Why I have to be honest and disagree with some on this board

Post Reply New Topic

I had an aunt and uncle who were both very low functioning. They lived with my grandmother, until she passed away, and thereafter were cared for in many ways by their younger siblings. They couldn't manage a household or finances. However, both worked for several decades at the same menial jobs, until they were old enough to retire on Social Security. The problem is, technology has eliminated those types of jobs by and large, and few can survive and meet their basic needs for food, shelter, and transportation via a low paying job, at least in the States.

I basically do not care to push people to try because I don't know their circumstances or their needs. If they want help then they should get it, and if they want to work, they should be supported, but like 90% of autistic adults are unemployed or underemployed, holding jobs is very difficult, and in the current economic climate, competition for jobs is fierce.

I'm not saying everyone should just be cool with staying at home and doing nothing, but more that we face rather difficult barriers to overcome in being part of the workforce. This isn't going to be something that we can fix by giving individual autistic people a "kick in the pants." It requires addressing the institutional and social barriers that are placed in our way.

For example, I believe Massachusetts has a law that makes it easier for autistic people to get through interviews. I am not sure what it says (it was mentioned to me in passing several months ago). That kind of thing is one possibility. Another is to find ways to provide opportunities for each other.

But how hard I tried to function at work, how long it took me to recover after losing each job, no one should have to go through that, and it wasn't even necessary. It's that my needs on those jobs were not accommodated. I can't function in the typical modern workplace because it wrecks me and burns me out.

My husband has always worked but not always well. He needs to be in charge because he does not agree with most bosses. He is willing to tell his boss to F off and most of the time gets away with it because he is really good at what he does. But he needs to work alone most of the time. Our oldest is much less capable and I wonder if she will be able to work or live on her own. But I lead her as if she will be able to. He thinks she will be fine and does not think we can judge her at only 12. She is maturing but very slowly. She is bright but relies on others for most of her executive functioning. I imagine she will work in some capacity but maybe not full time. She wants to be a teacher but that is hard to imagine happening.

I think if someone on the spectrum can work even if only a few hours a week they should. Even if it is just volunteering. The routine is good for anyone. I know I totally lose all focus when I don't work.

I agree with you, sharkattack.

It's good to have this perspective represented on Wrong Planet, so people can read multiple perspectives and decide for themselves which are the best paths for them.

I encourage young people to try, either studying at school or on their own, or working a paid or volunteer job. Don't stay home and get comfortable in a world that shrinks after high school, as they may regret it in the future if they don't try.

You say all that like it's a bad thing.

I can see both perspectives on this one. I definitely think people should contribute what they can and that working, volunteering or studying is ideal if it's possible. Still, I think a lot of people with ASD and other mental/developmental genuinely have tried to work and can not. A lot of them have co-morbids , it's not just the autism itself. They aren't just being lazy and needing a push.

On the other hand maybe there are some people who do become lazy and complacent and who do need a kick in the pants, so to speak. Sometimes I do.

Right now I'm going to school part-time (for Library Science) and I'm hoping that I can work when I finish my degree but I've been fired from simple jobs after two weeks or two days in one case and I'm honestly not sure if I'll have all the skills necessary to obtain and hold down a job as a librarian (social skills, multi-tasking, prioritizing ect). I'm going to try but I'm not so confident.

Last edited by daydreamer84 on 05 Feb 2014, 11:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I also agree with the OP.

I was diagnosed at the age of 54. I was bullied throughout my school years. Looking back, I had many of the symptoms of Asperger's but little was known about ASD at that time. I think that due to my parents' strong work ethic and my own desire to please them, I pushed myself extra hard to succeed. I still feel that I fell far short of their expectations, but I have been employed for the past 30 years.

I pushed myself to succeed and every time it ended in burnout and a year+ of losing a lot of my abilities including self-care skills.

Like, pushing is a thing some people can do but everyone cannot.

I don't think that I succeeded at things that I tried to do by pushing. I succeeded at different things by trying different ways to figure out a way that worked for me. Sometimes, it took several years and many trials. Other times, it took a few minutes.

I am not sure we're using the same definition, or had the same level of tolerance before pushing was necessary. I know with my writing I tried numerous different ways to handle it and they fell apart every single time because it was too easy to exceed my "normal" non-pushing capabilities.

Going to work or college meant that I had to push to get ready in time, get to college or work on time, stay until everything I needed to do was done, and get home. This applied to things I did to entertainment just as much as they applied to things I did for college or work. I would have shutdowns at work or school or during roleplaying games (whether running or playing) and have to figure out how to reboot to function or hide in a bathroom or just get stuck wherever I was.

I mean it sounds good to talk about trying different ways but the problem was that I was always working on what might be called "emergency reserves" and when they were exhausted there was no different way that would make it still workable, and there was no different way that would mean that those reserves would not be needed or used.

until recently. I always worked. Except for when I was self-employed, at menial jobs that I was often laid off from,not for being late or rude or lazy.just for "not getting it." Extremely humiliating. Of my 2 kids who are autistic, one is working, the other cannot, mostly because of co-morbidities. He does not post here but occasionally reads others' posts.

He has read a couple of posts where individuals have mentioned that they are not looking for work because the jobs they were qualified for were a waste of their time because they were not enjoyable and only paid minimum wage. That angers my son because he desperately would love to be able to work a disgusting and minimum wage job. For him, as probably is the case for most autistics, that would be a dream come true.

I think that the OP made a valid point. I especially do not understand people who cannot work, but still could do a couple of hours a day of cooking and cleaning,but do not, and have the nerve to criticize their parents.

Shark: I was on that thread, and I, too, was trying to encourage that young man. All he did was return my encouragement with excuses.

The fact remains that each of us has only one life to live. And no matter our disability, our life task is to do all we can with what we have. It's a proven fact: The more in control of our lives we are, the happier we will be. The less in control, the more depressed. Often depression leads to despair and suicide. To coddle that young man was, in my estimation, akin to indulging someone in an addiction. Every addiction leads to death eventually.

25 years ago I chose not to let my disability get in my way. I had a college degree but was unemployed and realized that I was different, and that things didn't seem to work out for me like they did for others. But I fought like hell to move ahead. I had to, because the other option of giving up would have been the death of me.

I know each person has his or her own situation. The point is at least try. And then try again. And again. And then let us on WP be a support.

Minimum wage is a subpoverty wage that no one can possibly live on anywhere in the US. I have literally no sympathy for anyone who finds it offensive that anyone might not want a minimum wage job. Actually, I find it weird that anyone is not offended by the current minimum wage in the US. It's ridiculously low and has failed to keep up with inflation and increases in cost of living to an egregious degree. We shouldn't be telling people they should want that pittance for a wage, we should be telling the employers to offer a real living wage.

The increase to 10.10 an hour will make things better, although not as much as it could or should.

The American ethic of "work at all costs" is toxic and harmful, and does no one any favors. It exploits the working class for their labor while denying them the full benefits of said labor. The entire system needs to be overhauled for it to work for everyone instead of the wealthiest.

Last edited by Verdandi on 06 Feb 2014, 1:06 am, edited 1 time in total.

Each person has their own set of strengths and weaknesses, so each person has difficulty with different aspects of functioning.

I think that I have as much difficulty with my areas of weakness as you do with yours, and when I say that I try different ways to figure out a way, I mean that I do so for the things that are the most difficult for me to do.

Yeah, I see what you mean. I did get a bit defensive in my response and that was not necessary. Sorry about that.

To the OP:

I think the sort of advice you had been trying to give is honestly the sort you have to be careful of... Everyone's overall situation is different, and there's no way to really know the truth of it unless they decide to show it to you. This sort of advice makes ALOT of assumptions. And assumptions can be a bad thing, since they can be wrong.

I've run into the same problem that the guy in that other topic has..... people pushing me to get a job, and such as that. Not for any good reason, mind you..... they did it because "people are supposed to have a job".

Advice of the sort you were giving would have no positive effect on me. It only generates rage. I always think "How does this person dare to give me such generalized advice? They dont know me. They dont know what my situation is. They give this generic advice because stupid society tells them that this should be the case, and like sheep, they follow....". People used to push me towards work all the time.... work work work, it was all anyone bloody talked about. Oh, I HAD jobs, sure.... and was bloody horrible at all of them. Couldnt remember stuff, made mistakes all the time, didnt want to deal with other employees, didnt give a crap about the work being done or think it had any worth, and most of all.... I had zero desire to be there. People push this on others partly because they think it'll "improve" them, or give them "more self worth". But those people assume that the concepts leading to self-worth are the same for everyone. They are not.

I'm gonna quote something the guy in the other thread said here:

This pretty much matches my thoughts on having a job. Not because I'm bad at them, no.... even if I was good at such a thing, I'd STILL think that way. All forms of employment.... which are usually low level jobs that are often a little pointless and idiotic... are draining, soul-sucking experiences for me. I get nothing out of them. And how could I? What would a job at the bloody grocery store, manning a cash register and getting honked at by mindless, irate customers, possibly give me? What could it possibly ACCOMPLISH? How could it possibly have anything resembling importance? And these things go for all sorts of other jobs as well. The only thing I ever got out of any of them was a constant, ever-increasing desire to be ANYWHERE ELSE.

Yet everyone assumes that they know what's best. They assume that my mind works like the status quo. They assume that what is seen as best for many is best for me. They are wrong.


On top of that, they have no bloody idea what my situation is. What my home is like, and what my life is like. And considering what my situation exactly is, I think many wouldnt actually believe me if I explained it... not without me taking them home and outright showing them. Not only can I not hold a job.... but I also dont NEED one. It has no point. People take jobs to get money.... but I dont need the money. I already have it. Wealthy family, you see. Oh, I'm not saying something like a giant 40-room manor with an army of butlers or something like that (though there IS the cleaning people and the guys with the bizarro lawnmower), but it's enough that in most cases, if I want to buy something, I dont have to think it out much, I just buy it... it doesnt matter. It wont dent the funds. And I'm an impulse buyer, too. It goes further than that, but you get the idea. The assumption that I have a practical need for a job is outright wrong. It would serve no purpose.

Yet it goes even further than that! People always have this bizarre assumption that the only way you can contribute or accomplish something is to have a job. This is untrue. It's untrue in ways that should be stupidly obvious, yet most dont seem to grasp this concept whatsoever. As an example, among my group of friends, I'm one of the only ones that has a car. There's only 2 others that have one, and those cars are junkers.... mine is not. The others have no transportation whatsoever. When one of them needs something though, I can help. I can take them where they need to go. My friend that lives really close to here typically has one of his parents drive him to work, but they're not always around... every now and then, the only way he's going to get there is if I take him. Even in hazardous weather, I will do this. And there's more than that.... I live with my father, but I visit my mom every day. She's kinda the depressive sort, but my visits can brighten up her day a bit. I visit my grandmother often as well, popping by to chat for awhile and such. I've got a pet dog, too. Domesticated animals cannot create a happy situation for themselves on their own, so I do my best to keep her as happy as possible. She deserves it, and I care about her, so I do it, even when it's a pain in the rear, which it occaisionally is, as any pet owner knows.

All of these things are ways of contributing.... making someone else's day a bit better, and accomplishing things even if they're small... that do NOT involve having a regimented job in some blasted store or other. In fact, this sort of thing contributes MORE than any job I've ever had, as again, most of them are pointless.

All of these things go together, and are why I tend to think that such advice as "you'll be better WITH a job" is the sort to be careful with. Because it really ISNT always correct, and I think there's plenty of examples out there of it not being correct.