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jojobean
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08 Mar 2011, 9:31 pm

btw, I feel like am part male/part female but which is the greater part...I am not sure.
I am female biologically and I have no plans to make myself a transextite...(biologically both sexes). Right now I am celebate, plan to be that way for a while (10 years and counting) and rather content with that. Sometimes I have a fantasy...(maybe one day out of a year) but dont have any desire to do anything about it.

I feel the socail pressure to get married...but most men I know get married expecting sex would be part of the agreement. I dont know of any celbate men who want to get married. I dont think that exists. Lately I been thinking about bisexual/lesbian women who are celebate...as I am bisexual. Good luck with that...right??

Anyway to answer your question. sexual orientation, nor is sexual idenity (sp) figured into the DSM definition of ASD's


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CockneyRebel
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08 Mar 2011, 10:28 pm

I'm female, but I feel more male. I feel like an Omega Male as opposed to an Alpha Male.


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08 Mar 2011, 10:34 pm

I'm female. While I am seen as and treated as a woman, and would describe myself as one, I would not strictly say my relationship to gender is particularly firm in this regard.



anbuend
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09 Mar 2011, 1:49 am

Who_Am_I wrote:
buryuntime wrote:
I don't have a concept of being able to feel a certain gender. Do you really have FEMALE or MALE stamped in your brain? And if so what exactly is MALE or FEMALE if not merely your sex organs? The difference between male or female is very subtle to me; females generally are more socially or empathetically minded, for instance, but I think a lot of it is cultural artifacts.


^ This.


Yes, same with me.

I absolutely know that most people (including many autistic people) do have gender stamped on their brain like that. I only realized it was real after knowing trans people, some of whom were literally suicidal because they had a strong sense of gender and it totally clashed with the body and social role they were expected to have. And most cis (non-trans) people have an equally strong sense of gender, and would be horrified if they woke up in the typical body of the "opposite" sex. Even most "in between" people have a sense of gender, it's just somewhere in between male and female. Whereas I have no sense of gender, not "gender neutral", but "gender nonexistent", so all of this is really foreign to me.


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09 Mar 2011, 4:08 am

I think there's two different ways of taking the question:
Do you feel like your body?
Do you feel like a stereotypical fe/male?

I'm fine with my body, but I'm not very typically female. So, I don't have any gender issues, but others might think that I do. It's the "women should be like this" that's a problem, not me.



Verdandi
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09 Mar 2011, 4:15 am

anbuend wrote:
Who_Am_I wrote:
buryuntime wrote:
I don't have a concept of being able to feel a certain gender. Do you really have FEMALE or MALE stamped in your brain? And if so what exactly is MALE or FEMALE if not merely your sex organs? The difference between male or female is very subtle to me; females generally are more socially or empathetically minded, for instance, but I think a lot of it is cultural artifacts.


^ This.


Yes, same with me.

I absolutely know that most people (including many autistic people) do have gender stamped on their brain like that. I only realized it was real after knowing trans people, some of whom were literally suicidal because they had a strong sense of gender and it totally clashed with the body and social role they were expected to have. And most cis (non-trans) people have an equally strong sense of gender, and would be horrified if they woke up in the typical body of the "opposite" sex. Even most "in between" people have a sense of gender, it's just somewhere in between male and female. Whereas I have no sense of gender, not "gender neutral", but "gender nonexistent", so all of this is really foreign to me.


I want to suggest that there is a sense of physical sex "male, female, etc" and a sense of gender "man, woman, etc."

My sex is pretty strongly stamped, I can't imagine being other than female and would not want to be other than female. My gender is not so strongly stamped - I'm a woman because it's expected of me, and there have been times where my ability to portray myself as a woman was very important to my well-being, and times that I've felt it was very important to my sense of identity. But lately, upon consideration, my attachment to being seen as and seeing myself as a woman is primarily a reaction to elements of my life history and the people around me, and not necessarily sometimes I would otherwise have been invested in without my particular history and being around those particular people.

I don't mean the general social pressure to be a woman, but people specifically pushing me and berating me for not being properly feminine enough while I had a strong sense that I need to fit in and not stand out. So, I'm not sure I really am attached to the idea of being a woman, but I am certainly in every social sense a woman. I know that I am not in any sense a man and do not want to be one. I also did not actually consider myself a woman until approximately 12 years ago, although I was certainly perceived as one before that, and it had as much to do with coming out as lesbian as anything else (as in, lesbians are women attracted to women, and therefore I'm a woman, although maybe not quite that explicit at the time).

I don't think sex is just about sex organs, but also about biochemistry (that is to say, hormones and how they impact the body, among other things) and to some extent neurology (hence the extremely high suicide rate for transgender people that seems to start at an earlier age than other demographics).

I don't think sex and gender are strictly the same thing, although sex is the gendered way that human bodies are labeled, and people are expected to have a gender that matches the label they're assigned at birth.

I do not think gender is an innate feature but a cultural construct. I do think that there is something going on for some people, a kind of identification with others who resemble them in particular ways (or resemble who they know they should be), that may facilitate gender identification. But what gender identification means is culturally defined.

I hope the above is stated clearly.



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09 Mar 2011, 4:47 am

When it really comes down to it, I often feel half female, half male. But I take in a lot of social pressures that is telling me to be female, its the thats the way things are suppose to be mentality. I identify as female, being that im biologically female, straying from that still has huge reprecussions. If we were allowed to identify outside of a gender binary, thats an identity Id like to have.



alexi
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09 Mar 2011, 5:11 am

I'm having a hard time grasping this at the moment. I am planning to tackle the issue with my psychologist in the next week. For me I feel both confused about my bodies identity and the gender that is expected of me. It is hard to grasp. As others have mentioned I would choose a third "in-between" gender if one existed.

I remember several years ago I was provided with definitive evidence that I have ovaries and I was just stunned and asked the doctor several times "really? are you sure?". I genuinely thought that I was only a female on the outside.



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09 Mar 2011, 5:15 am

Ai_Ling wrote:
When it really comes down to it, I often feel half female, half male. But I take in a lot of social pressures that is telling me to be female, its the thats the way things are suppose to be mentality. I identify as female, being that im biologically female, straying from that still has huge reprecussions. If we were allowed to identify outside of a gender binary, thats an identity Id like to have.


Quote:
I'm having a hard time grasping this at the moment. I am planning to tackle the issue with my psychologist in the next week. For me I feel both confused about my bodies identity and the gender that is expected of me. It is hard to grasp. As others have mentioned I would choose a third "in-between" gender if one existed.


We're allowed to identify outside the gender binary, and "in-between" genders do exist. It is just that it is difficult to get cultural acknowledgment of these things.

This page might be a good starting point: http://www.t-vox.org/index.php?title=Genderqueer



alexi
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09 Mar 2011, 5:20 am

Any ideas as to why it does seem fairly prevalent in the aspie community?



Verdandi
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09 Mar 2011, 5:51 am

I do not know. I read something in Tony Attwood's Complete Guide to Asperger's Syndrome, but it didn't ring true to me.



OJani
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09 Mar 2011, 7:32 am

alexi wrote:
Any ideas as to why it does seem fairly prevalent in the aspie community?


I can speak only in the name of males. We do not have the firmness, the pretence, the masculine look. Males supposed to hide their emotions, and show up something else. We do not speak fluently, are often embarrassed, do not understand metaphor, humor well. We do not have the ability to raise the atmosphere of confidence as a result in females, who have the strong desire to feel this, I think. However, not all. And this might be my wellbeing.

As to me, I began to consider myself as a male only one and a half year ago, and I'm almost 38. I knew that I was straight since adolescence, but after some fails I slipped back from it to be more neutral or "in-between", even though my sexual needs remained all the time.I think this later is because of chemistry.

As to females, I assume differing from the stereotypical is also the key. Intrinsic values count more, perfectly the same way as with men, but partly in other areas. WP taught me a lot on this, I must admit.

Uhm, editing again. So, I'm telling here that there is a role we all play since our childhood, and the lesser we fit, the more we tend to find our sexual identity harder and/or later.


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09 Mar 2011, 7:49 am

Yeah... I would like a third option, personally. Something neither male nor female. I never fit in terribly well with the gender binary.


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anbuend
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09 Mar 2011, 10:31 am

Verdandi wrote:
anbuend wrote:
Who_Am_I wrote:
buryuntime wrote:
I don't have a concept of being able to feel a certain gender. Do you really have FEMALE or MALE stamped in your brain? And if so what exactly is MALE or FEMALE if not merely your sex organs? The difference between male or female is very subtle to me; females generally are more socially or empathetically minded, for instance, but I think a lot of it is cultural artifacts.


^ This.


Yes, same with me.

I absolutely know that most people (including many autistic people) do have gender stamped on their brain like that. I only realized it was real after knowing trans people, some of whom were literally suicidal because they had a strong sense of gender and it totally clashed with the body and social role they were expected to have. And most cis (non-trans) people have an equally strong sense of gender, and would be horrified if they woke up in the typical body of the "opposite" sex. Even most "in between" people have a sense of gender, it's just somewhere in between male and female. Whereas I have no sense of gender, not "gender neutral", but "gender nonexistent", so all of this is really foreign to me.


I want to suggest that there is a sense of physical sex "male, female, etc" and a sense of gender "man, woman, etc."

My sex is pretty strongly stamped, I can't imagine being other than female and would not want to be other than female. My gender is not so strongly stamped - I'm a woman because it's expected of me, and there have been times where my ability to portray myself as a woman was very important to my well-being, and times that I've felt it was very important to my sense of identity. But lately, upon consideration, my attachment to being seen as and seeing myself as a woman is primarily a reaction to elements of my life history and the people around me, and not necessarily sometimes I would otherwise have been invested in without my particular history and being around those particular people.

I don't mean the general social pressure to be a woman, but people specifically pushing me and berating me for not being properly feminine enough while I had a strong sense that I need to fit in and not stand out. So, I'm not sure I really am attached to the idea of being a woman, but I am certainly in every social sense a woman. I know that I am not in any sense a man and do not want to be one. I also did not actually consider myself a woman until approximately 12 years ago, although I was certainly perceived as one before that, and it had as much to do with coming out as lesbian as anything else (as in, lesbians are women attracted to women, and therefore I'm a woman, although maybe not quite that explicit at the time).

I don't think sex is just about sex organs, but also about biochemistry (that is to say, hormones and how they impact the body, among other things) and to some extent neurology (hence the extremely high suicide rate for transgender people that seems to start at an earlier age than other demographics).

I don't think sex and gender are strictly the same thing, although sex is the gendered way that human bodies are labeled, and people are expected to have a gender that matches the label they're assigned at birth.

I do not think gender is an innate feature but a cultural construct. I do think that there is something going on for some people, a kind of identification with others who resemble them in particular ways (or resemble who they know they should be), that may facilitate gender identification. But what gender identification means is culturally defined.

I hope the above is stated clearly.


Seems clear enough to me. In my case, I have no particular tie to my physical sex either, either hormonally or body-shape-wise. I feel like I could wake up a man tomorrow and not feel that I'd lost anything. And that seems incredibly rare.


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MotownDangerPants
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09 Mar 2011, 3:38 pm

Quote:
Seems clear enough to me. In my case, I have no particular tie to my physical sex either, either hormonally or body-shape-wise. I feel like I could wake up a man tomorrow and not feel that I'd lost anything. And that seems incredibly rare.


I definitely feel this way, too. Really.

I do think the female body is very attractive, but even though I own one, I don't feel like it's "mine". I could definitely wake up tomorrow and feel like exactly the same person. I used to think about this a lot.



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09 Mar 2011, 3:51 pm

matt wrote:
pezar wrote:
Some researchers speculate that AS is carried on the Y chromosome, that's why AS is 80% male.
If AS was carried on the Y chromosome, wouldn't it be 100% male?

*like*

Anyways, I feel female. Not overly so, but I do.