Could they like us?

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I think cutting slack and active liking go hand in hand. People tend to cut slack for people they like, as well as for people they don't know but can see need it. In the bullying threads, it always comes up that people hate and fear (and attack) what they don't understand. The positive flip side of that is people tend to like (and befriend) what (or who) they do understand.

That part of it is (fortunately?) not an AS-only symptom.

I have gotten along with, or not gotten along with, folks in the rest of the world probably in the usual percentages.
As far as I can tell.
But then I don't have the intensest form of AS - that may have something to do with it.

What is funny in sad sort of way is that I have a friend with Schizophrenia whom sometimes I find myself looking down upon. One would think that with my having Bipolar and AS, I'd be a little more, oh what's the word to use?, open, generous, grace-giving, accepting, that way.
But then may it be on account of AS that interacting with him wears me out quickly which then negatively affects my attitude?
But, dammit, he is my friend.
And has certainly confirmed that when I have been in serious trouble.

Therein may be a factor in the thread topic. AS people often quickly wear out trying to live on the "This Other Planet" and interact with the "local NaTives".
Uncertainty about how to deal with those of us visiting from "our planet" may create. enough discomfort that they'd rather not bother.
Which is a thing that also flows the reverse direction.

I voted "I don't know". The fact that they can understand and commiserate doesn't necessarily mean you'll be one of their first choices to go grab a beer together. Or that they'll reflect back on an evening with you and think what wonderful fun they had. We're still the same verbose, egocentric, one-track minded, other-oblivious, no-whitelying people.

There is that. But on the other hand, if people know it's a wiring difference they won't take it so personally. Part of the problem is NT's emotional reaction to things like bluntness or verbosity which is the emotional reaction of taking it personally. Verbosity? They think "she thinks my ideas aren't important so she won't listen to them because she thinks they're inferior to her ideas." Bluntness and no white lies? They think "ouch! why did you say that to me?" Learning about wiring differences makes it easier not to take these things so personally and that's got to help. Liking a person who's wired differently is easier than liking a person who seems to be wired just the same yet yet says hurtfully blunt things. It's the difference in percieved intention.

That's true of course. But then there are things like being embarrassed in public, and being seen with the alien, and having to hear things you'd rather be lied to about. How many NTs prefer, say - the lack of white lies of an Aspie to the diplomacy of an NT? Can education/enlightenment change such deeply-rooted values/preferences?

It can't change it in everybody. But if it changes it in just a couple people, you've got your beer buddies right there (or whatever).

I think "being seen with the alien" will be a dealbreaker for teens. But adults have all kinds of friends. There are adult subcultures where "who you're seen with" is a great big deal. But I doubt Aspies are in those subcultures anyway. As for the lack of white lies, weirdly enough I think many people would be ok with it if they knew in advance that you were a person who literally couldn't tell white lies. There are some NT people who say "can I be honest with you?" and then use that as a springboard to saying something really intentionally hurtful and cruel. I strongly suspect that what is often happening is that Aspies are being confused with those particular NT people and being judged harshly for it. Since deliberate witholding of white lies is an NT intentional-cruelty tactic, Aspies who just do it by nature will be misperceived as those NTs. Once people understand that it is wiring and not intentional cruelty (as it is with some NTs), it will be seen in a more benign light- but just for Aspies who disclose this about themselves.

And this arrogant attitude is why I don't post much. "Could They Like Us?" With rude replies like that, doubtful.

Cosmiccat, I like your posts.

From my general experience in the whole of life, Greentea is not arrogant but quite correct - it's posts which provoke reactions, reactions of some sort, of any sort, which draw responses/reactions.

Think about it, it's out of the ordinary news, novels, television, movies, artworks, house designs, car designs, airplane designs, fashion designs, music, which create the most "buzz".
Anything else is usually labeled by the critics in that genre as bland, tame, uninspired, humdrum, mundane, et cetera.

I can really really relate to this. You just described every friendship I've ever had. Also, it's always the people who dislike me the most in step 2 that end up liking me the most in step 3.

If you can overcome their fear. some few do try, they want to know different, perhaps to learn how different, others threaten different, for they feel threatened.

But as for friends? That is a television show. People move toward safe, and they hence move toward the least threat, for gaining understanding takes work, and understanding the likes of us is outside their range.

Even between us, cosmiccat is a great and talented painter and poet, but I say nothing.

I seem to lack social skills or something.

We may cross paths here, but each is on their own path. I once compared it to the Corona of a star, the star being the world, and us being the light going out, each on a seperate path.

We are just dealing with problem one, self knowledge and acceptance, and that is a lot, even with the others here, I read, learn, but lack connection.

I like it here, it is much different than where I have been, less annoying, but I never learned to grow closer. I have found some acceptance, that is the best so far. I have also run into what I left, so I have a hit and git posting style, where once I did try to be part of a group.

I put forth some trust, it did not work out, I am alone.

Didn't vote yet.

There's a dance NTs do. I sort of have 2 friends, and both of them are popular. We've all lived in the same area for 20 years. Each of them has probably 30+ friends, and 100+ acquaintances. One is a man who used me, and then totally ignored me when I asked for his help. He seems to consider everything is fine between us, even though I rather detest him now. The other is a woman who I've recently been spending time with. She knows about my AS, and has been coaching me regarding social mistakes. Such a tutor is immensely helpful.

She has indicated how I often blurt things out without giving it much thought. Now she is teaching me that NTs would take what I say differently than what I intended. My brutal honestly is seen as selfish, arrogant, rude, harsh, thoughtless, hurtful, and 2 dozen other terrible adjectives. I'm learning how I tend to project an attitude of impatience, negativity, no compromise, and self-involvement---simply with the tone of my voice (non-verbal information NTs are highly sensitive to). Ugh! I didn't think I was that bad.

Also, I like to quit right in the middle of a dance....Which is considered the height of rudeness by NTs. I don't bother to learn the proper steps of the dance and expect my partner to adapt to me! When they don't try to accommodate my innovative dance steps, I figure they don't like me....but what can I expect when the only dance in town is the NT dance?

I think NTs only tolerate me when I give them something they need, or when I'm doing them a favor. They feel no need to reciprocate, or show their appreciation for what I do for them, because they don't need my friendship. I, on the other hand, would like to have a few friends.

What these two NTs have in common is being friendly, cheerful, pleasant and charming....something I've never been able to pull off very well...

In order for NTs to like me, I'm going to have to think before I speak, and also learn to project kindness, understanding and patience...

I suppose my problem is the same.

But it's always puzzled me how NTs prefer the genuinely selfish, arrogant, rude, harsh, thoughtless, hurtful people over those who only seem so. Their trust in appearances more than in essence. At the end, the genuinely nasty destroy huge chunks of their lives, and they wonder why they made such a mistake. I answer to them: "because you believe more in appearances than in essence."

Thanks Spooky13 and thanks Inventor.

Quoted for truth and great justice!

I have noticed this pattern from time to time as well with my posts. Occasionally I'll make what I think is an insightful or thought-provoking comment but will get no replies. I'm more likely to get an acknowledgment with a post such as where I am quoted and the response is, "I feel exactly like this."

It's definitely not rejection. I think that many here (me included) have a tendency to talk at each other rather than truly engage in dialog. This isn't necessarily a bad thing, and I think to a certain extent it comes with an AS forum. I think we are more eager to share our own personal experiences and opinions with the world (sort of in lecture fashion) and not be as strong at reciprocating conversation.

I usually read every post in the thread (unless it's a dissertation), consider the person's opinions and experiences fairly thoroughly, and move on to the next. If you are describing your personal experience or viewpoint and I don't respond to it, it's either because I can't relate to it or don't have anything additional to say, or that your response simply hasn't brought questions to my mind. It doesn't mean that I did not find your post valuable.

Quoting Fiddlerpianist:

"I feel exactly like this."

All joking aside Fiddlerpianist, this is a very insightful post and I feel enlightened by it.

And Inventor, if you are still reading this thread, it's good to see you back. When I saw your previous post I thought immediately of Lazarus and said to myself, "yay, he's back from the dead." I will never forget your "new fangled stickyism".