Aspies saying they're Austic without context.

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NaomiDB
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02 Jan 2012, 3:52 am

Callista wrote:

Well, here's my take on it.

Thinking of the people I know who have autism, I see a group of people who are very diverse. They are anywhere from completely independent and self-supporting since the age of 18, to living at home as adults and needing help every day.

The people I know who have Asperger's have exactly the same distribution of independence levels, except that they are on average better with speaking. Note that I don't say "better at communicating", because they aren't; they are just better at speaking.

The difference is so small that I have come to the conclusion that Asperger's and autism proper are the same thing. It's not just that "Asperger's is a form of autism", but actually, "Asperger's IS autism." There was never any difference. We just didn't know that autistic people could speak until we named Asperger's. With the definition of Asperger's, not only did we get the Asperger's subset of the Spectrum, but the classic autism group also gained many people who could speak and take care of themselves--they are, in fact, the majority of classic autism cases now.

So, when I say "I am autistic," I mean not just that "I've been variously diagnosed with Asperger's, autism, and PDD-NOS, and believe PDD-NOS to be the best description so far," but, "I think dividing the autism spectrum into subcategories makes no diagnostic or clinical sense." There are no subcategories--just one very diverse category called "autism".

Anyway, when I identify myself as autistic--obviously odd, but also competent and fairly independent--I'm making the point to everyone I meet that autism is more likely to be someone like me than someone like the Autism-Speaks stereotype.

I totally agree with you, the woman who diagnosed me said it was easier for her In a way because her son was non-verbal and people could actually see something was wrong with him, with me because I am attractive and can answer questions like a normal person people fail to understand that I will probably never be independent, will probably never be able to move away from home and live alone with my son, will probably never be able to get a job unless its working from home and very flexible. maybe not even then. and that I find everyday things a struggle

Callista
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02 Jan 2012, 3:52 am

Asperger's isn't necessarily non-severe. And autism isn't necessarily severe. There's a general tendency, but that's all.

AS isn't a less severe version of autism; it's a version of autism with better speech/language skills. And, considering that classic autistics can have pretty good speech, and Aspies can have pretty bad speech, there's not that much difference.

If anything, I think that people are diagnosed with Asperger's because they seem less severe, and with autism because they seem more severe--not because there is any clinically or diagnostically relevant difference between the two categories.

OK, think of it like this: If you can't tell how severe someone's going to be by being told their diagnosis, and if you can't reliably diagnose all severe cases as autism and all non-severe cases as Asperger's--and you can't do either one--then what's the use of having two diagnoses to begin with? Even "severe" has little meaning for the Spectrum because of the atypical development patterns and unpredictability of adult speech ability from childhood history.

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OJani
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02 Jan 2012, 5:20 am

Callista wrote:

Anyway, when I identify myself as autistic--obviously odd, but also competent and fairly independent--I'm making the point to everyone I meet that autism is more likely to be someone like me than someone like the Autism-Speaks stereotype.

Probably the only issue with calling oneself 'autistic' is this false stereotype (conveyed by the media) that someone with any kind of autism must be obviously impaired and behave badly / weird all the time.

Somehow 'Asperger's' has taken the place of "the milder / more verbal form of autism closer to normal" in common sense shared by the majority of people. PDD-NOS is rarely recognized, even here on this support forum, as there are only two stereotypes, 'Classic Autism' and 'Asperger's', whereas PDD-NOS has no such quality, thus often excluded from common talk.

One philosophical aspect of broadening the definition of 'autism' is whether autistic people with less pronounced behavioral patterns at RSB (Repetitive Stereotyped Behavior) should be excluded from the autism spectrum (ASD in DSM-V) and jammed into SCD (Social Communication Disorder, also proposed in DSM-V). Contrary the trend that broadened the inclusive category of ASD/PDDs, making possible for more verbal autistics to be acknowledged under the title 'ASD' by giving them the label 'Asperger's', this would, in effect, exclude the majority of people now diagnosed with PDD-NOS due to not producing enough traits at some of the required subsets of criteria for the new ASD, most often at RSB.

RandyMeeksPsychoFan
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02 Jan 2012, 5:35 am

I think it's unfair to label Aspergians who describe themselves as Autistic as being "dramatic." At least "severely" Autistic people aren't expected to feign normalcy.

Verdandi
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02 Jan 2012, 6:31 am

OJani wrote:

One philosophical aspect of broadening the definition of 'autism' is whether autistic people with less pronounced behavioral patterns at RSB (Repetitive Stereotyped Behavior) should be excluded from the autism spectrum (ASD in DSM-V) and jammed into SCD (Social Communication Disorder, also proposed in DSM-V). Contrary the trend that broadened the inclusive category of ASD/PDDs, making possible for more verbal autistics to be acknowledged under the title 'ASD' by giving them the label 'Asperger's', this would, in effect, exclude the majority of people now diagnosed with PDD-NOS due to not producing enough traits at some of the required subsets of criteria for the new ASD, most often at RSB.

It's entirely possible that a lot of people diagnosed with PDD-NOS (I don't mean you) are not autistic and are being diagnosed to gain access to services like social skills training. SCD may be a better fit for them without labeling them as something they are not. I mention this one because it's been in the news and I have seen people say that their children were diagnosed for this reason.

Also, it seems odd that people have a picture of "classic autism" that is not actually what Leo Kanner identified in his patients, but that a lot of people diagnosed with AS and PDD-NOS fit the profile he did identify.

Australien
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02 Jan 2012, 7:03 am

I've seen someone who identified as HFA complain that Aspies /not/ identifying as autistic helped to entrench the stereotypes of Aspies being quirky geniuses and Auties needing constant attention to prevent destructive meltdowns.

As for my own opinion, I don't mind it. If people don't understand autism and aren't willing to ask or listen, the conversation is already pointless and it doesn't matter.

Guineapigged
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02 Jan 2012, 7:24 am

This is something I've been wondering about for a while. We could talk for hours about whether people with Asperger's should identify as autistic or not, but in real life, what is the correct etiquette? Is it acceptable to say "I'm autistic" to save yourself having to say "I have Asperger's, which means x ,y and z"?
Sometimes I think it would be easier to say "I'm autistic" but at the moment I wouldn't because it just doesn't seem right. Plain "autistic" implies a certain degree of severity, whether you like it or not. "I have an autistic spectrum disorder" seems like a fairly good compromise because the world "autism" is in there without implying Kanner's syndrome.

Asp-Z
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02 Jan 2012, 7:26 am

I never say I'm "austic".

I do say I have a form of autism, because a lot of people don't know what Asperger's is.

Verdandi
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02 Jan 2012, 7:34 am

Guineapigged wrote:

Go read these:

http://ballastexistenz.wordpress.com/20 ... torically/

http://ballastexistenz.wordpress.com/20 ... ereotypes/

"Autistic" may imply a certain degree of severity, but that perception excludes a lot of people who have been diagnosed with autism.

fraac
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02 Jan 2012, 8:11 am

I like calling myself autistic because it's a mindf**k for whoever I'm talking to.

Asp-Z
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02 Jan 2012, 8:13 am

fraac wrote:

I like calling myself autistic because it's a mindf**k for whoever I'm talking to.

This is true, makes for some good fun sometimes

Heidi80
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02 Jan 2012, 8:37 am

In some official situations, where you have to make yourself understood, it's easier to explain the problem with "I'm autistic" than !I have asperger's syndrome" because there are still loads of people who don't know what as is

TheSunAlsoRises
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02 Jan 2012, 7:13 pm

RobotGreenAlien2 wrote:

I know this is going to get me flamed, a lot but I've been noticing more an more people with Aspergers particularly when they appear in the media throwing around "I'm Autisic" without much further followup like "I have Asperger which is related to / a mild form of Autism". Partly I think it's because it's dramatic but I think it's in bad taste. Maybe be I has something to do with the
confusing naming system where Classic Autism [Known to everyone else as "Autism"] is a form of the broader category Autism.
Maybe it's because I think that dictionary definitions are useless if they don't match with the common usage of a term. But it bugs me. Anyone else.

People will have to decide individually what they intend to call themselves BUT it appears the DSM-V is going to remove Aspergers from the category of Autism Spectrum Disorders. Ironically, if or when it occurs, it's a good possibility that Aspergers will be referred to officially as mild Autism. As such, the medical world will label all who fall under this category as Autistics.

Personally, I don't believe Aspergers and HFA are the same condition. I will take it one step further, in the coming years, they are going to notice a distinct difference in the development and presentation of those with Aspergers vs. HFA. They are going to congratulate themselves on finding a new variant of autism with a different trajectory BUT it will be Aspergers. I pray I live long enough to see IT happen.

Remember Aspergers.

TheSunAlsoRises

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02 Jan 2012, 7:33 pm

fraac wrote:

I like calling myself autistic because it's a mindf**k for whoever I'm talking to.

I'd prefer all aspies call themselves autistic to immidiately educate the asker about autism and what it USUALLY looks like.

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02 Jan 2012, 8:11 pm

I say that I am autistic. I call it what it is, and I don't conform to anyone's stereotypes.

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02 Jan 2012, 8:17 pm

I think they should say whichever one they feel like saying at the moment.

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