The cult of positive thinking, and the economic collapse

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EnglishInvader
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05 Dec 2009, 7:52 am

There is a difference between "positive thinking" and living in a dream world. The former is based on tangible progress and reasonable expectations while the latter is based on fantasy and self-delusion.



Odin
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05 Dec 2009, 5:33 pm

The cult of positive thinking is dangerously insane. I've read that in many companies you are punished if you criticize delusional positive-thinking group-think.


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TheDoctor82
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06 Dec 2009, 12:20 am

Actually no...what happened was the same thing that's been happening since Day 1:

humans are not responsible creatures, and when it comes to finances, fagghetaboutit.

there have been so many bad economies at this point in time, it's not even funny. Had nothing to do with the Optimism cult or the Gozer worshippers, or what have you.

It's the same sh*t it always is because people don't understand how to manage their money; never have, and as long as we're at this point in evolution, they're not going to.

Understand: they can't manage their finances, and they won't embrace pure capitalism.

You expected another outcome?



Greentea
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06 Dec 2009, 12:25 am

The "positive thinking" era started about 15 years ago and was bound to end at some point. I told this to my therapist about 10 years ago. I told her everyone was so brainwashed by it that I couldn't utter an intelligent/critical/analytical/realistic word because everyone would jump on me with the "think positive!" bark. It was a tool of control of the masses, just like any other tool. Now that this one has proved to be more damaging to the powers that be than fruitful, they'll brainwash the herd with some other nonsense for the next 20 years. The "you must go with the flow" and "just flow with the current!" era overlapped with the "think positive!" one, till people started to rebel against it saying: "dead fish flow with the current!" One of the reasons I went into reclusion some years ago was that I couldn't stand people scolding me for thinking realistically instead of only chatting about pleasant, optimistic stuff. I used to tell them that acknowledging reality and believing in the ability to improve it is more positive thinking than trying to distort it to oneself and believing nothing can be done about it. I was called a whacko for it, and my friend when she entered the "The Secret" cult dropped me immediately like a hot iron. That was a few years ago, and she's still in the same mud of a life, so it was obviously not my realistic influence that was keeping her in the mud.

No one was ever able to think positive all the time during these 15 years. All that was created was a culture where people were more alienated from each other than ever, because they were all supposed to meet with others only when they were feeling happy, upbeat and optimistic/positive, so people became isolated when they most needed others, or they established extremely phony relationships where everyone was pretending to be positive and keeping their realities and critical thoughts secret.

And yes, if you analyze the situation and try to find a solution at your job in a company, instead of flashing a huge smile and saying: "Everything will work out great!" you're soon fired. It happened to me 15 years ago for the first time. Then I learned better. Still, in my job before last I was fired, among other group-think reasons, for not smiling enough.


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Greentea
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06 Dec 2009, 12:43 am

I forgot what I most wanted to say: I firmly believe it's the "think positive!" era that "unearthed" the Aspies, diagnosed them as disordered and sent them to hide on disability benefits. I firmly believe that it's our analytical talent, coupled with our candid telling the truth, our "the king is nude" attitude, that's a threat to the powers that be and their "think positive!" brainwashing. The "think positive!" era pervaded all sectors of the population - the rich bought it, so did the poor, the middle-class, all faiths and lifestyles - but what's most devastating is that the alternative streams all bought it, even more fiercely than the mainstream, and so there was not one voice speaking reality (except us, brainwashing-oblivious Aspies). The counter cultures bought it en masse and even became the enforcers, which destroyed the circles of thinkers that had always existed until then (writers, philosophers, bohemians, artists, theater people) and who had always been kept before as an important part of society that wouldn't let society stray too much. The intellectuals' cafes disappeared, and those younger than me here won't even know what I'm talking about, but those around my age will remember those places where thinkers gathered and analyzed stuff and wrote and performed.

Everyone has known for years that the "think positive!" is nonsense. But only now, when not pressured by the shepherds to continue paying lip service to it, are some voices starting to dare say it's actually not such a good idea.


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06 Dec 2009, 12:46 am

Greentea wrote:
The "positive thinking" era started about 15 years ago and was bound to end at some point. I told this to my therapist about 10 years ago. I told her everyone was so brainwashed by it that I couldn't utter an intelligent/critical/analytical/realistic word because everyone would jump on me with the "think positive!" bark. It was a tool of control of the masses, just like any other tool. Now that this one has proved to be more damaging to the powers that be than fruitful, they'll brainwash the herd with some other nonsense for the next 20 years. The "you must go with the flow" and "just flow with the current!" era overlapped with the "think positive!" one, till people started to rebel against it saying: "dead fish flow with the current!" One of the reasons I went into reclusion some years ago was that I couldn't stand people scolding me for thinking realistically instead of only chatting about pleasant, optimistic stuff. I used to tell them that acknowledging reality and believing in the ability to improve it is more positive thinking than trying to distort it to oneself and believing nothing can be done about it. I was called a whacko for it, and my friend when she entered the "The Secret" cult dropped me immediately like a hot iron. That was a few years ago, and she's still in the same mud of a life, so it was obviously not my realistic influence that was keeping her in the mud.

No one was ever able to think positive all the time during these 15 years. All that was created was a culture where people were more alienated from each other than ever, because they were all supposed to meet with others only when they were feeling happy, upbeat and optimistic/positive, so people became isolated when they most needed others, or they established extremely phony relationships where everyone was pretending to be positive and keeping their realities and critical thoughts secret.

And yes, if you analyze the situation and try to find a solution at your job in a company, instead of flashing a huge smile and saying: "Everything will work out great!" you're soon fired. It happened to me 15 years ago for the first time. Then I learned better. Still, in my job before last I was fired, among other group-think reasons, for not smiling enough.


Actually, Greentea, the "positive thinking" thing started back I believe during the 1970s.

Ya gotta understand another reason people follow this sh*t: they want easy answers in life, they want to think as little as possible, and have a lot of personal issues they'd rather not deal with directly and overcome.

It's a thing one has to be of very weak will to get caught up in. That...pretty much sums up humanity though...


Kinda reminds me of that whole belief about people having "too much self-esteem"; there's no such thing.

Those douchebags don't have too much of it, just a false sense of it. Praising them when they're wrong won't make them truly feel good; it also sends the signal to them that no one thinks they're capable of truly accomplishing anything.

Yet another "wonderful" idea that totally backfires.

It reminds me of when I used to get certificates from events just for participating; I did not feel good about getting those, let me tell ya; I knew I did a lousy job, and didn't really earn it.



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06 Dec 2009, 12:50 am

Greentea wrote:
I forgot what I most wanted to say: I firmly believe it's the "think positive!" era that "unearthed" the Aspies, diagnosed them as disordered and sent them to hide on disability benefits. I firmly believe that it's our analytical talent, coupled with our candid telling the truth, our "the king is nude" attitude, that's a threat to the powers that be and their "think positive!" brainwashing. The "think positive!" era pervaded all sectors of the population - the rich bought it, so did the poor, the middle-class, all faiths and lifestyles - but what's most devastating is that the alternative streams all bought it, even more fiercely than the mainstream, and so there was not one voice speaking reality (except us, brainwashing-oblivious Aspies). The counter cultures bought it en masse and even became the enforcers, which destroyed the circles of thinkers that had always existed until then (writers, philosophers, bohemians, artists, theater people) and who had always been kept before as an important part of society that wouldn't let society stray too much. The intellectuals' cafes disappeared, and those younger than me here won't even know what I'm talking about, but those around my age will remember those places where thinkers gathered and analyzed stuff and wrote and performed.

Everyone has known for years that the "think positive!" is nonsense. But only now, when not pressured by the shepherds to continue paying lip service to it, are some voices starting to dare say it's actually not such a good idea.


wrong again...that would be accredited to the Hippies and the "Political correctness" movement that was established in the 1960s.

but if you really want to know the culprit who started it all....his name was Emmanuel Kant; he is the father of the Post-Modernist philosophy movement.

Of course, most of his ideas come from the Pre-Modernist movement, and all of that basically winds up deriving from human stupidity and anti-rational/pro-faith philosophies.

And those, my dear Greentea...ho ho....pretty much since Day 1.

Seriously, if you want to understand humans, just listen to what Magneto--foe of the X-Men always says about 'em; he's right, apparently!



Greentea
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06 Dec 2009, 12:51 am

We are in the DSM because, for "them", we're not right in the head. Someone right in the head is brainwashable. We Autistics are not.


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06 Dec 2009, 12:58 am

Greentea wrote:
We are in the DSM because, for "them", we're not right in the head. Someone right in the head is brainwashable. We Autistics are not.



Ok, so who cares what they think?

did you happen to read what I said in the thread about spontaneity?

If not....I recommend you read it...I think you'd find it very interesting.

Why? Read it and see..it'll make things a lot more understandable.

And if you're honestly afraid of dealing with the world with them running it, there is an easy way to deal with the world despite that:

read the 48 Laws of Power; learn them, and observe how people follow them. Use them to your advantage, and others will be putty in your hands.



EnglishInvader
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06 Dec 2009, 6:31 am

TheDoctor82 wrote:
fagghetaboutit.


I believe it's spelt fuhgeddaboudit :lol: .



Wiedinmyer
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06 Dec 2009, 5:03 pm

Odin wrote:
The cult of positive thinking is dangerously insane. I've read that in many companies you are punished if you criticize delusional positive-thinking group-think.


Hans Christian Andersen, of course, has the story about the Emperor and his birthday suit. Con man comes and tells him that he'll make him an outfit from materials that have the magical property of being invisible to anyone who is incompetent or unfit for his position. Said materials being nonexistent. The Emperor and all of the townspeople, though, are loathe to admit that they don't see anything. They don't want to let others know that they might be incompetent. It isn't until a child laughs at the Emperor strutting down the street naked that the people are willing to admit that they're being idiots. They then drive the tailor from the town.

The ancient Greeks have a variant of this story. Within the Pythagorean cult, numbers were considered to have mystical properties and certain ideas about them were sacrosant. One of these ideas was that all numbers could be expressed as the ratio of any two other numbers. One of the Pythagoreans, Hippasus, uses the Pythagoreans' own logic and starting axioms to disprove this idea. The Pythagoreans were also loathe to admit that they might be wrong. Hippasus, so the story goes, was taken on a boat ride and fed to the fishes to keep this information from getting out.

You may note that Andersen's story is offered as a fairy tale.