Is mindblindness a problem for everybody on the spectrum?

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Coda
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08 Jul 2014, 10:00 am

Sticks wrote:
Does everybody on the autistic spectrum experience mindblindness?

I'm particularly interested in hearing from those who are somewhere on the spectrum other than Aspergers - from what I understand it's a defining characteristic for Aspies (although, please correct me if I'm wrong), but I'm unsure about Auties.

What are your personal experiences? - Is it always a severe problem or is it possible to be on the spectrum and mindbliness isn't much of an issue, if at all?


I have Autism and, for me, I find it really difficult to read another persons body language or facial expressions. I just ask them bluntly what emotions they're feeling or if I'm boring them. It seems rude at first but people get used to it after awhile.

The only emotions I can recognise are;

Sadness - They have to be crying though.
Happiness - If someone's smiling I assume they're happy.

... That's it.

I also have a lot of trouble recognising my own emotions so I try to describe what I'm feeling (like you would describe a headache or something) to people in the hopes they'd know what I'm talking about.


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Moondust
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08 Jul 2014, 4:29 pm

B19, what the expert is telling them is not to make assumptions based on subjective prejudice - this is all in the intellectual realm. The expert is not by any means telling them to disregard their intuition.


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MalyndraCrow
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08 Jul 2014, 5:09 pm

For people I know really well, I've adapted. Though I still say "how are you doing, or what's up" a lot. But for people I don't know, unless they're expressing super extreme emotions like shouting or crying, it's hard to read them. Often times when my mom is upset (usually with my dad), I apologize profusely. She always says I'm not the problem and I have nothing to apologize for, but I do misread her body language a lot. It's not that I don't have an idea that she's upset of frustrated, I just almost always assume it's something I've done when she's never upset with me and has said so. I can't seem to get it through my head.



AmethystRose
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09 Jul 2014, 2:10 am

I'm good at reading body language and facial expressions when I'm looking, but I can't look at people when I'm talking about anything remotely serious, because seeing their expressions is too distracting. I've noticed that when I'm looking at someone's face while I talk, they tend to react to my facial expression more than my words, which makes me realize my face might not match my words, and then I get self conscious and try to control my expression, which makes coherent speech almost impossible.

Also, I tend to over-read people's emotions if I watch for nonverbal cues in conversation. I mean, for example, that I might see anger in someone's mannerisms and think that I made the person angry, not realizing that they're just in a bad mood and not mad at me or even really reacting to me or what I said at all.

I can see how this might look like "mindblindness," but I think it's really the opposite.



AspergianMutantt
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09 Jul 2014, 2:27 am

I think he is trying to ask about or define or is trying to refer to

Theory Of Mind.


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Ganondox
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09 Jul 2014, 3:41 am

Actual mindblindness means someone is unable to attribute mental states to anyone, and it's complete BS made up by people who don't know what they are talking about, and it continues to plague the community. Meanwhile, "mindblindness", the lack of intuition into mental states leading to difficulty in assigning emotions, is more real.


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Waterfalls
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09 Jul 2014, 5:23 am

Ganondox wrote:
"mindblindness", the lack of intuition into mental states leading to difficulty in assigning emotions, is more real.

That's interesting. Especially as mind blindness is a concept that is usually used referring to the minds of others.

As it's so common to have trouble identifying ones own feelings, this starts to seem like a mistake. Maybe it just takes longer to think through someone's state of mind, rather than knowing intuitively, even if it's your own.



Last edited by Waterfalls on 09 Jul 2014, 5:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

AnnePande
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09 Jul 2014, 5:29 am

B19 wrote:
Reading this thread, an irony occurred to me. In the NT world, people who go to therapists for help with relationship problems are advised to recognise and avoid the mistake of "mindreading" - ie, assuming they automatically know what someone else/their partner is thinking or feeling, because (the 'experts' say) - it is impossible to ever know that with any certainty, and relationships based on those false assumptions tend to fail.

Hmmm... yet we are stigmatised for NOT being mindreaders? (Actually, I'm quite good at it). There is some weird double standard going on here that I never noticed before.


Yes, I have seen that kind of double standard many times.

It's not black and white.
"Other people" are not just "other people", not to NTs either. It also depends on how well you know (or even like) the other person, and how similar the other person is to yourself.
Roughly said: maybe NTs tend to think they can read minds, and spectrum people tend to know they can't?