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skibum
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16 Feb 2025, 11:50 am

I was talking to one of my younger ski coaches the other day. She is a very good ski coach but she does not understand Autism at all. And she admits that she does not and that she is just learning, which is good and I really appreciate. She is also very willing to learn and I love that about her. I do have to be very gentle with her though because I don't ever want her to feel like she can't approach me or ask me questions. But the talk we had the other day, just like so many I have with so many people, was really frustrating.

Like most people who are ignorant about Autism, she thought the spectrum was a gradient so she did not understand how I could be a Special Olympics athlete because since the ONLY time she ever sees me is on the ski slopes, she thought that I have no real issues and just a little bit of Autism because, to her, I "function" so well.

First, I had to explain to her that to be in Special Olympics you have to have a qualifying diagnosis. You don't have to be high support needs. Then I had to explain to her the difference between a gradient and a spectrum and that there is no such thing as "a little bit of Autism" just like there is no such thing as "a little bit of Down Syndrome." You are either Autistic or you are not. And Special Olympics does not put a cap on how low an athlete's support needs are or on how well an athlete can function. If a doctor signs your diagnosis on the medical form and it is one of the diagnoses that they accept, you are in. There are no other entry requirements.

Then she said that it's good that I don't let my Autism define me. This is when the conversation became intolerable. The reason that I find these conversations so frustrating is that the person has just admitted that they know absolutely nothing at all about a condition or a disability and how it works, yet they feel like they have to have such strong opinions about how you manage it and how it affects your life, and they want you to reassure them and tell them what wonderful people they are because they are throwing idiotic, ignorant, and frankly offensive, and ableist platitudes at you in an attempt to make you "not feel so bad" about being disabled because they believe that you must have low self esteem because you are disabled so it's "obviously" their job to make you feel better about yourself. And if you show any inkling of irritation at their comments, they act as if you are being rude to them because you are not "allowing" them to make you feel better about being disabled. Yes, I can write a run on sentence like nobody's business!

I then had to explain to her that Autism defines every single aspect of my existence just like neurotypicality defines everything about hers. I had to explain to her that Autism is not something that I have, Autistic is what I am just like neurotypicality is not a disease that she has; neurotypical is just what she is. And since our brains control every aspect of our existence, my Autistic brain absolutely defines everything about me just like her neurotypical brain defines everything about her.

But then she responded by saying how well I manage to function. I guess she must have been comparing me to some stereotype that she must have in her head of what disability is. Then I had to explain to her that she only sees me in one environment. I also had to explain to her that the only reason that most Autistic people are actually disabled is not because we are Autistic but because society is not set up in a way that is survivable to our design. If you judge a fish by how well he climbs a tree, he will fail miserably every single time. But put that fish in water and he will function better than you do.

Then she said one of the most ableist things that people say to me all the time. I HATE it so much when people say this. She said, "I treat everybody the same." In my mind I was thinking, "You want a medal?" First of all, anybody who feels the need to announce that they treat everybody the same, I think that shows their inner ableist self shining though. To me, it feels like person first language. It is extremely bigoted. If you have to remind yourself that I am a person every time you talk about me, you don't believe I am one.

I responded by saying that I hate when people tell me that they treat everyone the same because we are not the same. I told her that if people do not treat me like the disabled person that I am, and that includes my physical disability and my other disabilities as well as my being Autistic, they end up putting unrealistic and often times dangerous and even life threatening expectations on me and then punishing me when I can't meet them. If you keep convincing yourself that I am not disabled, it is just an excuse to refuse me the accommodations I need to survive and function. And to label it as some kind of pseudo respect is disgusting. Now I understand that people might be doing this actually believing that they are doing something kind and good. But they are not and if they are not willing to accept that once they have been educated on the matter, it then becomes willful ableism. I have plenty of compassion for ignorance and I am more than happy to educate people. But the problem is that when I try to teach people about these things, rather than learning and changing, they double down and justify their position and then get angry at me for making them feel bad because I should just bow down and accept these stupid and ridiculous and offensive platitudes.

Then she said something, I found really offensive. When she tried to explain what she meant by the fact that she treats everybody the same. She said, " I don't talk to you like you are stupid because you are Autistic." I was like, wow, let me praise you and give you an award for what a wonderful person you are. (For those of you who struggle with sarcasm, my thought in response to what she had just said was a fine example of it.) First of all, if she did talk to me like I was stupid that would just show how stupid she would be because I have a Mensa level IQ and that is very apparent from day one to any coach who has ever trained me in anything.

There is nothing in the diagnostic criteria for Autism that says that the person has to be or appear stupid. There is nothing in the diagnostic criteria for Autism that says that the person has to have an intellectual disability. In fact, Donald Triplett, who just passed away in June of 2023 at the age of 89, was the very first person to receive an Autism diagnosis. He was labeled "case 1" by Leo Kanner. He lived alone, worked as a banker, traveled abroad often, and had a bachelor's degree in French from Milsaps College.

This is a topic for later, but I also do not personally believe that "Profound Autism" is technically a thing. Now you can call it whatever you want but I am talking about its actual technical construct. I absolutely believe that having those kinds of support needs is definitely a thing, and I absolutely believe that those needs should be met but what makes someone have profound Autism is usually, and you may correct me if I am wrong, but it is usually because the person ALSO has a comorbid condition such as severe intellectual impairment. Intellectual disability (what used to clinically be called mental retardation) is not Autism, it is its own diagnosis which can sometimes be a comorbid to Autism. In fact, only about 30% of the Autistic population has an intellectual disability. So the comorbid diagnoses that are part of what makes what we now call profound Autism that, are not actually Autism. But people can call those combinations whatever they want as long as everyone gets their needs met. I believe that no matter what you call something, what is most important, and the only thing that matters, is that people's needs are met.

But even if someone has a severe intellectual disability, that does not make them stupid. So, for her to proudly announce and imply that she is so wonderful and considerate because she does not talk to me as if I am stupid because I am Autistic, is extremely ableist. And when someone says something like that, I am expected to not get angry or frustrated. What they want is for me to thank them for being so kind and considerate to them because they think that that is such an amazing thing that they are doing for me.

Now I understand where they are coming from. I have a life experience's equivalent of multiple doctorate degrees in interacting with ignorant and idiotic people. I do understand that they exist in absolute and disproportional abundance. I am also very gracious and compassionate towards them, and I try to be as gentle as I can with them. But after having to do this incessantly for decades and having to have similar conversations on a near daily basis in 90% of all of my interactions with humans, it is really taking its toll and wearing on me to the point where it has become intolerable.

Now I truly love this person, and she is an absolutely excellent ski coach, and I will gladly train with her anytime. But people please, it's 2025. The internet is at your fingertips. Autistic people are all around you. Go learn something. It's not that hard. A couple of good Youtube videos can go a very long way. I actually watched her subscribe to my channel. I hope she actually watches it. I wish people would stop insisting on treating us as they define us and let us teach them how to relate to and treat us instead.


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16 Feb 2025, 12:33 pm

It is difficult, because we use our brains to try and compare, and we try and compare to make sense of what is being said.

With the autistic mind, the results of the differences in brainwave functions mean that we think in a certain way, and as my thinking patterns, even though I am on the spectrum myself will be different to yours, I can't put your brain inside my head to understand how you think.
Not an allistic person will not at first even think that people think in a different way because when they come across an autistic mind, they are looking at the outward function results and not the waynones brain is thinking differently to cause those results.
The allistic person natrually thinks along the lines of trying to correct those results which is like trying to bend mis-shaped tree roots to fit inside a certain shaped pot! The tree can be made to fit, but it is busting to get out and will at some stage (If it does not die first in trying) eventually burst the pot!

To someone who is trying to understand, it takes a while and a lot of research and thinking before they get to understand.



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16 Feb 2025, 1:31 pm

Yes that is very true. I understand that it is a steep learning curve that requires a great deal of patience, and I have a lot of that. But what bothers me the most is when someone knows and admits that they know absolutely nothing about Autism at all yet they have such huge and strong opinions on how Autism should or should not affect me. And they get upset with me if I don't agree with them.


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16 Feb 2025, 1:37 pm

I love when I get autism NT-splained to me.

I don't understand how people can simultaneous know they don't understand jackshit about someone else's situation but also lecture that person on their situation. My brain can't do that sort of doublethink and it's almost impressive to watch someone engage in it.


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16 Feb 2025, 1:50 pm

It is hard for most people to understand something they can't see, like disabilities of the mind.

One of my friends got seriously sick and had to have his legs amputated.
He is happier without them! They didn't work properly before and had to get around with a wheelchair or a pair of canes before the amputation.

Of course it helps that he has a NYC teaching job. Good job security.



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16 Feb 2025, 4:26 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
I love when I get autism NT-splained to me.

I don't understand how people can simultaneous know they don't understand jackshit about someone else's situation but also lecture that person on their situation. My brain can't do that sort of doublethink and it's almost impressive to watch someone engage in it.
I know right?! !! It's so infuriating!


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16 Feb 2025, 4:28 pm

BTDT wrote:
It is hard for most people to understand something they can't see, like disabilities of the mind.

One of my friends got seriously sick and had to have his legs amputated.
He is happier without them! They didn't work properly before and had to get around with a wheelchair or a pair of canes before the amputation.

Of course it helps that he has a NYC teaching job. Good job security.

Agreed. It's like they can't wrap their heads around it. It might also be very difficult for some people to understand how he could be happier with a double amputation, but I totally get it.


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16 Feb 2025, 4:36 pm

skibum wrote:
I know right?! ! ! It's so infuriating!


It's a good example of those situations where you can either laugh or go completely ballistic. I try to stick with laughing and explaining "the joke" to the other party like they're very stupid. I find sometimes rubbing people's noses in their own stupidity and/or ignorance is more effective than being openly insulting or hostile, even if open hostility would be completely justified.


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16 Feb 2025, 8:37 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
skibum wrote:
I know right?! ! ! It's so infuriating!


It's a good example of those situations where you can either laugh or go completely ballistic. I try to stick with laughing and explaining "the joke" to the other party like they're very stupid. I find sometimes rubbing people's noses in their own stupidity and/or ignorance is more effective than being openly insulting or hostile, even if open hostility would be completely justified.
That's actually really funny. I imagine it works well. :D


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16 Feb 2025, 10:14 pm

skibum wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
skibum wrote:
I know right?! ! ! It's so infuriating!


It's a good example of those situations where you can either laugh or go completely ballistic. I try to stick with laughing and explaining "the joke" to the other party like they're very stupid. I find sometimes rubbing people's noses in their own stupidity and/or ignorance is more effective than being openly insulting or hostile, even if open hostility would be completely justified.
That's actually really funny. I imagine it works well. :D


It works better when one can remember to lean into that they're actually the stupid one (at least, that's the role you're assuming), since the more openly smug/condescending one is, the more insufferable it appears to onlookers. That, and being playful somewhat so the other party can acknowledge the criticism and accept correction rather than just become defensive.

You know, since the goal is to make the other person (and any onlookers) understand, not just to take a strip off of someone.

Dexter here is doing it all wrong:


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17 Feb 2025, 5:31 am

I think it would be better if the general public didn't know Autism existed. I believe that having very little or incorrect information is more dangerous than having none at all.



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18 Feb 2025, 1:05 am

I just want to point out two things. First, it's so true that with "profound" autism, it's the intellectual impairment at play that makes the autism seem "profound."

I've known severely autistic people who were socially engaging and gave eye contact. But the ID with their autism makes it come off as "severe" or "profound."

Second, I myself have told people, "I treat everyone the same." This isn't about putting the same expectations on all people without considering a disability. It's about how I act and speak.

"I treat everyone the same" does NOT mean I'm going to let a door close in the face of a person who's struggling to walk. I normally don't hold the door open for people behind me (I'm not a doorman). But if someone behind me is struggling to walk, I'll hold the door.

"I treat everyone the same" means that I SPEAK to them with the same voice, same pitch, same eye contact. I don't use a baby voice on children or elderly people, and I don't use a baby voice or loud voice with people in wheelchairs or who have an apparent ID. I don't speak extra loud to blind people, either.

If the guy bagging my groceries has Down's, I'm going to interact with him the same as if it was a typical college student.

So that's what people usually mean when they say, "I treat all people the same."



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18 Feb 2025, 12:42 pm

Elgee wrote:
I just want to point out two things. First, it's so true that with "profound" autism, it's the intellectual impairment at play that makes the autism seem "profound."

I've known severely autistic people who were socially engaging and gave eye contact. But the ID with their autism makes it come off as "severe" or "profound."

Second, I myself have told people, "I treat everyone the same." This isn't about putting the same expectations on all people without considering a disability. It's about how I act and speak.

"I treat everyone the same" does NOT mean I'm going to let a door close in the face of a person who's struggling to walk. I normally don't hold the door open for people behind me (I'm not a doorman). But if someone behind me is struggling to walk, I'll hold the door.

"I treat everyone the same" means that I SPEAK to them with the same voice, same pitch, same eye contact. I don't use a baby voice on children or elderly people, and I don't use a baby voice or loud voice with people in wheelchairs or who have an apparent ID. I don't speak extra loud to blind people, either.

If the guy bagging my groceries has Down's, I'm going to interact with him the same as if it was a typical college student.

So that's what people usually mean when they say, "I treat all people the same."
I 100% agree that treating everyone the same should mean that you show equity rather than equality and that you do not infantilize people and that you speak to them and treat them in a manner that is best and most respectful to them. That is the correct way of treating everyone the same and from what you describe, that is what you indeed do. I wish that is how people treated me.

In my personal life experience, I have found that the way people treat me 99% of the time when they insist that they treat everyone the same, is that they expect me to be able to meet the same expectations that a healthy non disabled nt would be expected to meet and if I don't, I get punished or bullied for not being able to. And I am constantly refused the accommodations I need because I look too normal and speak too well. If my disabilities were visible, I think that many people would treat me as I need to be treated in order to be able to function. But very few people believe that I am as disabled as I am so they refuse to even if I try to explain my situation. I have been told so often by so many people, "I expect you to be able to function at a very high level all the time." I even had a Special Olympics coach directly refuse to help me when I asked for help because I was having very severe apraxia of speech because I was losing brain function from massive sensory overwhelm and my speech was extremely slurred. He literally told me, "You know how to talk and I will not help you until you talk correctly." I was so distraught I started crying. He just looked at me with disdain. This is how I get treated almost all the time. Then, when I complain to their supervisors I usually get told something along the lines of, "You just need to get over it because you can't expect people to believe that you are disabled." I even get spoken to like that at organizations like Special Olympics where the only reason I am allowed to be there is because I am disabled.


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18 Feb 2025, 1:01 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
I love when I get autism NT-splained to me.

I don't understand how people can simultaneous know they don't understand jackshit about someone else's situation but also lecture that person on their situation. My brain can't do that sort of doublethink and it's almost impressive to watch someone engage in it.


I had to bit my tongue on that one recently. Guy went on to say "I think I'm a bit neurodiverse too, but of course, you can handle these things easily with a bit of meditation and willpower." Well, OK.


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18 Feb 2025, 1:18 pm

PhosphorusDecree wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
I love when I get autism NT-splained to me.

I don't understand how people can simultaneous know they don't understand jackshit about someone else's situation but also lecture that person on their situation. My brain can't do that sort of doublethink and it's almost impressive to watch someone engage in it.


I had to bit my tongue on that one recently. Guy went on to say "I think I'm a bit neurodiverse too, but of course, you can handle these things easily with a bit of meditation and willpower." Well, OK.


I'm not good at biting my tongue in those situations. I'd have been very tempted to say 'thresholds exist for a reason when it comes to diagnosing these sorts of concerns, if meditation and willpower were all it took, no one would actually meet the threshold to be identified as having a disability'.

But, I'm pretty disagreeable and generally prefer to 'have that fight now and get it over with' rather than putting up with rudeness or ignorance until I'm actually upset and less capable of articulating my position.

I've also noticed if you let people step on your toes regularly they start to feel entitled to step there whenever they feel like it. Establishing a boundary early and firmly makes other people less likely to keep stepping on your toes because they understand you won't tolerate it.


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18 Feb 2025, 2:34 pm

PhosphorusDecree wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
I love when I get autism NT-splained to me.

I don't understand how people can simultaneous know they don't understand jackshit about someone else's situation but also lecture that person on their situation. My brain can't do that sort of doublethink and it's almost impressive to watch someone engage in it.


I had to bit my tongue on that one recently. Guy went on to say "I think I'm a bit neurodiverse too, but of course, you can handle these things easily with a bit of meditation and willpower." Well, OK.
That would make me want to slap him!


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