Would you abort your baby if...

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Sex without sexual intercourse is not as much fun or satisfying for many people. And there was herbal birth control in the past as well. Certain herbal drinks will prevent conception. Just like other birth control, it was not always 100% effective.

Aspies won't be exterminated because there is no prenatal test for any type of Autism. Prenatal tests screen for physical abnormalities.

1. no-one's killing babies when they get an abortion
2. Aspies won't be exterminated because there is no simple set of genes that trigger autism and they will probably not be able to develop prenatal screening for it, ever.
3. Even if autism was wiped off the face of the planet, what of it? The downside I can think of is a loss of genetic diversity amongst humans, which would be bad in evolutionary terms. However, the prospect doesn't fill me with moral outrage, as it seems to do to other people on the spectrum. I think it would be a stupid thing to do, but not an immoral one.

You think I give a damn about the human race? I don't care about it anymore than I care about any other species. I abhor anthrocentricism or however you spell it. By the way I find the extinction of anything to be the absolute worse act possible, morally. Lets just say that someone decided to take every person you cared about, and then killed them. How would that not be a horrible moral outrage? I'm not saying I only care about aspies, its just a comparison. How horrible it would be if every person like you was to be gotten rid of for the sole reason that they were like you. Genocide is always extremely immoral.

We're not talking about killing aspies, the eugenics that would take place if they ever (highly unlikely) discovered a prenatal test would be the type that stopped aspies coming into being. Why do you care about hypothetical people? You can only commit genocide on people who are actually alive. I couldn't give a damn about non-existent future people who might be a bit like me because they'd have the same disorder - but that's just me.

I'm very humanistic, btw...but I do respect other life-forms because we can't exist independently of the rest of our ecosystem.

Imagine a world without tigers. Wouldn't be a sad world without tigers?

No, it would be a world without tigers. It would be bad for biodiversity and possibly mess up a few ecosystems, but species go extinct all the time without it really having any effect on the happiness level of the world.

Plus, I see autism as a disability. So a more accurate analogy would be, 'imagine a world without blind people, wouldn't it be a sad world without blind people?'. Well, actually, no, it wouldn't. There are more good things about being on the autistic spectrum than there are about being blind, but my point stands.

Well I...I don't want to debate anymore. I'm not getting anywhere and now I feel like I'm on the verge of some sort of mental break down.

Fair enough.

Take care of yourself. I hope you feel better soon. I don't want to make anyone upset.

If you lost a debate just say so, don't give the /guy this I don't want to do this anymore crap.

Some people should just not have children, NT, Aspie, able bodied, disabled or anything. They probably shouldn't be allowed pets either
Lots of people do choose to have children though when there's a good chance of them being something other than NT. My brother was a test tube baby for older parents and was much more likely to have ASD or Down Syndrome but when people really want a child they don't mind what quirks they're given. Sometimes its really frustrating and my parents feel sad for him but he's totally awesome and none of us would replace him or want him any other way.

And for those saying prenatal tests only check for physical deformities that's simply not true. Amniocentesis and Chorionic villus sampling (I've probably made spelling mistakes there) can be used for DNA analysis in cases where there is a family history of genetic problems-physical or otherwise. I think the cut off point for abortions is way too late and I really disapprove of women who use it as some sort of emergency contraception but equally it is better for a life to be ended before it was properly aware of itself than to be pushed into a life where he or she isn't wanted and won't be properly cared for. This thread makes me sad.

It's just natural for parents to want a ''normal'', healthy child. Yes, maybe lots of parents with disabled children believe that it's a blessing, which is probably true. But if you're the type of person who lacks in confidence and you can't be doing with abnormality, but you're still fit to be a loving parent, then it's just best to have an NT child, one born with no psychological differences.

Even with DNA analysis, they can't identify autism because it's too complex.
I think the cut-off point for abortions is fine but I do think it's much better to use other forms of contraception and use them properly. I agree that it's the lesser of two evils to abort an unwanted child, but it's still not a good thing. However, I don't judge women who get an abortion for whatever reason because I'm not concerned with other people's personal lives.
I'm weirdly emotionless when it comes to this topic.

Well I believe that aborting a predicted Autistic child is actually being kind because how many parents get emotional when finding out their child has Autism? And also depression, anxiety, stress and lonliness is more common in Autistics, and I really don't want my child to have more chance of feeling like this. I just suffer with mild AS, but I'm not happy with it. Even though my mum always told me as a child that I'm very special and that I'm a lovely person, and she's probably right, but it still doesn't make me any less miserable being me. Maybe being a lovely person isn't so great because people just take advantage of me and I'm very unsure of how to be nice but assertive at the same time. I really don't want to bring up another child who has more chance of being bullied, isolated, left out, used, teased, etc. And it's worse if the child is very mild like me, because then they're more likely to be more aware of the NT world and is forced to take part in NT society because they're too ''normal'' to receive the support they really need once they're adults, but too ''disabled'' to do all the things they want to do, like socialise, study, hold down a steady job, or other things. And being aware of what you're missing out on makes you even more miserable.

I can't socialise because of these stupid vibes I know I give off that will make me rejected. I can't study very well because I find it hard to stay focused on anything, even if it's something I'm interested in. This will be my forth year on jobseekers, because I can't seem to find anything suitable - everything out there has something that doesn't coincide with my needs and anxieties. It's hell being me.

You don't know how many folks I know/met, who have said their "disabled" child was a blessing/gift from above/insert Politically Correct Mommy statement here/ and had their marriage/relationships go down in flames. Obviously the SO wasn't on the same page and cut mom and the kid loose. The SO will cut the child support check, but want nothing to do with the special needs child. The breaking point with one of my relative's marriage, is when the 5 year old was wearing diapers to school, still had a feeding tube (PEG) and all the issues that comes with the tube. Dad just peaced out. He wanted his sport star son, and that was never going to happen. He wanted his son the doctor, lawyer, successful business man, and that would never happen. (son is moderately mentally disabled-mom is hoping he can stay out of a group home when older, college will most likely never be an option for him.)

Not everyone likes children. Or tolerates them. Or can handle the usual BS that comes with a NT kid.

I'll just address having an ASD kid. If you were told pre pregnancy, you will

1) spend the rest of your life fighting with insurance companies, school systems, family members over things your ASD child wants and needs to survive.
2) spend the rest of your life hearing judgemental BS on the reason your kid isn't "normal" is because your your sh*tty parenting skills
3) burning hours away in therapists, doctors and other assort clinical setting, with no clue any of it is worth while or helpful
4) you'll be on the receiving end of the worse behavior because you kid held it together all day at school, and at home is the only place he/she can let loose
5) you hope and pray she/he will be able to support him/herself with a decent job when they are adults.

That's probably not everything, but who would say (all things being equal), hell yeah? Very very few people would. I'm guessing people on the spectrum, who have been there, done that might, but Joe Critter Six Pack? Not so much. ASD children have wonderful, numerous qualities which really get lost in the day and and day out struggle of life. After the 5th nasty gram of the month from the teacher how Sally had another meltdown, and now "you might have to find another school situation for her", it has to be hard to appreciate your ASD child's sensitive soul, wonderful artistic abilities etc. I'm sure the parent is thinking "F*ck me, another battle I gotta wage AGAIN."

I'm not going to judge people who truly look at themselves, and their situation and say "Nope, can't do it." In a perfect world, Society would make it easier for all families with special needs kids. Insurance companies wouldn't view the children as money sinks, fight tooth and nail not to cover a thing. Society would have a little more tolerance for differences. I don't see any of that changing in the US in the next ten years.

Would I have an abortion if the magically test for any and all mental and physical disabilities was around? I'd say no today, but my situation is stable. If my life was a roaring hot mess, totally unstable with no support, can't say I wouldn't entertain the thought.

I didn't lose the debate, as there is no winning or loosing. I got to the point where I realized that are philosophies on everything is fundamentally different, so debating was pointless, and trying to find the foundation for these philosophies when in reality there is nothing substantial was causing me great anxiety.

Actually, for me, the child's sensitive soul is another burden to add to your list. On top of fighting for your child, you're fighting to ward off abuse to the most sensitive, giving, loving person you've ever met. You're a human shield. It's heartbreaking.
I don't blame people who say they wouldn't be able to do it either, but it breaks my heart even more to imagine I could have thought "no, no way, that's too much heartbreak for me, not gonna do it", if I had known beforehand. I could possibly have thought that, I have no idea , but it scares me retrospectively, truth is, I don't think I'd have much faith in humanity if I didn't know my son.