Do you have strong views on morality?
Exactly. It wasn't that you were trying to be a shiny goody-two-shoes; it's just that you would have been much more unhappy if you kept the money, because you would have known that for you to have it, the person who lost it could never have it back. So the decision there is pretty straightforward: You think, "I'd like to have that money," but in the end you decide that the money is just not worth the other person's misery.
Human beings are social animals. We're wired to seek not just our own happiness, but others' happiness. Because humans live in communities and specialize, we have to be able to trust each other, and that wouldn't be possible if we weren't born with, essentially, a conscience. Even the socially clumsy autistics are part of that bigger picture, and have that same tendency to see others' welfare as innately important. Getting the information about what someone else needs or wants may be harder, but every time they study autism and morality, they come up with the same answer--We care just as much as non-autistics do. We might be more logical about it and depend on rules and black-and-white judgments more, but the basic desire for fairness and coexistence is there.
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EverythingShimmers
Blue Jay
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Joined: 3 Feb 2013
Age: 34
Gender: Female
Posts: 93
Location: British Columbia, Canada
I follow most of society's rules just because having people like me is very important to me. But that's the only reason.
However, I've met many aspies who have very strongly developed conceptions of morality and moral reasoning. I think mine is very simplistic, practical, and primitive by contrast. Psychopaths, who include some people with mild ASD, at the other end of the spectrum, do not care about hurting other people if it serves their self-interest. I guess I'm in the middle of the spectrum. Wondering what the distribution is.
My attitude is like yours. I had the stereotypical sense of rigid morality that many people on the spectrum have but I grew out of it. My understanding of things changed and so did my sense of morality.
Generally I just want to avoid causing pain to other people. I wouldn't have a problem with breaking certain laws as long as nobody gets hurt and I am willing to accept the consequences. The nobody getting hurt thing usually puts me in agreement with the legal system but there are exceptions.
It would be against my sense of morality to take action without accepting the consequences. If you feel strongly enough about it you should be willing to take full responsibility. If you aren't willing to take full responsibility then don't do it.
This describes how I am about it too.
I used to have a VERY strict moral code, but only about specific things. Romantic relationships/sex and causing pain/death, to be exact. I think it was because of growing up in a churchgoing Christian home, but, for some reason, other things, such as lying, cheating, and stealing, I was never so strict about - maybe because they didn't necessarily hurt anyone and money was kind of an abstract concept that I didn't really appreciate? But still, even though I knew nothing firsthand about it, it was sexual and romantic stuff that I was so intensely black and white about. I was not legalistic - I simply made up my own rules. It was obsessive and destructive how much I cared. However, I did lighten up about it a bit in my later teens (as long as it wasn't something involving ME), but at the same time I got even stricter about my pain/killing morals, to the point where I had a record of not having purposefully killed a single sentient being since age 10 or something (I still had to allow for washing hands and killing bacteria). After I watched the documentary "Earthlings" that was it. I became a vegetarian, much to the chagrin of my family, and I was intensely strict about it without imposing my views on other people (for fear of being labelled as "one of those"). I never got emotional when I saw other people eating meat or even heard their hunting stories, or whatever else. On a day-to-day level, empathy had very little to do with it, I simply thought it made more sense to treat all residents of this planet the same way as best we could, and I would quietly carry out my beliefs and share them only if people specifically asked.
I haven't completely outgrown my particular moral stance, but I have lightened up and admitted to myself that I live in a subjective universe and that maybe I shouldn't sacrifice my own well-being for the sake of upholding certain lofty morals that I alone believe in.
I still think that people should NEVER get into a relationship that they aren't 100% serious about as a long-term lifelong commitment. I think physically cheating in a relationship is abhorrent and that if someone does it to you, you have no obligation to be in that relationship anymore. I think that mutual romantic love is something very real, but very rare, and I think it is only possible between two beings. Thus, I think sexual acts should only be between two people who truly love each other. In my version of a perfect world, people should either be "best friends first" or do old-fashioned dating, basically lots and lots of talking.. really, REALLY, knowing who the person is.. for, like, months... and then sit down with each other and discuss the future of their relationship based on the intensity of their attraction and commonalities - before even kissing them once. If they don't find the right person, then stay single. Why is that so bad? The alternative is horrific to me, but it seems like everyone does it. If someone were to overstep this with me (i.e. cheat on me, betray me, assault me, etc.), I can't say I would care what happened to them. (I do realize this black-and-white relationship thinking is abnormal, but I don't want to stop thinking this way, because I know I'm not alone in this.)
On the other hand, as of last summer I am not a strict vegetarian anymore. Part of me changing that was realizing that I had fallen into the pattern of doing it for the wrong reasons - control, grasping for a sense of superiority, wanting to "make up" for my existence. I wasn't taking care of myself. I didn't care about my own health, didn't care if I ate nothing but crackers, or even if I died, really, as long as I wasn't indirectly causing other things to die and the planet to suffer. I believe it is possible to be perfectly healthy as a vegetarian - but that takes a lot of work and planning - stuff I really was not doing. (I know this sounds lame to vegetarians out there - I'm sorry.) But (for other reasons, too), I was quite underweight. Then, I went through a major change within myself last year where I began to question everything about existence and fell into a mode of thinking in which I was ready to throw away not only all of my morals, but my life too - because no matter how strict I was, I wasn't happy. I had to revisit the reasons why I had made certain decisions in the first place. And I realized after all that my own happiness does sort of matter - at least to me.
I still agree with the premise of "Earthlings" - that human life is not necessarily the "end-all" life form that automatically has the right to torture and enslave the other species ("speciesism", just like "racism" and "sexism" = bad?) I'm sure some of us know all too well that just because someone can't communicate well, it doesn't mean they don't matter. I won't likely miss an opportunity to bring this up as a philosophical topic. Since I regained my self-esteem, I'm bolder now, too.
My moral code used to be extremely situational and relativistic, but recently I've been adding in a few absolutes, in order to address certain shortcomings that I started to notice when considering situations that would cause me to break my own codes. These primarily had to do with "the ends justify the means" style arguments and my realization of just how dangerous they are, as everyone has very different ideas of what ends justify extreme means, and thus a moral absolute is needed to check the slide into the abyss. The example I go to over and over because it's so pure is the person murdering the abortion provider because in that persons mind, they are stopping a mass murderer before they kill again, and who could blame someone for stopping a serial killer?
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Your boos mean nothing, I've seen what makes you cheer.
- Rick Sanchez
A doctor who does abortions is not the same thing as a serial killer. S/he believes that no murder is being committed, while the serial killer knows and enjoys it. Additionally, killing the doctor does nothing because there are other doctors who are also available. A better approach would be to make it possible for women to keep their babies, especially things that let them go on with jobs, education, etc. so they are not economically or socially forced into abortion--the "I'm not ready for a baby" cases. Plus preventing unwanted pregnancies with better sex ed and wider availability of birth control... Killing doctors who perform abortions is worse than useless. The only long-term effect is that you've killed a murderer who doesn't realize he's a murderer... which is, what, manslaughter for the doctor, first-degree murder for you? That's not justice. It's also illogical. Stop the killing by killing more people? Uh... no.
Anyway, when making moral decisions, you have to consider the likely consequences as well as the perspectives of other people in the situation. If you don't, you can easily make mistakes.
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Not particularly.
I have a "code of behavior" that I follow that applies to me and only me, but I realize it is based on my subjective experiences and opinions; therefore, I do not really expect anyone else to follow my personal "code."
As for what I expect from other people, I believe there are certain standards of ethical behavior by which humans need to abide by in order for us to live together in a functional society, but this is typically limited to the basics, such as don't murder other people.
Beyond that, my sense of "right" and "wrong" is usually determined by pragmatism, which occasionally makes me look like a borderline sociopath, but I've learned that most people are full of crap, so I relegate their opinions on my opinions to the midden heap. For example, yes, I'm in the military. Yes, I'm a tiny cog in a vast death machine. No, I don't tend to loose any sleep at night because of it. I found most folks who spew anti-military bile are hypocritical and, as previously stated, full of crap.
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"If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced."
-XFG (no longer a moderator)