"You can't be autistic, you can speak/write/have a job"

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OP- I'm a little familiar with your posts. You seem like a smart, nice person to me. I hate to suggest this, but sometimes people like that, (smart, nice ones) can find themselves surrounded by people who are looking for someone strong to latch onto. It could be that there's nothing wrong with you. I don't doubt that you are autistic, but your coping mechanisms and ways of dealing with things may be just fine. It could be that you are overwhelmed by too many people not carrying their own weight.

If you think that might be the case, I would try to spend a little less time with some of these people (maybe your parents?) so you can focus on what relationships you can't really get away from, like with your wife. That silent treatment stuff doesn't work. Everyone has to communicate, or it has to be assumed to not be an issue. Even in completely neurotypical relationships, those are the rules. Not just in a MARRIAGE- you can't treat a friend like that! I would try to get her talking so you can sort that out, and then when you feel up to it, IF you feel up to it, work on any other important relationships.

But some things may not be worth your efforts. The solution with some people may be to be polite and spend less time with them. I think you're absolutely correct in your read on your parents. It's healthy that you are able to interpret their behavior and how it impacted you. They may never agree with you and accept responsibility. But it may be enough to know they're wrong and just move on.

I get how it can seem baffling Ezra, and I've noticed that newer members will often come on here and express the same bafflement, asking the question why are all these older people suddenly getting diagnoses, and how can they be on the spectrum if they've actually managed to live a "normal" life up till now with "nobody noticing"?

But Ezra, it's been explained over and over again. You as a veteran poster here should know by now; you're a very smart young man and other members here have explained to many others how these older generations have come to be.

Short answer: autism used to be thought of as only a "severe" condition, thus only very clearly and severely affected individuals were diagnosed. Everyone else on the spectrum still suffered from their traits but were not recognized by anyone because even professionals in those eras did not themselves have the information.

Now that the knowledge of the spectrum has been caught-up-on, all the people who now are in their older years are finally getting to seek assessments and indeed it's being found that they were on the autism spectrum all along. There's really nothing to be skeptical of when you look into the history of these developments and understand how whole generations escaped attention and help.

As for getting jobs, getting married and having kids -- some of us may have managed to do these things but with difficulties, problems, and even terrible failures. Just because it looks "normal on paper" doesn't mean that in reality it was plain sailing/easy or nearly didn't happen at all.

I understand what you are saying and agree completely. It's just sometimes lifestyles I see being mentioned....and I don't me the OP's, but in general....sometimes makes me scratch my head. So I can see people who really don't know much or anything about autism being skeptical. Not that that is a good thing, but just the way it is. And then there's times when subjectivity comes into play. I have had people doubt my autism on other forums based on my writing skill and comparing that to someone they are related to with classic autism. For me the old definition of autism is the kind of autism I have. And it's not just the married aspect. There's all kinds of severely disabled people who are married. There are people who are intellectually disabled (which I am not) who are married. What I mean is the whole ball of wax that essentially looks like the type of lifestyle which I will most likely never obtain unless some kind of miracle breakthrough takes place. So sometimes to me it doesn't seem much like autism the way I experience autism, even though I know technically it is.

Thanks, BirdInFlight, that was an excellent explanation. As people say, it is a spectrum, and a lot of what goes on with me is hidden under the surface.

People may see me NOW, and think, married, has job, must be successful, didn't have any major hurdles. That isn't the case. In my childhood, I had all the meltdowns, bullying, behavioral problems, but none of the therapies or interventions from my parents, who just thought I was misbehaving. I would do well in school and then flunk out of something. I would be on the Dean's list and get a graduate fellowship, and then wash out of the program in the first semester. It took me years to get a job that lasted more than a few months, I've been fired more than once, and I still get a severe reprimand every few months. People that were hired at the same time as me have been promoted to two levels higher than I in the same amount of time. I'm married, yeah, but it's been pretty rocky, and she STILL is giving me the silent treatment this morning.

I'm independent, but only because I had no choice. My dad was a sick, abusive bastard, and my mom pretty much ignored it. I couldn't take it at home and got out of there as soon as I could. If it meant spending hours in front of the mirror practicing expressions so i could look like a normal person, that's what it took. I worked temp jobs for years because I was afraid of doing interviews, and it let me pick up a bunch of skills on the fly.

It also has to be said that people in your environment are often very willing to help. Very rarely are people left to be truly alone without a single person caring for them. Whether it's your parents, friends, lover or people from social services, they won't give you the chance to give up. They're very persistent in this too. What I'm trying to say I guess is that achieving success isn't only driven by everyone-for themselves dog-eat-dog competition, but by positive encouragement as well. I think we need more of the latter in our world.

I can identify all the angst presented by the OP and a few other people.

I get it. Experiencing it right now. Trying to find solutions myself.

People with autism do get married and have children. My husband is charming, funny, loyal, trustworthy, articulate when the depression, stress and anxiety don't swamp him. When those three things go out of control, and the sensory issues go nuts, yeah...the social skills go to s**t and forget executive functioning skills.

My husband had Aspie burn out at age 50. The doctor told told him, had he been born later, he would have qualified for an IEP at school. His social skills (when not rehearsed into oblivion) are that bad.

The support group he goes to for Aspergers has about 5 other guys who are in their 50-60s, who are divorced or in the process of getting divorce. They got married, the marriage was terrible, stayed together for the kids. Last one turns 18, and the wife says, "Later, I'm out."

If you think it is hard to function at 20, be a 65 year old man, who's wife was the one who handled all the social connections. She was the one who kept things limping along, and now leaves. It isn't a pretty sight.

Our marriage was swirling the toilet. I told him get help or I'm out. I knew nothing about Autism. I thought it was people in group homes who bang their heads and bite their hands. I was shocked by his test score, and cried. I never knew how hard he had to try to "pass". Then all his sensory issues came tumbling out. Misophonia, food issues, smells, light...a huge laundry list.

I thought he was having a midlife crisis and was being an as*hole. He was seeing his life crumble at work and at home. All the bootstrap methods to deal with other humans wasn't working any more. All those carefully rehearsed conversations didn't work. Being a good lone wolf worker drone didn't.

Long story short...our relationship went to s**t when work changed from lone wolf drone, to multifaceted, team centered, team sharing nightmare. Stress at work bleed over into our home life. He couldn't tell me why (NTs would just buck up and deal at work), and blamed me.

I wish my husband would have gotten diagnosed at 30, but no such thing as Aspergers for adults back then.

This is me to a tee with the only exceptions:
1) Nobody stuck around for me and for that, I salute you.
2) Third marriage and a whole line of wrecked relationships behind me

And what you said about people not knowing is real. Mostly the professionals who should know, don't or belittle people during that self discovery process. I've been using terms like 'Sensory Overload' and 'Hyperfocus' and 'my ability to just zone out on a concept to where I can only experience what I thinking about' for about 25 years now. A few also noticed my inability to understand certain things like being complimented or how abrupt I can be. But it just wasn't know enough or was just listed as some sort of personality disorder.

And, when you think you're normal, like everybody else, you think they process things like you do. You can be a part, but always separate. And, you think that is normal.

No matter what improvements you make in sensory overload, EF, or social skills, I don't see calm and happiness unless you have a good relationship with your spouse, or you divorce your spouse and move on with your own life. A dysfunctional relationship with a spouse is crappy for anyone, even if they have no other issues.

Wow... You could have been writing about my mom.. Except I wasn't a free range kid. I'm 34 and from a very uptight religious household. Everything that happened to my brother and I happened inside the house.. And my mother was the queen of denial... And she never paid any attention to us... Didn't even care whether or not I could pass school or graduate, which I did not..

Every job she has had has been about helping people, whether volunteer or pay..

And now, my favorite one yet... she's helping care for an autistic kid for her job... And she will go on and on about him and all of the good she does for him.. While I'm just sitting here scratching my head, wondering why she couldn't have taken care of her own two kids...

My Dad does this to me and my brother. He will go on and on and on about how this person he had such a great relationship with when young and how wonderful they are doing because of his help. Meanwhile, I was the smart one that should have always 'known better' and had no relationship with my dad really.

The hardest thing for me to work on is telling my husband explicitly what I need. In the NT world so much is non verbal. A hug, a glance, a hand hold, if you look up when someone enters the room...all that stuff conveys information.

I can hear the near fatal eye rolls from here as I type this, but I had to tell him I needed him to say

Good morning
Good night
Can I help you out/do you need anything/would you like...?

This is an example when I didn't know about ASD.

"Man...it snowed outside..."

My husband is still looking at his computer, doing whatever. I get huffy. Grab the shovel and do the outside myself seething. (yeah..I know..I'm an idiot!)

If I had said that to an NT friend, a whole conversation would have evolved if I was going out to shovel, if the person wanted to help, did I need help, should we go out for hot chocolate at Starbucks afterwards? What did we want to do the rest of the day?

So now...

It snowed outside, can you please bring up the shovel now (now is a very important word here), I'm going to shovel.

He gets shovel and asks (he doesn't get this part at all, which totally screwed him at work), do you (me) need anything?

Sad thing is, he would do anything for anyone if you ask. He never would ask a person, "Could I get you something/help you." His coworkers though he was a self centered as*hole because of it. It really broke his heart when he read that fact on his final work review.

I also hope you understand that for some people, these views can be distorted..

I am 34 and I was not diagnosed... I don't know of anyone who was.. I'd never even heard of autism.. I was more just considered a problem kid. I read too slow and didn't understand things.. I remember studying for days, for an exam, and actually getting a 0% on it. True story.. And I was humiliated. And then I was lectured by my teacher.. and later punished at home.. And while I didn't usually do that badly, I still struggled hard with my subjects, and would mostly get in trouble for not finishing my assignments on time, when we only had the one class period to do it... Instead of anyone questioning any of this... I was just that kid who didn't care about school and didn't want to try.

I dealt with a lot of abuse and neglect at home, which made me pretty much become obedient to everyone around me, including my so called friends, who I also allowed to abuse me.. on a much smaller scale.. But aside from physical touching and physical harm.. they would also take my things.. they would lock me up in places like closets or a storage building as a joke.. they would do things at school, such as put gum on a desk, and then tattle on me for doing it.. I even had a couple of friends, when I was about 14.. who just picked me up and carried me outside and put me in the trunk of their car, and drove around to different places, stopping and getting out... and just leaving me in the trunk the entire time.. And with all of this going on, you can only imagine what my physical encounters with people were like..

But if we'd met before I learned about autism and started to understand more about myself... and we were swapping stories... You'd have just heard me talking casually about it.. even as if I found those pranks funny.. or talking about situations in which I was around, while other people were having fun and getting along, but I was being quiet and not really part of the group... But, the stories that I was not technically involved in are still fun to tell, and still give off the vibes that I had close friends, when I really didn't.

And this isn't lying... it's more... basically like you have the lack of words to describe what's really happened.

I thought these people were my friends... I never really stopped to question it.. I thought that my teachers and my family had my best intentions in mind and that I was just a failure. I really did believe that I was bad, and deserved to be in trouble as much as I was.. when in reality, I'd say that I probably deserved about 1/5 of the punishments that I had received as a kid..

I do often wonder just how different my life could have been if I'd had an early diagnosis. I'm glad that kids today aren't just being tossed aside and labeled as problem kids, but actually receiving help, instead.

And, of course, I'm not implying everyone's situation is like mine.. I know there are lots of people on the spectrum who have a social life and good solid relationships... I will also add that I've had a few relationships and all of them were abusive, up until my current one, which has lasted about a year and a half now... Which, I also would not have spoken of my relationship problems while I was in the relationship. I blamed myself for those things, as well...

But hopefully that explains a bit, how a persons stories might not have been as great as they sound in their posts.

It is very frustrating. :/

Yep, that's me up one side and down the other. Although I was conditioned early on with the good night and good morning thing. And, I will always reply if spoken to in that manner. So, those aspects of social interaction are ingrained. But beyond that, I'm lost.

It's funny you mentioned all those things about not offering and it really hit home with me. It's interesting to hear from someone who's on the other side. Kinda adds to my already growing list of things I'm learning, and it's unsettling.

I know who I am inside, but apparently, I'm not who I thought I was to those around me.

Tawaki, I so relate to your husband, because your "It snowed" story sounds like you could be talking about me too!

While I was reading your post, I came to the bit where you say to your husband "Oh look it snowed outside," and my first thought was my reaction would have been to look up and say "Oh wow, yeah, isn't it pretty!" Then go back to my computer!

I too, like your husband, would not have put two and two together and realized that you might be suggesting it's time for one of us to volunteer to shovel. I wouldn't even have thought about that unless or until we were walking out the door and needing the car.

I relate a lot to your husband from your descriptions (although with the gender reversed as I'm female). I would need to be specifically told "Oh look it snowed! We need to shovel!"

I'm terrible at inferring something from one statement; someone has to state to me very specifically anything they want me to do or know or act upon, and ask me very directly.