Joined: 13 Dec 2018
Gender: Male
Posts: 300

23 Oct 2022, 3:54 am

naturalplastic wrote:
Gammeldans wrote:
Dear_one wrote:
"All generalisations are worthless, including this one."
- Mark Twain

What did Twain mean by this quote?


A statement like "all generalizations are X" is itself a generalization.

If X is "worthless" then that means that SOME generalizations are valuable.

The thing is: I sometimes see people quote some guy name Mark Twain. I think he's some kind of author.
People quotes him as if he was some kind of genius. If so, what more than the quote did he say about generalisation?



naturalplastic
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Aug 2010
Age: 69
Gender: Male
Posts: 35,189
Location: temperate zone

23 Oct 2022, 4:00 am

Gammeldans wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Gammeldans wrote:
Dear_one wrote:
"All generalisations are worthless, including this one."
- Mark Twain

What did Twain mean by this quote?


A statement like "all generalizations are X" is itself a generalization.

If X is "worthless" then that means that SOME generalizations are valuable.

The thing is: I sometimes see people quote some guy name Mark Twain. I think he's some kind of author.
People quotes him as if he was some kind of genius. If so, what more than the quote did he say about generalisation?

:roll:

Nineteenth Century Mark Twain (born Samuel Clemens) was only one of the greatest authors, and greatest humorists, in American history. The first author to write in a distinctly American voice.

He wrote Tom Sawyer, Huckleberry Finn, the Celebrated Jumping Toad of Calaveras County, just to name some his best known stuff.



Gammeldans
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

Joined: 13 Dec 2018
Gender: Male
Posts: 300

23 Oct 2022, 10:44 am

naturalplastic wrote:
Gammeldans wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Gammeldans wrote:
Dear_one wrote:
"All generalisations are worthless, including this one."
- Mark Twain

What did Twain mean by this quote?


A statement like "all generalizations are X" is itself a generalization.

If X is "worthless" then that means that SOME generalizations are valuable.

The thing is: I sometimes see people quote some guy name Mark Twain. I think he's some kind of author.
People quotes him as if he was some kind of genius. If so, what more than the quote did he say about generalisation?

:roll:

Nineteenth Century Mark Twain (born Samuel Clemens) was only one of the greatest authors, and greatest humorists, in American history. The first author to write in a distinctly American voice.

He wrote Tom Sawyer, Huckleberry Finn, the Celebrated Jumping Toad of Calaveras County, just to name some his best known stuff.

I guess I am more familiar with Strindberg.



lostonearth35
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 5 Jan 2010
Age: 50
Gender: Female
Posts: 12,763
Location: Lost on Earth, waddya think?

23 Oct 2022, 10:59 am

Generalization is something both humans and animals naturally do. For example if a dog has a kind and caring owner, it will assume all humans are kind and caring until it meets one that is unpleasant or cruel to it. Then the dog will be confused because it doesn't understand how different and unpredictable humans are, even though they are all the same species.

Humans are supposed to be intelligent enough to know not to generalize, but do anyway because it's a sad and sorry part of our genes that may have been beneficial for our early ancestors' survival but is now turned society into a giant mess. Of course, I'm talking about things like racism, sexism or stereotyping, or being judgmental of certain people of certain occupations because you had a very bad experience in the past because of them.