Do you hate neurotypical self-promoters, or is it just me?
Self promotion by the barely competent but socially adept was one of the huge reasons I found almost every job I had to be intolerable. There were a few work situations that were rather gratifying though, for me, in a mean way I guess, when after what seemed like a ridiculously long time, others would finally catch on to what BS the situations were.
One waitress job I had, I tried to tell the manager that these two sleazy types were up to something based on the way they worked together, he thought, as men often do, that it was some kind of female jealousy. Months after I quit, I found out that he finally had caught them cheating the restaurant.
A job at a symphony box office, one of the office guys, a really braggy little jerk, repeatedly would run down the sweet little old lady that ran the box office. I finally kind of told him off (it was a part time, temporary job, so what the heck). I let the others that worked in the box office know my feeling of revulsion for the guy. He even tried to keep me away from the other box office workers my last few days there, having me shred and copy things. I went out to smoke, then didn't return to the office, instead went and worked in the box office. Well, a month or so after I left, a former co worker called to ask if I was psychic or something, the man and another employee had been fired for imbezzlement, were caught on camera after being fired, trying to break in (to this day I think him having me copy/shred stuff was part of his plan).
A co worker who slacked off terribly to the point of leaving work for hours (with our supervisor not even noticing), but sure talked a good game, who got promotions and raises based on others' work ended up getting the company in a real bind. It was an insurance company (the big one) and she of course had her coverage through our company. She had lost her license for repeated drunk driving offenses, but because she was an employee, the standard checks on her driving record, that would have revealed this mess, were not done. So, she's drinking, driving w/o a license, gets her car hung up on a railroad track, gets out and stumbles away. Train comes, hits her car, people could have been killed, they discover her loss of license, and know she had been driving the vehicle because there, hanging from the rearview mirror, was her company id/key card.
I could go on for hours, but think this post is already way too long.
Well, sometimes people are just really good at manipulating others, through charisma, through pretending to work when important people are around, through false modesty, through claiming untrue past experiences, through throwing their physical "assets" out there in front of the opposite sex. I've seen it all - and as a rule, I have seen the hard-working people get little in return for their work, while the smarmy, loafing types seize the opportunity to claim responsibility for everything positive going on (but are quick to blame mistakes on other people). Work environments are thoroughly structured in this way, yet at the same time, they will puts forth the rhetoric of meritocracy (and people believe it, too). I think it's important to understand that the world is in fact run mainly by the socially adept, and that physical and logical competence does not always accompany that talent - in fact, usually it does not. If you are an intelligent hard worker, but not socially adept, you will get overlooked, screwed, left behind. It's just what happens, and it is why I am now self-employed. I could not stand all the pretense involved in most kinds of work, so I stopped trying.
TTRSage
Velociraptor
Joined: 30 Aug 2010
Age: 74
Gender: Male
Posts: 468
Location: Alone In My Aspie Cubbyhole
That is what I consider to be "the jock attitude" and I absolutely hate such lack of humility with a passion. My favorite AS link (repeated for the umpteenth time below) points out that "Aspies do not like people who express opinions". This is so true with me. The kind of self-promotion that you mention is little more than a strong opinion that one's self is superior to others. Such individuals will be in good company in the next life at a table alongside Adolf Hitler, who was one of the obnoxious examples of self-promotion of all time. While we are at it, take a look at all the advertising that pummels our brains these days. It is all nothing but the "my sh*t doesn't stink" syndrome and I just hate it with a passion whether from individuals, corporations, governments, churches or other groups. It is all a subset though of opinionated ideas. Again, see that wonderful (IMHO... just had to add that pun on my words and opinion) link below:
http://www.wikihow.com/Relate-to-Someon ... s-Syndrome
You're talking about being phoney, but what makes you think they're phoney? The fact that they brag?
Being a good worker but failing to be a self-promoter is like a company making a great product but never advirtising it.
If people are obnoxious about it, they may need better self-promotion skills. A lack of practice won't help though.
I guess there's such a thing as a person who has no problem talking about (what they see as) their good points without exaggerating their case and without omitting the other side of the coin from their self-description, but I don't know of anybody like that. Pretty much everybody I've heard broadcasting their strengths has appeared to be taking it too far and crossing over into phoney-land. Though I'm happy to sit back and wait for links to stuff by folks who do get the balance right.
If people are obnoxious about it, they may need better self-promotion skills. A lack of practice won't help though.
I think you're right in the sense that it's a shame when people keep their light under a bushel, but again, I've seen little evidence of people simply removing the bushel and leaving it at that. Perhaps it's a part of human nature that the individual's sense of personal worth is so central to their psyche that it's almost impossible to be objective about it? As for a worker or private company promoting their stuff, I think the competitive environment is essentially a war, once more it seems rare that they really tell the whole truth, possibly because the competitive environment in which these things exist precludes it, i.e. if you're simply honest about your product, you go out of business.
I had a hard time at work when they forced us to write self-assesed job descriptions. In the end I had to hold my nose and blow my own trumpet (there's a joke in there somewhere ), which made me feel like a proper scoundrel, but it was either that or be honest, which would probably have led to a salary cut, because everybody else was lying. My supervisors actually suggested a few stretchers and said they'd back me up. It was a thoroughly horrible experience.
^This.
The memetic environment is primarily deceptive and aggressive. Honest and passive memes were selected out long ago. This aggressive memetic environment drives the competitive thoughts and behaviors.
Being that I can recognize this VERY QUICKLY AND EASILY, I am wondering why so many people in general cannot. Instead of recognizing what a douche the guy who is self-promoting himself is, the typical person will say something like "man' isn't he brilliant?"...in other words, the typical person will actually BUY INTO what the self-promoter is spewing, instead of saying "Good Lord, what a phony schmuck that guy is".
I just don't understand how people in general can be so stupid. I hate to say this, but this trait is very neurotypical in nature. People with AS tend to be able to spot these phonies right away, but neurotypical people fall for the self-promoting a-hole's schtick hook, line, and sinker just about every time.
And bosses will actually reward these self-promoting a-holes. Meanwhile, the guy who is HUMBLE yet works much harder than the self-promoter will get no reward. And he is usually much more brilliant but doesn't boast about himself, therefore other do not think much of him.
Why do neurotypicals fall for the "look at me, aren't I wonderful?" line so often? I can see right through these people, but oddly enough, most people cannot. Why? It seems self-promoters have better jobs, and do much better in relationships than humble people who don't speak much about themselves. It seems in order to do well in life, you have to BOAST about yourself and PROMOTE yourself. It's so phony, and I just can't bring myself to do it.
I didn't read other posts responding to this one as there are too many for me to read, but I simply agree with this OP. I'm probably not as good as the OP at spotting a fake brilliant person but I do see it fairly quickly. I think the world pretty much works as the OP said in his (I'm guessing the OP is male from his username) last paragraph. Self-promoters and skilled deceivers do well in life.
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