My issue with "self diagnosis".
GreyGirl
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I took all of the online tests available, multiple times. I had people I know do not "think like Me" take them too as a sort of "control". I have said before, No one will take my insurance. I know how I think, act and feel. The diagnosis did not exist when I was young. I did not have the option to be labeled as an "aspie" while young as many of you. I am who I am. I am kind of fed up with the "seeking diagnosis etc. etc stuff. " Do you need an english professor to teach you how to speak? Can you research other languages and learn to speak those too? According to many of you it seems you can't learn anything and say you have actually learned it unless you have a diploma. Unless someone else who learned it first signs off on it? Do I really need permission from someone else to say who I am? I'm disgusted about this right now. I have had "specialists" read blood tests I have had and ignore what was in front of their eyes. If I had rested on this instead of believing in myself, I could be dead right now. The psychiatrists I had available to me for the short time I did have them, couldn't even remember my name. They took cel phone calls, continued dropped calls that they had to call back on. Didn't know my meds or even if I were married or not. I know myself better than that.
I have asked about "self diagnosis" validity on here before and most have no problem with simple linguistics. My scores on the tests have been in the same range or higher than those listed by "professionally diagnosed" people. I'm not in college or high school, so I don't need a "certificate" for special treatment. I am on disability for other reasons and have passed their inquisitions multiple times and have been allowed to keep my benefits, No "certificate" needed there. To obtain such a "certificate" I would have to pay over $250.oo per session for a non-specialist to give me one, but would one from a non-specialist count? Ok, the specialist costs $750.oo to start. To be able to say that I have asperger's would cost my family far too much. But I can assure you I have it.
I'll remember to tell my friends I am seeking diagnosis for the flu or poison Ivy unless I have a Dr's note for that too If you like.
This is a really sore spot for me. I'm not going to apologize for my statements. They are my opinion and my feelings. I am not angry at one person in general. I am angry at the Idea that everything has to have clear-cut edges.
PS. The psychiatrist I saw was during the P.A.D. era (pre-asperger's discovery) too.
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" You should visit TAHITI. I hear it's a magical place"
"Freedom of Speech is Not a License to be Stupid"
I have asked about "self diagnosis" validity on here before and most have no problem with simple linguistics. My scores on the tests have been in the same range or higher than those listed by "professionally diagnosed" people. I'm not in college or high school, so I don't need a "certificate" for special treatment. I am on disability for other reasons and have passed their inquisitions multiple times and have been allowed to keep my benefits, No "certificate" needed there. To obtain such a "certificate" I would have to pay over $250.oo per session for a non-specialist to give me one, but would one from a non-specialist count? Ok, the specialist costs $750.oo to start. To be able to say that I have asperger's would cost my family far too much. But I can assure you I have it.
I'll remember to tell my friends I am seeking diagnosis for the flu or poison Ivy unless I have a Dr's note for that too If you like.
This is a really sore spot for me. I'm not going to apologize for my statements. They are my opinion and my feelings. I am not angry at one person in general. I am angry at the Idea that everything has to have clear-cut edges.
PS. The psychiatrist I saw was during the P.A.D. era (pre-asperger's discovery) too.
I am relieved to see there is at least one other person who doesn't believe a diploma confers some magic ability. Thank you. Before I ever found this site, the word "professional" was enough to make me grit my teeth, because I've run into far too many idiots who believe the word makes them smarter than they are.
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In the country of the blind, the one eyed man - would be diagnosed with a psychological disorder
Ambivalence
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Yet again, I will point out that I never said people without a diagnosis do not have ASD. I, personally, do not yet have a diagnosis.
But if you do not have a diagnosis, you do not have a diagnosis. I don't know why people find that so hard to accept. It's not my opinion, it's a fact.
For years people have been getting diagnosed with conditions not knowing what is wrong with them. They go in and see why they are having problems or to get their issues fixed. I am sure self diagnoses has always happened long before AS arrived in the DSM book. All people had to do back then was go to the library or bookstore and keep reading on conditions and then thinking they have this or that when they feel something described them.
SyphonFilter
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Phonic
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If I weren't diagnosed and I had the same knowledge of AS I had now I would feel fully justified in self diagnoses, because to be frank some professionals don't know as much about AS as some autistics.
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'not only has he hacked his intellect away from his feelings, but he has smashed his feelings and his capacity for judgment into smithereens'.
But if you do not have a diagnosis, you do not have a diagnosis. I don't know why people find that so hard to accept. It's not my opinion, it's a fact.
I think the problem here is that some self-diagnosed people see this thread as an attack on their legitimacy and on the identity they have created for themselves. I don’t think anyone here is under any real misapprehension about their own situation. It’s just that one side seems to be looking to create strong definitions, whereas the other sees this rather like an attempt to create a card carrying members only club.
Phonic
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But if you do not have a diagnosis, you do not have a diagnosis. I don't know why people find that so hard to accept. It's not my opinion, it's a fact.
I think the problem here is that some self-diagnosed people see this thread as an attack on their legitimacy and on the identity they have created for themselves. I don’t think anyone here is under any real misapprehension about their own situation. It’s just that one side seems to be looking to create strong definitions, whereas the other sees this rather like an attempt to create a card carrying members only club.
You know what the solution is right? it's that super obvious solution that solves loads of such problems, it's the one where if I were to suggest it without saying all this I'd sound like a heroic lawyer or do gooder.
take it "case by case" and make your own mind up.
End of thread! Go home folks!
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'not only has he hacked his intellect away from his feelings, but he has smashed his feelings and his capacity for judgment into smithereens'.
This is all just so silly.
1) People need to start minding their own business. Some of you worry far too much about what some people say or think. They can call themselves messengers from god for all I care. Makes no difference to me.
2) Pointless arguing about terminology. We all know what is meant be "self diagnosis". If it were commonly agreed that believing you had aspergers after long and careful consideration was defined by saying "I have the snoottle tootles" then everyone would still understand what you mean. The terms change nothing as long as the meaning is understood by all.
3) You can have your precious piece of paper from a "qualified professional" and it may still be worthless as they may have made a mistake.
I can sense the indignant anger. Honestly, you'd think people had more important things to worry about.
Do you ever ask that person with the diploma where they graduated in their class - in the top 10%, in the bottom 10%. I think I would trust the diagnosis of the guy or girl in the top 10% more than the bottom. since doctors are not required to share this information, and it is generally considered rude to ask, how do you know you can trust the diagnosis you received? A degree does not automatically confer critical thinking skills. How do you know you are speaking to someone who gets by on book knowledge alone but has horrible clinical skills?
Too many people here have horror stories about revolving doors of dx's - one doctor changes the the last doctor's dx and on and on and on. Women seem to have the worst trouble with this. Couple that with several generations worth of adults that never had the opportunity for a diagnosis in childhood along with a poor understanding of exactly how AS adults have learned to cope and how to recognise them, it stands to reason that the medical establishment is hard pressed to come to terms with this huge gap in their understanding. Adult dx is still conjecture - even for professionals. There are no DSM standards for dxing adults. It is all subjective.
When a doctor tells a 40 year old man he doesn't have Asperger's because he doesn't walk on his toes, is married and has a job... yes. I question the 'professionals'.
Verdandi
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But if you do not have a diagnosis, you do not have a diagnosis. I don't know why people find that so hard to accept. It's not my opinion, it's a fact.
On the contrary, nothing in the dictionary definition of the word "diagnosis" implies that it must come from a medical professional. I'd be less inclined to appeal to dictionary definitions, but you used the dictionary to tell another poster that she does indeed suffer from autism:
1 a : the art or act of identifying a disease from its signs and symptoms b : the decision reached by diagnosis
2: a concise technical description of a taxon
3 a : investigation or analysis of the cause or nature of a condition, situation, or problem <diagnosis of engine trouble> b : a statement or conclusion from such an analysis
Since this is yet another self-diagnosis thread in which we're all going to say the same things, I'll just say I don't care what people say about themselves as long as they're clear it's a self-diagnosis, and I don't care if such people say they're Aspies, have Asperger's, are on the autistic spectrum, or are autistic.
Four months before my official and easily gained psychiatric diagnosis of Asperger's Syndrome, I was already saying that I was autistic. This was because the evidence I had gathered in support of such a conclusion was evidence that I found both overwhelming and impossible to ignore. I felt I would have been dishonest to say anything but that I was on the spectrum.
Verdandi
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But if you do not have a diagnosis, you do not have a diagnosis. I don't know why people find that so hard to accept. It's not my opinion, it's a fact.
Because it's not a fact. It's a very strongly stated opinion misrepresented as a fact.
Diagnosis is, by definition, the conclusion a medical professional reaches following assessment of the patient. It's a piece of paper signed by a doctor; a code used in your medical notes; a formality. Therefore, the concept of "self" diagnosis is an oxymoron, unless you happen to be a qualified medical/mental health professional. Even then, it would be impossible to make a diagnosis of ASD based purely on your own imput, which is likely to be highly subjective.
I dislike use of the term "self diagnosis" because it implies validity and seems to be cropping up more often as a kind of "alternative" to legitimate diagnosis, even though they're not comparable at all.
Terms I prefer:
- "pre-diagnosis": the person acknowledges they may have an ASD and is in the process of seeking a diagnosis
- "undiagnosed/suspected": the person suspects they have an ASD but is not seeking a diagnosis
- "provisional/working diagnosis": the person has been told it is likely they have an ASD (by somebody who is qualified to make that judgement) but other conditions have not yet been ruled out
Under these conditions I would class myself as having a working diagnosis.
What are your thoughts?
I just looked up a couple of definitions of diagnosis. Since they were all very similar, I picked one:
1. determination of the nature of a cause of a disease.
2. a concise technical description of the cause, nature, or manifestations of a condition, situation, or problem. adj., adj diagnos´tic.
clinical diagnosis diagnosis based on signs, symptoms, and laboratory findings during life.
In the original, clinical diagnosis was in bold. By definition, one can diagnose one's self with the exception of a clinical diagnosis. I will qualify this by saying that a competent professional (they most assuredly all are not) is much more likely to render a correct diagnosis. But that doesn't mean the patient can't infer the correct diagnosis.
I took a test for AS the other day and scored 43 out of 50. I can also say I relate to and understand much of what is said here, whereas normal society generally mystifies me. As Bob Dylan sang, it doesn't take a weatherman to know which way the wind blows.
I actually have been diagnosed by a psychiatrist, who happened to mention it once casually. My understanding is a formal diagnosis requires batteries of tests and such, and more money than I care to think about. I think where the need for professionals comes in is for cases that are less clear cut than mine. I've read--which is all the doctors can do by the way--that AS is highly comorbid with other mental syndromes. Here, a competent professional would be needed.
I think for the most part though, all the tests and incredible hoops necessary for an official diagnosis of AS is more to satisfy the bureaucrats than anything else. It's to get special treatment in the education system or government handouts. Since I haven't received these, and won't receive them either, my time and efforts are much more productively spent doing some reading from reputable scholars on AS, and the experience of talking to people in these forums.
Last edited by Dunnyveg on 26 Dec 2011, 10:06 pm, edited 2 times in total.