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Female-To-Male Transsexual People Have More Autistic Traits,

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auntblabby
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13 Feb 2013, 10:17 am

nessa238 wrote:
I seem to have endless power struggles in the standard model bf/gf relationship. I once had a boyfriend who said 'We work well together but you need to let me steer the ship!' LOL :lol:

he can steer the ship but when it sinks he's all on his own :razz:



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13 Feb 2013, 10:59 am

l've known 3 (online) and one IRL. 2 of them had diagnosed AS and the others have a few traits.

The digit ratio studies are interesting, however, l do not personally conclude that a female with a masculinized brain is in effect "transgender". l have the male ratio, l feel there's really no way to tell exactly which parts of your brain have been affected. l think the effect for me has simply resulted in an androgynous brain. l was told l was once technically trans or on the "trans spectrum" because of this by an FTM lol.

Hemispheric dominance can play a huge role in orientation and gender identity though and prenatal hormones influence that.

l see a lot of AS in both gay men and MTFS though whom are supposed to have reversed brain dominance.


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nessa238
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13 Feb 2013, 11:19 am

auntblabby wrote:
nessa238 wrote:
I seem to have endless power struggles in the standard model bf/gf relationship. I once had a boyfriend who said 'We work well together but you need to let me steer the ship!' LOL :lol:

he can steer the ship but when it sinks he's all on his own :razz:


Yes Lol and it did sink, spectacularly! :roll:



auntblabby
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13 Feb 2013, 11:27 am

people who presume to be worthy of steering another person's ship should first prove capable of steering their own first.



nessa238
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13 Feb 2013, 11:31 am

auntblabby wrote:
people who presume to be worthy of steering another person's ship should first prove capable of steering their own first.


People who want control usually want it for selfish reasons as well



Last edited by nessa238 on 13 Feb 2013, 12:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

auntblabby
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13 Feb 2013, 12:43 pm

nessa238 wrote:
Agreed People who want control usually want it for selfish reasons as well

that reminds me of a pink floyd lyric about wanting somebody at home to beat up on a saturday night- IOW scratch a controller and more often than not you will find a basher.



nessa238
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13 Feb 2013, 12:46 pm

auntblabby wrote:
nessa238 wrote:
Agreed People who want control usually want it for selfish reasons as well

that reminds me of a pink floyd lyric about wanting somebody at home to beat up on a saturday night- IOW scratch a controller and more often than not you will find a basher.


Agreed

He was one of those too funnily enough! :(



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13 Feb 2013, 12:49 pm

nessa238 wrote:
He was one of those too funnily enough! :(

leave him to god then. karma will have its way with him when he least suspects it. retribution is a dish best served cold.



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13 Feb 2013, 12:52 pm

auntblabby wrote:
nessa238 wrote:
He was one of those too funnily enough! :(

leave him to god then. karma will have its way with him when he least suspects it. retribution is a dish best served cold.


I don't think his relationships ever last long-term - he loses his temper too often and too scarily so partners end up making a run for it at some point and he's left on his own again!



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13 Feb 2013, 1:52 pm

If I didn't look like my male role model, I would have gotten a sex change a long time ago. I'd rather change my gender than adapt and change my thinking. This is why I wish to eradicate the Binary Gender Code.


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13 Feb 2013, 1:55 pm

nessa238 wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
nessa238 wrote:
He was one of those too funnily enough! :(

leave him to god then. karma will have its way with him when he least suspects it. retribution is a dish best served cold.


I don't think his relationships ever last long-term - he loses his temper too often and too scarily so partners end up making a run for it at some point and he's left on his own again!

i bet he wouldn't dare mistreat rosy palm and her five sisters.



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13 Feb 2013, 3:24 pm

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It makes far more practical sense to me to stick with the body/gender you were born with and adapt your thinking


Transsexualism is neurobiological. Therefore "adapting" will not work. Professionals have rejected rearing/trauma as the cause of transsexualism in favor for something more biological.

Now regarding the research: It's thought the cause of transexuality is from an anomaly that happens during the formation of the central nervous system, during a time when the brain is programmed for gender. The cause of the anomaly is uncertain. After this study, it'd be interesting to see how if this anomaly and Autism are related.



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13 Feb 2013, 4:30 pm

Pileo wrote:
Quote:
It makes far more practical sense to me to stick with the body/gender you were born with and adapt your thinking


Transsexualism is neurobiological. Therefore "adapting" will not work. Professionals have rejected rearing/trauma as the cause of transsexualism in favor for something more biological.

Now regarding the research: It's thought the cause of transexuality is from an anomaly that happens during the formation of the central nervous system, during a time when the brain is programmed for gender. The cause of the anomaly is uncertain. After this study, it'd be interesting to see how if this anomaly and Autism are related.


I agree with you. I'd also like to say that my brain is in good working order. It's my body that feels wrong. I've felt as though I should have been Male since the age of 4. I can't just adapt and pretend that I like being Female. I've tried that many times in my life only to feel miserable and depressed. I live my life the way I want now. I live the life of a man and I don't need to adjust anything about my thinking. I'm just thankful that my body is more muscular in the arms and shoulders than that of the average Female and I have the same facial features as Mick Avory does. I will never be able to adapt to the reality of me being Female and I will always think like a Male. There's nothing wrong with that. Just don't expect to see me wearing a tight hoody, shiny jeans and my hair done up talking like a Valley Girl.


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13 Feb 2013, 4:50 pm

Pileo wrote:
Quote:
It makes far more practical sense to me to stick with the body/gender you were born with and adapt your thinking


Transsexualism is neurobiological. Therefore "adapting" will not work. Professionals have rejected rearing/trauma as the cause of transsexualism in favor for something more biological.

Now regarding the research: It's thought the cause of transexuality is from an anomaly that happens during the formation of the central nervous system, during a time when the brain is programmed for gender. The cause of the anomaly is uncertain. After this study, it'd be interesting to see how if this anomaly and Autism are related.


I agree entirely, there is no adapting. I'm FAAB and Agender/Asexual, this seems to be much more common in ND individuals, my biggest issue is more that "gender" is primarily a social construct. I will be livid and distressed if I'm put into a dress or a suit as I am being forced into drag, but being entirely off the binary I'm not convinced this issue is any more than exterior considering the largest conflict is external conditioning and treatment. I don't mean this to trivialize since this treatment would be why I'd seek surgery to be neutrois, but I do not think that would be a natural thought without the external implementations I was put through in childhood though today. I'm just not convinced its not society's doing, I think being "out" with it is more common in all NDs who are already on the radar for other things. Being out and being trans unable to come out due to NT sensibilities and NT conditioning make me very skeptical on such research.


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13 Feb 2013, 6:25 pm

nessa238 wrote:
Simon Baron-Cohen interpreted the results as follows: "Girls with a higher than average number level of autistic traits tend to have male-typical interests, showing a preference for systems over emotions. They prefer not to socialise with typical girls because they have different interests, and because typical girls on average have more advanced social skills. Both of these factors may lead girls with a higher number of autistic traits to socialize with boys, to believe they have a boy's mind in a girl's body, and to attribute their unhappiness to being a girl."

Rebecca Jones added "If such girls do believe they have a boy's mind in a girl's body, their higher than average number of autistic traits may also mean they hold their beliefs very strongly, and pursue them to the logical conclusion: opting for sex reassignment surgery in adulthood."


Something that has become clear to me over the years is this: If you find a statement about who or what transgender people are, or what their motivations are for choosing to transition that is made by someone who is not themselves transgender, you should definitely fact check it with actual transgender people.

IMO, transgender people are even less understood than autistic people. Asking if they really need to transition is sort of like asking any of us why we continue to choose to be autistic.



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13 Feb 2013, 6:49 pm

Verdandi wrote:
nessa238 wrote:
Simon Baron-Cohen interpreted the results as follows: "Girls with a higher than average number level of autistic traits tend to have male-typical interests, showing a preference for systems over emotions. They prefer not to socialise with typical girls because they have different interests, and because typical girls on average have more advanced social skills. Both of these factors may lead girls with a higher number of autistic traits to socialize with boys, to believe they have a boy's mind in a girl's body, and to attribute their unhappiness to being a girl."

Rebecca Jones added "If such girls do believe they have a boy's mind in a girl's body, their higher than average number of autistic traits may also mean they hold their beliefs very strongly, and pursue them to the logical conclusion: opting for sex reassignment surgery in adulthood."


Something that has become clear to me over the years is this: If you find a statement about who or what transgender people are, or what their motivations are for choosing to transition that is made by someone who is not themselves transgender, you should definitely fact check it with actual transgender people.

IMO, transgender people are even less understood than autistic people. Asking if they really need to transition is sort of like asking any of us why we continue to choose to be autistic.


This. I cannot thank you enough Verdandi, I was seriously considering leaving WP because even non-intentionally triggering stuff like this was making me want to leave wrongplanet for good (not awesome because despite this study even in the trans community I am odd for being autistic) and it's nice to finally know someone here sort of gets it. Faith in humanity is currently under review for you.

This thread, any many like it and I blame no one in the threads for it, have honestly been putting me near suicidal until your post, I cannot overstate my thank yous.