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dmalewski6
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03 Dec 2014, 10:45 am

Sorry here is the link first all nighter in a long time.



http://drhyman.com/blog/2010/05/19/why- ... ent-787624



SweetTooth
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05 Dec 2014, 5:21 am

SweetTooth wrote:
ScottieKarate wrote:
For those of you that went through it, would you recommend it? For everybody else, what would you recommend doing? Do you recommend intensive therapy at all? Special needs preschool? If you had a toddler on the spectrum, what therapies would you be advocating for? Thanks all!

I received my diagnosis only as a young adult. In hindsight, according to my parents my behaviour as a young child was rather a-typical, but they did not send me to any form of therapy. I'm very happy for that. Just accept the child as it is, let it grow up and find its own ways, don't try to "fix" it. Only when serious difficulties arise should therapy be considered, in my opinion. I fully agree with androbot1:

androbot01 wrote:
I'm hoping that as our various autistic mannerisms become more widely known and less feared, that parents will feel less of a need to modify their children.


I would like to add something to this. Today my girlfriend happened to tell me, that she thinks that if my Asperger's were diagnosed earlier, I would not have had such grave problems with OCD later on because the OCD would have been recognized earlier and I would received proper treatment for it. I think this may be very true.

So, for my case (which may be very different from your child's), I conclude that an earlier diagnosis followed by professional education on the topic may have helped me a lot. I deliberately use the word "education" instead of "therapy", because in my limited experience ASD is something that you learn to live with, not really something that you "cure" or "fix". (This is also the line taken by the medical and psychological profession in my country.)



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05 Dec 2014, 6:39 pm

In the early 1980s, behaviourist Ivor Lovacs came to town to show other psychologists how he cured autism.
About 200 of us sat there in a large lecture hall and two chairs were on the stage, one occupied by Lovacs and the other by a 12 year old boy.

The demonstration consisted of this. Lovacs shouting to the boy: look at me! The boy would do this only fleetingly and then look away, embarrassed. Lovacs immediately slapped him hard, over the face, with force that would equate with criminal assault. He repeated this time and time again for 20 minutes - the most sickening display of behaviourism I have ever personally been witness to. And this creep was a professor.

Even worse, of the people in my row of seats, I was the only one who was horrified. The others seemed to think it was "very interesting", as the boy's glances lengthened in time.

It was vicious and dehumanising. Behaviourists earned my contempt that day, and have done nothing since to earn it back. People are not machines. They have feelings, souls, memory, imagination, dreams and innate talents. I was forced to study behaviourism for two academic years, so I am not ignorant of its philosphy and practice. (It claims to have no philosophy). All discussion of the philosophy of science vis a vis behaviourism was banned - yes, really banned - students were told that if they raised this, they would be failed. So the behaviourists in their arrogance even took it upon themselves to censor thought and critical thinking. Never trust them.



androbot01
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05 Dec 2014, 6:45 pm

I am shocked this happened at all and even more so that it was only 30 or so years ago.



B19
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05 Dec 2014, 7:03 pm

Sorry I mis-spelt his surname as Lovacs.

Read this to fully understand the history of ABA and his part in it. Warning: don't read this immediately after a meal, you may bring it back up again.

http://www.sentex.net/~nexus23/naa_aba.html



androbot01
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05 Dec 2014, 7:20 pm

Well, I didn't get far ... "Use ABA or your child will end up institutionalized." "ABA is akin to chemotherapy." That is, the problem is so great, it justifies unethical behaviour (such as hitting a child until he complies. It really is disheartening.



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05 Dec 2014, 7:28 pm

androbot01 wrote:
Well, I didn't get far ... "Use ABA or your child will end up institutionalized." "ABA is akin to chemotherapy." That is, the problem is so great, it justifies unethical behaviour (such as hitting a child until he complies. It really is disheartening.



It's important to read it all - that's not what the writer is saying or supporting at all; she is only outlining what claims the ABAs are making in the introductory sections; she goes on to demolish them with carefully thought out challenges to the promoters of ABA inhumanity. She is ASD herself.



androbot01
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05 Dec 2014, 7:31 pm

Oh I get that. I should have made it clearer with my quotes that it was not the author's voice. I just can't believe that some people think autism is so threatening that they must become violent in reaction.



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05 Dec 2014, 8:07 pm

Lovaas was a monster and a savage, no question about that. I don't think that's a reason to reject every form of modern ABA, though.



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androbot01
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05 Dec 2014, 9:50 pm

This reads like Stephen King writing for Autism Speaks. "Hell bent monsters." Yikes!

But I think the fundamental flaw of Lovaas' theory is this:

Quote:
Lovaas is convinced, on the basis of his experience and that of other researchers, that by forcing a change in a child's outward behavior he can effect an inward psychological change. For example: if he could make Pamela go through the motions of paying attention, she would begin eventually to pay genuine attention (next page). Lovaas feels that by I) holding any mentally crippled child accountable for his behavior and 2) forcing him to act normal, he can push the child toward normality.


It doesn't work like this. You can become a better actor, but inside you're still the same. But neurotypicals seem to live in a world of fantasy and believed personas. So maybe this is why the think this matters so much. There is a huge cost to passing though. I used to be good at it, but have totally burned out now.