14 Jul 2006, 11:40 am
14 Jul 2006, 12:13 pm
14 Jul 2006, 12:20 pm
14 Jul 2006, 12:30 pm
riley wrote:
Anna wrote:
You're right - female aspies don't exist, to the general public. This is one reason to make a calendar that includes both male and female aspies, so that more aspie females can get diagnosed appropriately, rather than ignored. Sounds like a clear benefit to me.
There are other ways for this issue to become more public.
Quote:
I'm not sure I understand how a picture of, me for example, in a calendar, could possibly cause negative repurcussions for you. No one said you have to pose, so, how does my choice exploit you? Please explain.
Anna
mother, veteran, minister, programmer, author
Anna
mother, veteran, minister, programmer, author
I did earlier.. please read the entire thread to see the context of my objections if you haven't already. My main point is how having women in lingerie or swimsuits [MrMark's original suggestion]
Okay - so you're fixated (in typical aspie fashion
on the swimsuit thing. I had gone beyond that to the more recent idea of both women and men and whatever they wanted to be posing with/in. For example, my pose would probably be with a barbell, a computer, and a bunch of books around, showing my interests.
Personally, I don't have a problem with women choosing to pose in swimsuits but I understand a lot of women seem to, so I think it would probably be a bad idea for this calendar. Not because it exploits women, but because some women here feel uncomfortable with it representing us.
So, are you against the idea of a calendar in general or just against a swimsuit picture in the calendar?
Anna
14 Jul 2006, 12:33 pm
14 Jul 2006, 12:35 pm
riley wrote:
I did earlier.. please read the entire thread to see the context of my objections if you haven't already. My main point is how having women in lingerie or swimsuits [MrMark's original suggestion] would make male aspies look more cool. Aspie's are known for the mental attributes.. not their physical ones. Now.. say if you posed in a bikini representing a 'typical' female aspie.. how would that make life easier for other female aspies? It just reinforces NT standards of women.. [ie. pretty=mindless] if you [for example] chose to pose in MrMark's way you would be responsible for perpetuating NT expectations.. and ignoring the opportunity that exists in turning the stereotype of the 'gifted' aspie [usually male].. into gifted female aspie. All women would benefit from that.
For the record.. if aspie women wanted to do such a calendar as an expression rather than the 'sex sells' motivation I'd have no problem with it.. but I think perhaps we are capable of more than just posing and should let the world benefit. Perhaps a variation of the idea.. a book with short poems superimposed over pics of the authors [themed accordingly]?
For the record.. if aspie women wanted to do such a calendar as an expression rather than the 'sex sells' motivation I'd have no problem with it.. but I think perhaps we are capable of more than just posing and should let the world benefit. Perhaps a variation of the idea.. a book with short poems superimposed over pics of the authors [themed accordingly]?
I feel you're making a very big generalization when you talk about "NT standards of women". That furthers a negative stereotype about people w/out aspergers. But you like stereotypes....
(j/k that wasn't meant as an attack. i'm just trying to liven the mood by teasing.)
14 Jul 2006, 12:49 pm
Anna wrote:
Okay - so you're fixated (in typical aspie fashion on the swimsuit thing.
on the swimsuit thing.I'm still on about that as MrMark originally asserted that it would be culturally good for us and refused to elaborate. I'm always skeptical of men who suggest women can empower themselves by wearing lingerie or swimsuits. He's right in a way.. but power is relative and money can't buy everything.
Quote:
Personally, I don't have a problem with women choosing to pose in swimsuits but I understand a lot of women seem to, so I think it would probably be a bad idea for this calendar. Not because it exploits women, but because some women here feel uncomfortable with it representing us.
Fair enough.
Quote:
So, are you against the idea of a calendar in general or just against a swimsuit picture in the calendar?
Hmm. I'm against [the possibility of] blokes here trying to get women to post pics of themselves in lingrie or swimsuits under the pretence that it's for a calander for charity. Like I said I'm a skeptic.
Last edited by riley on 14 Jul 2006, 2:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
14 Jul 2006, 1:01 pm
Alex,
Please review my thread on female intelligence. I expect an essay on this subject by the end of the week.
14 Jul 2006, 3:16 pm
riley wrote:
Anna wrote:
Okay - so you're fixated (in typical aspie fashion on the swimsuit thing.
on the swimsuit thing.I'm still on about that as MrMark originally asserted that it would be culturally good for us and refused to elaborate. I'm always skeptical of men who suggest women can empower themselves by wearing lingerie or swimsuits. He's right in a way.. but power is relative and money can't buy everything.
I think the idea of women being portrayed as both intelligent *and* sexy is a good thing. But, what do I know - I'm wierd.
I tend to do all the "bad" things that good girls aren't supposed to do - joining the army, shooting guns for fun, programming computers, and, yes, posing in lingerie for pay (actually mostly for the fun of it, but I certainly wasn't going to pose for free. My time is valuable.) I didn't consider any of those disempowering, certainly not to me.
Having a brain doesn't mean I can't also be desirable. It shouldn't have to be either/or. I don't like the either/or thinking of "either you respect a woman's brains or you view her as sexy". I consider it a false dichotomy and have fought against it for most of my life. I consider too many self-described feminists to have fallen into this trap, and am disappointed whenever I see it.
Yes - there is widespread exploitation and oppression of women. Lets fight it. But lets fight for women being able to have *more* choices, not fewer ones. Personally, I'm a big fan of women like Susie Bright, to give you an idea of where I'm coming from. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susie_Bright)
14 Jul 2006, 3:31 pm
MrMark wrote:
For the answers to these and other questions, we need an editorial committee. CockneyRebel has formally expressed willingness to serve. Alex, Juliekitty, and Hadapurpura appear to remain undecided. I have received no other nominations for editorial committee.
Mark says:
“i'll probably be a little shy about taking on a project of this magnitude or controversial nature (though i never imagined it would be so controversial, guess i'm naive) in the future, at least with this group. i mean attacking ideas is one thing, but the personal attacks are uncalledfor, but i guess that's politics…
…it's not that it's such a grand idea or that people shuned it, i just thought it was a little idea worth discussing, it kinda snowballed, it's that it all became so personal”
Mark says:
“i'll probably be a little shy about taking on a project of this magnitude or controversial nature (though i never imagined it would be so controversial, guess i'm naive) in the future, at least with this group. i mean attacking ideas is one thing, but the personal attacks are uncalledfor, but i guess that's politics…
…it's not that it's such a grand idea or that people shuned it, i just thought it was a little idea worth discussing, it kinda snowballed, it's that it all became so personal”
Are you actually suggesting tabling all questions of values, goals and strategy to committees yet to be formed?
14 Jul 2006, 5:47 pm
blondie wrote:
I really like the idea I am for it!! 
So you’re a cop trolling WP for pedophiles, right? Good thing too, what with all these vulnerable aspies around. Keep up the good work. Anna wrote:
… posing in lingerie for pay (actually mostly for the fun of it…
I’d ask you to send me a picture, but Riley might get the wrong idea, or the right one. It’s so hard for me to know the mind of another. AaronAgassi wrote:
Are you actually suggesting tabling all questions of values, goals and strategy to committees yet to be formed?
No, I’m suggesting I don’t have all the answers. Do you have a specific suggestion as to how we should proceed?
14 Jul 2006, 5:53 pm
14 Jul 2006, 6:18 pm
14 Jul 2006, 6:35 pm
14 Jul 2006, 6:38 pm
MrMark wrote:
Anna wrote:
… posing in lingerie for pay (actually mostly for the fun of it…
I’d ask you to send me a picture, but Riley might get the wrong idea, or the right one. It’s so hard for me to know the mind of another. When and if you guys get a calendar request for submissions together, I'll send a photo to the committee - but it won't be in lingerie. More likely workout gear for weightlifting.
14 Jul 2006, 6:53 pm
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