Unacceptable Behaviour, Even For Aspies

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Then, by your logic, you have no right to judge anyone else's willingness to judge.

The "fact" that good and evil do not exist is very debatable.

Sorry, I don't buy into moral relativism.

This got me thinking, deviating from the subject of the spectrum...

So if someone killed your entire family in cold blood, what would you feel about it?

For those that believe there is no set "right" and "wrong" and anything can be technically justifiable.

That's not "my logic" at all. I never once claimed that arbitrary judgement was "wrong". That's your own dire misinterpretation.



There's nothing to buy into. It's a matter of whether you understand what subjectivity is or not. The only people who argue against this are so self-righteous and self-absorbed that they literally lack the capacity to understand what that word means, confusing their own subjective perspective with magically objective fact, rendering any debate meaningless.



Subjective anger and hate are not evidence of objective fact.

I agree and disagree.... retaliation is how gang wars and long standing feuds start.
Then also, turning the other cheek encourages bad behaviour

Finding the balance between forgiveness and retaliation is soooooooooo difficult. Thats what angels and god are there for. Thats THEIR job

balance, harmony, the way, the dao,

anger is one letter short of danger

In my opinion, an action that hurts another person is never acceptable. It might be the least unacceptable in certain situations, but harming them (even not physically) is still not acceptable.

However, the explanation for how someone is is incredibly relevant and also needs to be taken into account. It can be understandable for someone to do actions that harm others.

It's not acceptable for me to scream at someone in a meltdown. It's understandable for me to do so. I won't be able to just suddenly stop doing so because I know its not acceptable, however I am responsible for those actions, even though I can't stop it, as well as responsible for trying to reduce them as much as I possibly can.

This.

Even the last paragraph. I have screamed at people during meltdowns, but I definitely try not to. I try my hardest not to go over the edge.

African Americans whos outspoken anti discrimination community leaders have been assassinated? kids trapped in a hood, who do crime? television and media stereotypes?

Whos fault?

Last edited by Surfman on 21 Mar 2012, 5:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Hmm...interesting points. While I understand the argument over subjectivity, that people don't deliberately set out to do evil for evil's sake, as it's nearly always a (misguided/inappropriate) reaction to that person's past or circumstances, doesn't that deny individual agency? Even though we are always surrounded by external influences there still exists some measure of choice in the decisions an individual makes at that point in time. When we contemplate hurting someone it is because we think that causing someone else pain will relieve our own pain. It is faulty reasoning, but a person still can decide not to perform such an act.

This thread has really evolved into something else, hasn't it?

(Not that it's a bad evolution.)

And now for something completely different.

Ok not that different.. But getting back to the point.. You mentioned some of your own behaviours, I can't see how they hurt anyone but yourself. That might be a but different to what you have described in the classroom. Although I am often like how you have described your classmate, I know I'm a pain in meetings and training sessions. I need to engage to stay interested, which can be disruptive.

If its a routine thing, then perhaps discussing it with the teacher might be the correct way to handle it. Getting it off your chest can help. Perhaps the teacher hasn't noticed and needs to address this.

Jason

That's exactly what people mean when they say Aspie boys get noticed more than Aspie girls. Boys are generally allowed to be louder than girls.

You shouldn't tolerate it. Also, it is damaging for him as well. It's tricky...

yes i agree with you there. while i also agree with the fact that there is a line n shouldnt be allowed to act like a jerk, there are some people who really dont realise that to other people tehyre percieved in that way.
for example, my big brother has AS, while now hes been lucky enough to 'grow out of it, (yes that is possible), He would have been one of those ones that looked like they were crossing the line. mainly in his head he'd be thinking and or wanting to say/do one thing where as the actual action would appear as a misbehaviour, jerk like manner.

Personally i may never know i am doing something the wrong way untill someine bites me and tells md off for it. that way im shocked into understanding i am doing the wrong thing, but then im also left how to figure it out on my own and i go back into old habits.
i need thst guidence on how to change that behaviour. maybe telling him to just stop what hes doing is not enough.
maybe he needs "james, stop what you are doing because............" not just "james your being a distruption, stop" in a harsh tone. be more like "james stop what you are doing because you are stoping the class from focusing on whst we are doing." maybe he needs the comprehension, so that it also applies to him.

i hope you can understand what i mewn here.

Again people, I have talked to this boy multiple times.

I've had him in my Chinese class all four years of highschool, as well as other classes. I now have him in my English class. And the last two trimesters I sat with him at lunch with two other Aspie friends of mine (who were both equally annoyed with him as well. Come to think of it, one even more than I!)

It's just that only now am I really thinking about it, and only now am I posting about it.

But yes, this boy just does not care about what other people think. He likes shouting things out because "it's fun", and yes he does believe he's always right, at least in his opinions (which annoys me, because opinion is not fact). And after hours of insulting people and shouting out of line he'll just say, "Oh I was only kidding." No. You can't just be completely rude and disruptive the entire day and say at the end that you were kidding.

These scenarios being discussed are all valid, but not for this particular case.

^

I don't think there's any escape from that. The golden rule is pretty hard-wired for most humans though and most people react rather emotionally when an individual grossly violates it. Without it though we'd be living under rocks venturing out only to scrounge for food and club our neighbors over the head when they try to steal our food. What a wonderful life that would be. One of the reasons we have morals and the golden rule is to promote efficient cooperation and prevent wasteful conflict. Subjective or not, if someone believes they have the right to act like a complete ass and hurt others there's going to be trouble for them.

Some people with Asperger's end up choosing a defense mechanism like aloofness or arrogance to try to protect their egoes. Given that people with Asperger's sometimes have trouble understanding other points of view, this can become very ugly very fast.