Board index › General Discussion › General Autism Discussion

I see it now...

Page 8 of 9 [ 129 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 5, 6, 7, 8, 9  Next

Previous topic | Next topic

bdhkhsfgk
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 May 2009
Age: 32
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,450

18 Feb 2010, 11:48 am

pandd wrote:
ursaminor wrote:
pandd wrote:
It seems that every Autistic person breathed oxygen at some point in time.
Maybe not every autistic.
Maybe they died in the womb.
And were still autistic.

But are arguably not persons, however Autistic they might be.


Autistic people are human beings, they're not "autistic aliens from mars".



makuranososhi
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 May 2008
Age: 48
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,805
Location: Banned by Alex

18 Feb 2010, 12:05 pm

bdhkhsfgk wrote:
valkyrieraven88 wrote:
And if autism is just your brain not progressing after childhood, why are there autistic children? My mother knew there was "something wrong with me" when I was eighteen months old. My brain hadn't stopped progressing. In fact, the reason it was so difficult for me to be diagnosed is because although I had issues throughout my entire childhood, I went through all the normal physical and mental developments. I just had no social skills.


You're on to something there, in many autistics, the brain stops developing at a certain stage/level.


Your response makes no sense to me, B, as their comments were contrary to what you have been postulating unless you are again changing your 'theory'.


M.


_________________
My thanks to all the wonderful members here; I will miss the opportunity to continue to learn and work with you.

For those who seek an alternative, it is coming.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!


bdhkhsfgk
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 May 2009
Age: 32
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,450

18 Feb 2010, 12:13 pm

makuranososhi wrote:
bdhkhsfgk wrote:
valkyrieraven88 wrote:
And if autism is just your brain not progressing after childhood, why are there autistic children? My mother knew there was "something wrong with me" when I was eighteen months old. My brain hadn't stopped progressing. In fact, the reason it was so difficult for me to be diagnosed is because although I had issues throughout my entire childhood, I went through all the normal physical and mental developments. I just had no social skills.


You're on to something there, in many autistics, the brain stops developing at a certain stage/level.


Your response makes no sense to me, B, as their comments were contrary to what you have been postulating unless you are again changing your 'theory'.


M.


I'm noble to my theory.

Unless you mean inert or inactive, as in a noble gas, then I fail to understand what you are try to say. You've made an observation of questionable validity and extremely limited substantiation; if you wish to stand by them, that is your right... but I would likely look for another description.


M.



ursaminor
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Age: 158
Gender: Male
Posts: 936
Location: Leiden, Netherlands

18 Feb 2010, 12:36 pm

pandd wrote:
Evidently hunans breath oxygen before they are born.
They do not really breathe the oxygen, but the get it into their system anyway.



pandd
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Jul 2006
Age: 51
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,430

18 Feb 2010, 12:48 pm

bdhkhsfgk wrote:
pandd wrote:
ursaminor wrote:
pandd wrote:
It seems that every Autistic person breathed oxygen at some point in time.
Maybe not every autistic.
Maybe they died in the womb.
And were still autistic.

But are arguably not persons, however Autistic they might be.


Autistic people are human beings, they're not "autistic aliens from mars".

That might be the case, although it should be remembered that many people were actually bipedal while living and have since died. There must be a connection. I told my cat that this might be the case and he looked impressed (although I was feeding him at the time), so I theorize that cats either cause Autism, or can co-exist in the same universe as Autistic people, and as my cat does not appear to disagree, this has to mean something!



bdhkhsfgk
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 May 2009
Age: 32
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,450

18 Feb 2010, 12:52 pm

pandd wrote:
bdhkhsfgk wrote:
pandd wrote:
ursaminor wrote:
pandd wrote:
It seems that every Autistic person breathed oxygen at some point in time.
Maybe not every autistic.
Maybe they died in the womb.
And were still autistic.

But are arguably not persons, however Autistic they might be.


Autistic people are human beings, they're not "autistic aliens from mars".

That might be the case, although it should be remembered that many people were actually bipedal while living and have since died. There must be a connection. I told my cat that this might be the case and he looked impressed (although I was feeding him at the time), so I theorize that cats either cause Autism, or can co-exist in the same universe as Autistic people, and as my cat does not appear to disagree, this has to mean something!


I'm impressed by the "Dogs are NT's, and Cat's are aspies" theory, it may be true, who knows.



j0sh
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 18 Nov 2008
Age: 47
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,191
Location: Tampa, Florida

18 Feb 2010, 1:12 pm

I can only speak for myself on this: Sometimes I feel like a nut, but sometimes I don't. I’m unsure if there is a connection to autism or the OP’s theory in this thread. I haven't been able to develop this into a full "theory" yet. Any assistance is appreciated.



justMax
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 23 Nov 2009
Age: 44
Gender: Male
Posts: 539

18 Feb 2010, 1:45 pm

I'm a cat, a 5'9" tall 150 lb cat who knows kung fu, dogs respect me, but are clearly uncomfortable by having me around.

I've tried to explain this to my friends and family, the dog doesn't need my approval, the fact that I am not flensing his flesh from his bones tells him I approve of his presence all he needs. He knows I'm not part of his pack, I simply hang out with them, he DOES know I'll protect him, but he doesn't know why, I am clearly not a dog.


Most people are indeed pack animals, I prefer to refer to them as wolves, they seem to appreciate the metaphor better, but the effect is the same.



Back to the discussion at hand, brains don't develop from nothing into something.

The brain starts out with a random array of connections, and as you learn, you trim and cull those connections into a useful shape.

The brain of an infant is like a block of clay waiting to be sculpted, you have to remove as much as you mold and reform really.

The brain of an autistic is one in which those useful connections with the social center of the brain were not made as strongly, or at all, or worse, were culled entirely.

Drawing from this site for the portion below: http://www.shaktitechnology.com/ yes, I was skeptical at first as well, but the guy is actually attempting to apply the scientific method to this stuff, check it out. I am completely non-spiritual and approve entirely of this guy's work.

In particular: http://www.shaktitechnology.com/sp.htm

Quote:
Our interpretation of this experience relies on the fact that humans have two senses of self. Left hemispheric and right hemispheric. It also relies on the idea that the dominant sense of self in normal individuals is the left hemispheric (linguistic) sense of self. We experience its dominance in our lives every second as we experience our minds generating a constant stream of inner dialog. The subordinate sense of self, on the right in normal individuals, is active during almost all cognitive processes, but it acts to subserve the linguistic, dominant sense of self. The right hemispheric self and phenomenology are only outside our awareness whenever we are thinking in words, They do not stop. The sensed presence happens when the right hemispheric sense of self falls out of phase with the left hemispheric self. The right ‘self' is experienced as an external presence. Although there are reports of partial OBEs in which a person experiences themselves as being in two places at once, it is much more common for a person to feel that the sensed presence is not themselves at all, but an outside, ego-alien, being. The two hemispheres can act independently, as shown in ‘split brain' studies, giving the person a partitioned awareness. The sensed presence might be likened to a temporary split brain, but limited to its senses of self (Persinger, 1993).


Going from the two-selves theory of awareness, most people have a silent partner in their right hemisphere, and their main "sense of self" in the left portion of the brain.

The portion that deals with emotions, interpretation of meaning, social filters, and so forth is in the left portion, and the ability to pivot that self onto another person produces theory of mind.


I am quite certain that I am not located in that portion of my brain, I reside in the portion most people are unaware of, the logical thinking portion, my silent partner is the social aspect, and when I try to pivot to exercise a theory of mind, you always turn around the silent partner to place "your" sense of self onto another.

I assume others will think logically just as I do, and am baffled by social responses, this makes sense.


Anyone else feel like they're not located in the social center of their brain?



bdhkhsfgk
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 May 2009
Age: 32
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,450

18 Feb 2010, 2:03 pm

j0sh wrote:
I can only speak for myself on this: Sometimes I feel like a nut, but sometimes I don't. I’m unsure if there is a connection to autism or the OP’s theory in this thread. I haven't been able to develop this into a full "theory" yet. Any assistance is appreciated.


This is alien to me.



bdhkhsfgk
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 May 2009
Age: 32
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,450

18 Feb 2010, 2:04 pm

justMax wrote:
I'm a cat, a 5'9" tall 150 lb cat who knows kung fu, dogs respect me, but are clearly uncomfortable by having me around.

I've tried to explain this to my friends and family, the dog doesn't need my approval, the fact that I am not flensing his flesh from his bones tells him I approve of his presence all he needs. He knows I'm not part of his pack, I simply hang out with them, he DOES know I'll protect him, but he doesn't know why, I am clearly not a dog.


Most people are indeed pack animals, I prefer to refer to them as wolves, they seem to appreciate the metaphor better, but the effect is the same.

This is also alien to me.


Back to the discussion at hand, brains don't develop from nothing into something.

The brain starts out with a random array of connections, and as you learn, you trim and cull those connections into a useful shape.

The brain of an infant is like a block of clay waiting to be sculpted, you have to remove as much as you mold and reform really.

The brain of an autistic is one in which those useful connections with the social center of the brain were not made as strongly, or at all, or worse, were culled entirely.

Drawing from this site for the portion below: http://www.shaktitechnology.com/ yes, I was skeptical at first as well, but the guy is actually attempting to apply the scientific method to this stuff, check it out. I am completely non-spiritual and approve entirely of this guy's work.

In particular: http://www.shaktitechnology.com/sp.htm

Quote:
Our interpretation of this experience relies on the fact that humans have two senses of self. Left hemispheric and right hemispheric. It also relies on the idea that the dominant sense of self in normal individuals is the left hemispheric (linguistic) sense of self. We experience its dominance in our lives every second as we experience our minds generating a constant stream of inner dialog. The subordinate sense of self, on the right in normal individuals, is active during almost all cognitive processes, but it acts to subserve the linguistic, dominant sense of self. The right hemispheric self and phenomenology are only outside our awareness whenever we are thinking in words, They do not stop. The sensed presence happens when the right hemispheric sense of self falls out of phase with the left hemispheric self. The right ‘self' is experienced as an external presence. Although there are reports of partial OBEs in which a person experiences themselves as being in two places at once, it is much more common for a person to feel that the sensed presence is not themselves at all, but an outside, ego-alien, being. The two hemispheres can act independently, as shown in ‘split brain' studies, giving the person a partitioned awareness. The sensed presence might be likened to a temporary split brain, but limited to its senses of self (Persinger, 1993).


Going from the two-selves theory of awareness, most people have a silent partner in their right hemisphere, and their main "sense of self" in the left portion of the brain.

The portion that deals with emotions, interpretation of meaning, social filters, and so forth is in the left portion, and the ability to pivot that self onto another person produces theory of mind.


I am quite certain that I am not located in that portion of my brain, I reside in the portion most people are unaware of, the logical thinking portion, my silent partner is the social aspect, and when I try to pivot to exercise a theory of mind, you always turn around the silent partner to place "your" sense of self onto another.

I assume others will think logically just as I do, and am baffled by social responses, this makes sense.


Anyone else feel like they're not located in the social center of their brain?



valkyrieraven88
Sea Gull
Sea Gull

User avatar

Joined: 20 Jan 2010
Age: 36
Gender: Female
Posts: 222
Location: St. Louis, MO

18 Feb 2010, 2:16 pm

bdhkhsfgk wrote:
valkyrieraven88 wrote:
And if autism is just your brain not progressing after childhood, why are there autistic children? My mother knew there was "something wrong with me" when I was eighteen months old. My brain hadn't stopped progressing. In fact, the reason it was so difficult for me to be diagnosed is because although I had issues throughout my entire childhood, I went through all the normal physical and mental developments. I just had no social skills.


You're on to something there, in many autistics, the brain stops developing at a certain stage/level.


I was saying the exact opposite of what you said--it doesn't make sense that autism causes the brain to stop developing. My brain was different from the beginning. I went through normal developments. There was no point when I suddenly "stopped progressing." At the age where most children begin interacting socially I failed to do so properly. I was actually speaking and walking AHEAD of schedule. MY BRAIN IS STILL DEVELOPING. SO IS YOURS. SO IS EVERYONE'S UNTIL THEY TURN ABOUT 24. If the brain stopped developing, we would be called vegetables, not autistics. And you're a 17-year-old who clearly has no background suitable to making theories, so don't think you're going to unravel the great mystery that is autism. What causes it isn't important. What's important is to distribute information about it so that the symptoms are better understood and to improve the lives of autistic people by providing better services for them.

I might add, though, that brain scans have been done comparing autistic and non-autistic people's brains. These did not show that autistic people had the brains of children. They showed that they brains seemed to be functioning in different ways. Autistic people are said to have abnormal EEG's. Neurotypical children have normal EEG's.

I refute you thus!
Image



bdhkhsfgk
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 May 2009
Age: 32
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,450

18 Feb 2010, 2:20 pm

valkyrieraven88 wrote:
bdhkhsfgk wrote:
valkyrieraven88 wrote:
And if autism is just your brain not progressing after childhood, why are there autistic children? My mother knew there was "something wrong with me" when I was eighteen months old. My brain hadn't stopped progressing. In fact, the reason it was so difficult for me to be diagnosed is because although I had issues throughout my entire childhood, I went through all the normal physical and mental developments. I just had no social skills.


You're on to something there, in many autistics, the brain stops developing at a certain stage/level.


I was saying the exact opposite of what you said--it doesn't make sense that autism causes the brain to stop developing. My brain was different from the beginning. I went through normal developments. There was no point when I suddenly "stopped progressing." At the age where most children begin interacting socially I failed to do so properly. I was actually speaking and walking AHEAD of schedule. MY BRAIN IS STILL DEVELOPING. SO IS YOURS. SO IS EVERYONE'S UNTIL THEY TURN ABOUT 24. If the brain stopped developing, we would be called vegetables, not autistics. And you're a 17-year-old who clearly has no background suitable to making theories, so don't think you're going to unravel the great mystery that is autism. What causes it isn't important. What's important is to distribute information about it so that the symptoms are better understood and to improve the lives of autistic people by providing better services for them.

I might add, though, that brain scans have been done comparing autistic and non-autistic people's brains. These did not show that autistic people had the brains of children. They showed that they brains seemed to be functioning in different ways. Autistic people are said to have abnormal EEG's. Neurotypical children have normal EEG's.

I refute you thus!
Image


Autistic people's brain-wiring may function like it's wired to either two things;

1. Unable to develop more than to a certain point.

2. Delayed development, f.ex, not gaining social skills/a social life until adulthood.

One more thing, it's not 1st. April today.



valkyrieraven88
Sea Gull
Sea Gull

User avatar

Joined: 20 Jan 2010
Age: 36
Gender: Female
Posts: 222
Location: St. Louis, MO

18 Feb 2010, 2:34 pm

You have clearly missed the point of the picture included. Do you think I lack the ability to check the date at the bottom-right of my computer?

People who are autistic are not child-like. End of story. They are not mentally ret*d, they are not all suffering from some lack of brain development, they just so happened to develop differently.

You are posting this theory because you want to be completely sure that you are better than "low-functioning" autistics. You keep saying that you have Asperger's syndrome and not autism. You would continue to believe this even after someone proved you completely wrong because if you are correct that means that your brain has developed more than someone who can't speak. But just because someone can't speak or communicate effectively does not mean that they are behind in brain development. There are geniuses who are severely autistic. People who are severely autistic have been known to, over time, develop more social skills and move up into the "high-functioning" bracket.

All someone has to do to prove your argument invalid is to prove one exception to the rule. That means we have to find one autistic person whose brain is still developing. I am that autistic person.



bdhkhsfgk
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 May 2009
Age: 32
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,450

18 Feb 2010, 2:39 pm

valkyrieraven88 wrote:
You have clearly missed the point of the picture included. Do you think I lack the ability to check the date at the bottom-right of my computer?

People who are autistic are not child-like. End of story. They are not mentally ret*d, they are not all suffering from some lack of brain development, they just so happened to develop differently.

You are posting this theory because you want to be completely sure that you are better than "low-functioning" autistics. You keep saying that you have Asperger's syndrome and not autism. You would continue to believe this even after someone proved you completely wrong because if you are correct that means that your brain has developed more than someone who can't speak. But just because someone can't speak or communicate effectively does not mean that they are behind in brain development. There are geniuses who are severely autistic. People who are severely autistic have been known to, over time, develop more social skills and move up into the "high-functioning" bracket.

All someone has to do to prove your argument invalid is to prove one exception to the rule. That means we have to find one autistic person whose brain is still developing. I am that autistic person.


In some cases, mental retardation is linked to autism, even my psychiatrist said that, people with Down's syndrome, a form of mental retardation have autism, 1/3 if I remember correctly, but never Asperger syndrome.



j0sh
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 18 Nov 2008
Age: 47
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,191
Location: Tampa, Florida

18 Feb 2010, 2:51 pm

Image

I know it's tempting valkyrieraven88, but I think it's a trap.



ursaminor
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Age: 158
Gender: Male
Posts: 936
Location: Leiden, Netherlands

18 Feb 2010, 3:04 pm

Image