Asperger's and schizophrenia.

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How many "traits" or "symptoms" do Asperger's and schizophrenia share?

I'm only asking this because I was diagnosed with Asperger's and paranoid schizophrenia almost simultaneously by a consultant psychiatrist.

I know obviously that hallucinations/paranoia/etc are all to do with the paranoid schiz., but there are some other, more behavioural traits/symptoms that I am not sure I can attribute to AS or to the paranoid schiz.

For example, I am 100,000 times better at communicating using a computer than speaking. Speak to me and I won't talk much or tell you about how I am feeling etc. This could be AS because AS people have communication problems, but this could also be the paranoid schiz. as one of the "negative symptoms" (research paranoid schizophrenia if you don't know what "negative symptoms" are).

That's odd that you were diagnosed with both, I thought one of the diagnostic criteria for Asperger's is that it can't be schizophrenia.

I am not diagnosed with schizophrenia. I have never had any kind of hallucinations but I have had paranoia. I guess they would share some traits because it involves genetics and the brain.
I think paranoia is the biproduct of a brain that is different in some way because so many disorders that affect the brain share this trait. Everybody probably already knows this.
I would be happy if I never experienced the paranoid state ever again, it's so uncomfortable.

They share a lot of traits, but I always thought they were mutually exclusive. Like two sides of the same coin, one hears voices and delusions, one doesn't. They asked me specifically in my diagnosis evaluation questions that would rule out schizophrenia.

Well somehow I was diagnosed with both, and the psychiatrist who diagnosed me is a very good psychiatrist, I know he is.
Every hospital admission the doctors and even the nurses unanimously agreed I have paranoid schizophrenia. At school the teachers unanimously think I have Asperger's.
Perhaps I'm just an interesting case.

This fact scares me. Currently they diagnosed me as Psychosis-NOS... I have delusions and paranoia but normally not hallucinations... both my parents were dxed paranoid shizo... my therapist says maybe I'm an Aspie, but not sure.

One thing, do Schizophrenics have obsessive interests? I have this and wondered if it could mean I could be both too.

It seems possible to me to have both.

Schizophrenia diagnosis involve a combination of both positive and negative symptoms over a period of time. Having delusions and hallucinations are what earns the diagnosis.
The speech can be jumbled, behaviour disorganized and affect flat. In my opinion, the paranoid variety is completely different than the disorganized/flat affect variety.
There are variations of the two people experiencing different symptoms at different times, some can be a little bit of everything.

AS criteria say:

Expanded meaning:



If you met the criteria for AS before your schizophrenia started, you can have both diagnoses.

When put under the scrutiny of doctors I had to convince them that my reactions to sensory stimuli were not at all the result of hallucinations, but very genuine and valid responses to being overstimulated by particular lights and noises.

This is extremely difficult to convey if these lights and noises are denied by everyone else.

I believe it would have been all too easy for doctors to have dismissed my sensitivity to sensory stimuli as hallucinations and made a misdiagnosis of a schizo-related disorder.

Perhaps the crucial element is not what you are experiencing, but how you manage to communicate this with others, especially those making any diagnoses. I am mute and write things down- use a computer if you want to. Do not let them tell you it is anything more severe than it actually is because of a communication failure.

schizophrenia, AS and schizotypal can present similar.
but i find a psychologist will se AS and in the same person a psychiatrist will see schizotypal.
the hallucinations are an indicator away from AS and differentiate it from schizophrenia.

Not only do you have to consider the point of hallucinations, but schizophrenia also has an onset and progression.

Its easy to loose your way with labels. Read up and decide yourself.

I have been very interested in people with both Asperger’s and Schizophrenia for a very long time. In particular I am looking for any symptoms that most people with Asperger’s have but you do not. If you can name one or more of these symptoms I would be very grateful. Thank you.

I have been diagnosed with both autism and schizoaffective disorder. I don't agree with the schizoaffective diagnosis because it is rare for me to hear voices. I mean very rare. The only types of hallucinations I have are the tactile ones and occasionally mild visual hallucinations. The doctors think that I have "bizarre delusions" which basically that symptom alone can qualify you for the diagnosis. I feel things inside my body and when it was real bad, I tried to cut them out. I think they are these nano machines that can destroy your insides and kill you and they were implanted by the government. I love the gov! In fact my brother is thinking of joining the FBI so he can spy on me. That is the whole reason why he wants to join. Ain't that funny? Spy on your sister. Sometimes I think aliens are out to get me and that to them I am the "chosen one" or have a special purpose for them. When my symptoms are severe I wouldn't be able to communicate clearly as I am now, it would either be disorganized or total gibberish not real words. But communication problems can happen in autism, too. I'm so cold. The weather was bad today, it rained and I had a show outdoors, yeah these topics are linked in some way and now I am confused like usual. In the DSM V (which is coming out in 2011 at the earliest) they should add, Generalized Confusion Disorder because I have that. You wouldn't know that I was autistic by meeting me because I make direct eye to eye contact. When I was young, I mean many thousands of years ago, I didn't make eye to eye contact at all. I would scream if something changed or someone came too close to me. I no longer do that. I have an Asperger's friend that doesn't have bad symptoms at least that I am aware of. He is very nice. I am happy that I don't hear voices because that means the doctors are wrong!! ! When my "symptoms" are bad, I get something known as thought insertion. That is basically when you believe that someone else is putting thoughts into your head. I had thoughts from the government and the aliens for about a year now. A little over a year. They would accuse me of things that is impossible to do, they were threatening to kill me, one time they told me that my pills were poison and that caused me to stop taking them for a few days, and a few other weird things. It was NOT audible as in voices though just very powerful thoughts that ain't your own.

Top notch topic

This topic would almost be a great Sticky. I look forward to reading further posts.

Autism and schizophrenia have been mixed up in the past, and they continue to present a challenge for many psychologists. Many autistics spent years on antipsychotics because they were believed to have schizophrenia. The easiest way to tell them apart is to ask about childhood history. Autism will have a history going back at least to age 5, usually earlier. Schizohprenia will have its onset after age 15, earlier in men than women. Additionally, schizophrenia is often episodic; autism is either constant or changes as stress levels change or skills are gained and lost (CDD especially).

Similarities:

• Disorganized speech in schizophrenia could be mixed up with the unusual speech patterns of an Aspie. The big difference seems to be that the disorganization in schizophrenia comes from disorganized thoughts, while the Aspie's speech is a more immediate problem with verbal expression.
  
• Some Aspies have a flat affect (they don't express emotion well). That's also a symptom of schizophrenia.
  
• A meltdown may remind a psychologist of some of the 'disorganized behavior' present in schizophrenia.
  
• If you have very bad executive dysfunction, it could be read as avolition or disorganization.
  
• Lack of or decline in speech is a negative symptom in schizophrenia, as well as autism.

In your specific case, though, none of those confounding factors would have been present. You were diagnosed with the paranoid subtype; so that means that the psychologist saw no disorganization, no thought disorder, and no negative symptoms. (You might also be encouraged to know that this is the subtype with the best prognosis for permanent remission, and the one that responds best to medical treatment.)

Sora's explanation of the possibility of having both AS and schizophrenia is exactly what I meant to say. If you have AS first, and then schizophrenia later, you can be diagnosed with both. It means your history is that of someone with Asperger's long before the onset of your schizophrenia-specific symptoms.