The paronormle

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but i am not hypnotically suggestible [shrink said i needed sodium thiopental to be induced] so i guess i will never know for sure. but i have always felt like an alien, in any case. or maybe i am just a "walk-in."

At no time did I suggest the objects were extra-terrestrial, the ones I saw almost on a daily basis (well nightly) appeared to be under intelligent control.

I think you are lumping all UFO conspiracy theorists together. I'm in the camp where I recognise it's obvious that not everyone can be lying and that a need for a systematic approach to this subject is long overdue. You obviously don't seem to pay any credence for the possibility of black operations funded by the National Security Agency (NSA). Perhaps it's in their interests to keep this topic on the fringe and those discussing it a laughing stock.

Given that most scientists agree that intelligent life, in all probability, exists in the universe, it's the height of arrogance to project our puny technology on aliens and make unscientific assumptions that aliens could not make the journey across the star constellations. Yes you can't prove that aliens operate these "alleged" exotic craft, but by the same token skeptics can't prove the opposite either.

Join the club!

IE 6.0 was the last browser 98se would handle. outlook express stopped working, so i had to go directly to hotmail which shortly afterwards stopped working on my system. countless websites bounced me off with words to the effect of "this website does not support your browser/OS- please upgrade your computer now." damned microsoft and its designed obsolescence racket!



that was my story also. i now use a w7 puter running celeron [veeeeeeerrrrrryyyyy sllllooooooowwwwwww....] with 2gb of cheap ram. they should not be allowed to sell this configuration, when it is common knowledge that w7 will NOT run properly on anything less than a P4 or equivalent, with a minimum of 4 gigs FAST ram. anything less is just a hot paperweight.


the problem with linux [for me] is that it won't run any of my programs, one has to find equivalent programs [which are non-existent for my particular apps]. reminds me of IBM warp which was a great fast stable OS but there were no programs for it that i used. so it is a choice of expensive but well-working [apple] or cheaper but buggy [microsoft] or linux [fine stable efficient OS but with almost no programs that i could use].



not really, it is the "paranormal" [outside of the normal] thread after all, and we both are definitely outside of the norm
cheers
bruce

The aliens I used to see (its been a long time) are green with red eyes and not the typical aliens you hear about. It wasn't all that clear because according to the docs because of my schizoaffective disorder it was probably just a hallucination. I only saw him for a few seconds. The UFO's I saw one that was making weird movements in the sky at night. It wouldn't move like a plane. It was just all over the place. I have seen some weird things during the day but they could have been stealth airplanes. How can we be alone in the Universe. That is physically impossible. When I saw the alien I was having a psychotic break though so it could have been just a hallucination but it doesn't change my belief that aliens definitely exist.

Well, I never sounded quite like that, Fnord. I never told people they were fat and needed to lose weight. When I read tarot cards, I told people stuff about themselves that I had no way of knowing, like what they did for a living and what kind of problems they were having.
People I talked to seemed to enjoy the babbling. They thought it weird I knew what I did.
And a lot of them didn't say one word, either, so there was none of that asking questions and having them do most the talking from my end. They were determined not to give anything away, lol. A good percentage of them were skeptical.
I would love talking to someone with true psychic ability but admit a good portion of "psychics" aren't really. I would enjoy talking to someone like myself.

The thing is, people claim to not believe in the paranormal but what we have now, technology wise, would have been considered paranormal thousands of years ago. In fact, paranormal could, one day, be science once technology catches up and the brain becomes better developed.
The paranormal is a gateway to advancement, mentally and technologically.

Well you got to understand that yes things do come from the mind anyone in the world can become a physhic or medium with alot of work put into it. But someone (like me for exsample: ) Is acsoley born with this there is no work put into it and things come to me alot of the time because im stronger then just some random person trying to do this stuff. people who are born with this have more of a tallent doing it because you could say its just how we were born.
we can do more and more things happen. but yes someone can learn but at a smaller point.
I have seen others who have learnd and its intoresting but i have never ran into someone who was stronger then the ones born to do it. Who has more activitey then the ones whom are born for it. Im someone who goes my both sinces and not sinces. If someone would like to ask me things or talk to me about things btw i have no problem with that its intotaneing and fun for me to do so mail me on here and i will be happy to talk to you about it.

Well done! It's also the title of a song by my all-time favorite band, King Crimson, and you can even hear it here: http://www.wrongplanet.net/postp3651293.html#3651293

I will probably change it soon, though. I got a million of em'

At no time did I wag my finger at you and call you a delusional idiot, either.

A nutcase is a nutcase is a nutcase ... ad infinitum.

We are in agreement, if only on this point.

You obviously have not read my posts, as there is none of them where I have stated that "Black Ops" are not involved.

Assuming that they already have is also an epitome of conceit of subjective validation, because as you said, "... a systematic approach to this subject is long overdue."

The fact that a negative claim (a.k.a., "Appeal to Ignorance") can not be proven does not validate an unprovable positive claim.

To go from "I seen some lights in the sky and I doesn't know what they was!" directly to "It's those danged extree-terrestricals!" is just plain stupidity.

To go from "I see some lights moving around in the sky" directly to "I wonder how I can find out what they are" is the beginning of science.

Besides, UFOs are not paranormal events, since they can be seen (and sometimes heard) with normal human senses.

Last edited by Fnord on 22 May 2011, 11:11 pm, edited 4 times in total.

Around 1000 years ago the process of chritianisation of Europe ensured that any indigenous knowledge relating to spirits, outer worlds, psychic abilities was largely wiped out or pushed to the fringe of society. What remained was blotted out during the catholic inquisition. What has emerged from the authoritarian rule of the church and blind faith to the pope is a form of rational science in the tradition of Plato, Galileo etc...that draws upon empirical knowledge of the universe based on observation using our faculties of sight and sound.

What we are re-discovering was probably old knowledge and while we can't explain it with our primitive methods of rationalised scientific investigation it will remain "paranormal".

What we are rediscovering remains nothing more than myth, legend, and apocryphal stories.

No valid material evidence exists to support any claims for the paranormal.

You should realize you may contradicted yourself here. On the one hand you entertain the idea of a conspiracy by an intelligence agency then refer to those who suspect a conspiracy as "nutcases".



Not necessarily an appeal to ignorance, on the contrary an appeal for further study.



Agreed, as I am an experiencer I know it's possible to see intelligently controlled lights biut have not made that leap of faith to call them "extra-terrestrial.



So we will take this as you accepting that various sized objects have buzzed around this planet scaring people.

Psychic power has been proven to take place in a laboratory through peer reviewed research
http://veritas.arizona.edu/
A famous study in the University Arizona found students in a different building could influence the emotions of other students in a different building by precipitating a significant spike in anxiety at the exact moment they were told to focus negative thoughts on Student A or Student B. The problem at this point is the mechanism is not understood.

Various police departments around the world make use of psychics.
http://www.theage.com.au/news/national/ ... 67666.html
http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Psychic's ... 0118097595

Of course they are not supposed to....

"Black Ops" are not conspiracies - they are government-sponsored operations that the general public does not need to know anything about.

Read up on the fallacies of reason. The Appeal to Ignorance has nothing to do with studying a problem, only with claiming that since a claim can not be disproven, then it must be valid. Equivocation is also a tool used by conspiracy theorists...

I have also seen objects that I could not identify flying in the sky. Nothing paranormal about them; they were either dark dots in the daytime sky, or lighted dots in the night-time sky. Either way, there is not even any proof that they were under intelligent control. Sometimes, balloons and chinese lanterns may look like they're doing fancy maneuvers, but what is most likely happening is "eyeball drift". What's more, estimates of speed are highly dependent on estimates of range, and without accurate range measurements, the size, speed, and direction of travel can not be accurately measured.

No, we will take this statement as saying that UFOs are not paranormal events, since they can be seen (and sometimes heard) with normal human senses.

What does happen, however, is that people fear the unknown, and that other, equally ignorant people will feed those fears with stories of anal-probing aliens, chemtrail-spewing Black Ops vehicles, and sinister conspiracies behind it all.

Empiricism and rationalism al a cartes. Science has already reached the conclusion not everything can be explained by mathematical formulae.

Where is the peer review? All I read are a collection of self-serving claims.

The "mechanism" is easily understood once you realize that there is only one person on the project with any credentials to support the claims; and that person just happens to be the only person making those claims. Plus, no one else has been able to replicate his results under the same conditions. Since his claims can not be validated, then it is safe to assume that they are invalid.

Those same police departments deny the use of psychics when questioned directly by real journalists. Crimes are solved by the application and practice of forensic science, not by some con-artist with a ouija board and a deck of tarot cards.

As I have stated elsewhere, I had a $1000 challenge that I ran for about 25 years. All that a person had to do was to accurately describe the location of a container, the container itself, and what was inside the container - all of which I'd chosen on January 1st of each year. The candidate could use whatever alleged paranormal or alleged psychic means that he or she deemed necessary - telepathy, spirit channeling, precognition, et cetera.

In 25 years, not one person had even come close. Oh sure, they had offered a dumpload of excuses (and quite frankly, I've heard them all), but not one had collected the $1000 prize.

Better yet, James Randi has his Million-Dollar Challenge, so why don't you go round up your psychic friends and have them give it a go for an equal share of the prize money? Probably because the demonstrations would have to be performed in front of skeptics that have already seen just about every method of cheating and fraud there is from people who claim that psychic abilities and paranormal events are real.

Unless someone collects the prize, there is no reason for anyone to believe that there is any valid physical evidence for the paranormal, and unless someone demonstrates their alleged psychic abilities in a controlled laboratory setting, and submits to peer-group review BEFORE publication, then I say that their claims are invalid.

Give it up, kid. Without a demonstration, there is no validation.