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benjimanbreeg
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29 Nov 2007, 5:44 pm

Age1600 wrote:
Isaura wrote:
Thank you, Kingdom, i am looking for the support group.

But i dont even know if it makes sence for us to stay together, I am concerned that when we have kids it may get much harder. Does any one have any experience in the relationship with a NT person? Can it even work? is it possible?


You should defintely try to stay together, try to work things out. My nt boyfriend drives me nuts, when i broke my arm, i was loosing it, we almost lost everything, but he surprised me still does. I'm too afraid of becoming a mother because im bad with empathy and that gentle side, but my bf has all of that im missing, just like you have what hes missing, he'll bring some amazing things to the child while you bring other amazing things. He might be able to teach that child soo many things you can,t and you'll be able to teach that child so many things he can't. Thats why sometimes NT/ASD relationships work. I work at childrens specialized hospital where i can be holding a siezing cerebral paulsi baby to a baby who has down syndrome, and needs a feeding/breathing tube to live where i still have soooo many problems being gentle and showing that empathy, but i work on it all the time, and with time anything can happen. After 4 years, i learned how to actually interact with the child to the point that babies want to be held by me. Never under estimate somebody even if their on the spectrum!


Well said



Isaura
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29 Nov 2007, 5:44 pm

I am reading about HFA, and I have some questions--he is not clumsy, extremely the opposite-he does yoga, professional swimmer and diver, he skis. and he is successful at work--as I said he is a doctor. Even though he is saying that it is very hard for him to talk to patients, he says it exausts him. When i come home and want to talk, he does not get it. he asks didn't you talk at work enough? arent you tired from talking?



Isaura
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29 Nov 2007, 5:50 pm

Age, i dont know, it is very hard when you cant communicate with your husband--i have to explain all my emotions and thoughts in detail for him to get me. We live with a roommate who is my close friend (gay) and I talk to him when i have the need. But i am afraid that if we start living alone i will just loose my mind from the silence, sometime i want to scream or shake him up to get some emotion. I start huge fights with him to get something out him, some emotion, even if it is anger or frustration. and I know it is not healthy.
I talked to his mom and brother, and they've been having the same problems with him.
I did not understand that he could be different because i never met anyone like him, i though he was shy, depressed, etc. I was thinking then with time, when he gets to know me, he would open up. but now I see that it is just who he is



Age1600
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29 Nov 2007, 5:52 pm

Isaura wrote:
I am reading about HFA, and I have some questions--he is not clumsy, extremely the opposite-he does yoga, professional swimmer and diver, he skis. and he is successful at work--as I said he is a doctor. Even though he is saying that it is very hard for him to talk to patients, he says it exausts him. When i come home and want to talk, he does not get it. he asks didn't you talk at work enough? arent you tired from talking?


I've done yoga before, i almost stopped breathing and was very confused but i tried it haha. I hate talking too, unless its about interests or something that i love. Maybe you need to understand no autistic is alike, a lot of us have so many similiarities but thats about it. Why don't you look up just autistic disorder, or pdd-nos? I mean if hes have problems with communication and socialization, and seems to be on the spectrum, but doesn't quite fit te criteria for Aspergers, HFA or autistic disorder, he might defintely qualify for a diagnosis of PDD-NOS. It can mean that the person shows signs of autism, but doesn't quite fit the criteria.


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Age1600
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29 Nov 2007, 5:59 pm

Isaura wrote:
Age, i dont know, it is very hard when you cant communicate with your husband--i have to explain all my emotions and thoughts in detail for him to get me. We live with a roommate who is my close friend (gay) and I talk to him when i have the need. But i am afraid that if we start living alone i will just loose my mind from the silence, sometime i want to scream or shake him up to get some emotion. I start huge fights with him to get something out him, some emotion, even if it is anger or frustration. and I know it is not healthy.
I talked to his mom and brother, and they've been having the same problems with him.
I did not understand that he could be different because i never met anyone like him, i though he was shy, depressed, etc. I was thinking then with time, when he gets to know me, he would open up. but now I see that it is just who he is


I know what you mean communication is the key to any relationship, but maybe you need to understand that it is hard for him, and that with time and effort, maybe things could get better. After a long day at work, exhausted from all the talking, he may need to rest, wait until the lights are out, and hes more calm, maybe he'll talk then. I do most of my communicating at night, i hate light, very hypersensitive to light, gives me headaches, and after a long day my brain takes forever to recoop, so when it gets dark, my brain is in a state of mind to actually take more information in, which sounds weird. You know might also work, try pecs with him, if he is on the spectrum, some ASDers perfer visual rather then verbal, for example, i can't deal with any verbal stuff, its like whoa what was said, but if their was visual im more prone to getting it. Maybe take a picture of you two together kissing, or two people exhanging their feelings, maybe show him that your upset and that its bothering you, maybe he has no idea.


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Juggernaut
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29 Nov 2007, 6:21 pm

I think he definitely fits the criteria for aspergers or high functioning autism. Being affectionate in bed is primarily a sexual rather than emotional act, so for those saying that his ability to be physical negates autism, that' not true. I see no reason why your husband is NOT autistic in some manner. It is, after all, a spectrum, not a dissase; you don't get your blood tested for autism. I would in fact go so far as to say that you would have to prove he is NT, rather than prove he is autistic of some sort, because the basics for being AS are there. AS people are everywhere, though a minority, they are simply a subset of a neurological type. Since being AS can and often is "normal" in the sense that it is not a disease but personality type, it would be safe to assume he has it.



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29 Nov 2007, 6:40 pm

HFA, Asperger's, PDD-NOS, doesn't really matter. He could be on the spectrum, and it's causing damage. Isaura, I'd be careful about using the diagnostic criteria as a checklist - they're not. We all express our autism in different ways, some are missing some bits completely - he might be that way with touch, it happens.
Firstly, and most importantly, I'd say you need to get back to using contraception 'til you've ironed these things out. It's important that you're sure you can make things work before you take the step of bringing another life into your home environment. That doesn't mean it won't happen, but you need to wait 'til things feel more stable.
Second, I'd suggest going back to IMing if you can? If he communicated better via text, then use that. It may be something about speech, body language, all that extra input makes it difficult for him to process, but he'd find it easier if you went back to texting. Another solution is to darken a room so it's black, so you can't see each other - then it's just words.
Third, he needs to get over himself and see someone. Knowing for sure whether he has an Autism Spectrum Disorder will help give you both coping strategies, a reading list, and ideas for how to make your relationship work. I think it's clear that right now, things aren't working, so you need to take steps to try and fix that. Seeking a diagnosis is a clear action you can take that can hopefully make both of you feel like you're taking steps to remedy your problems.

In the mean time, remember you have to be clear to him in what you need. If he says he doesn't want to talk because he doesn't see the point, saying something like "it will make me happy and make me feel more secure in our relationship. Please do this for me." If he's too tired, then try to schedule for another time when he's less likely to feel tired. Remember you need to make room for him too - you may have to ask him to do things he's not completely comfortable with to help pull things together, but sometimes you'll have to back off and accept he's not in a good place to talk even if you feel you really need to. It'll have to be about compromises. And please remember in this context, "talk" may mean "communicate by whatever means work." Like I said, IMing may be a useful tool for you guys to try and work through this.

Recommended reading for you. But think of that as only the start of a lot of books you'll have to look at.


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Isaura
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29 Nov 2007, 7:59 pm

Guys, thank you so much for all your help!
Yes, i understand that everyone is different, but he is definatly in the spectrum.
Everything you are writing fits him--he is more comfortable in the dark, actually, but still not much of a talker.
I try not to bother him and give him space, i see that it is hard and painful for him to communicate, and i try to leave him alone, but sometimes it is just unbearable--like when we are on a long flight or drive. We drove to Canada--9 hours without talking, i almost lost my mind.
The problem is that I am suffering too in all this, i get depressed and cry from lack of affection and communication.

I will try to talk him in to seeing a specialist, but he is very resentful to it right now, he does not want to hear about it. I agree that it would help to get a professional advise on this

Does anyone know a good place to start in new York city? where should we go? who is good to see? what kind of doctor? i would no dare to suggest a psychiatrist to him

yes, emailing, texting and stuff works--when he was on vacation, he emailed me like 20 times a day, but the problem is, for me it is all about personal interaction.

We are having fertility problems, have been trying to have a baby for a while, so i dont think contraception is an issue at this point



Isaura
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29 Nov 2007, 8:04 pm

Guys, I understand that it is hard for him, i really do, when he tries to talk there is a painful expression on his face--it looks like he is being tortured, and he makes long pauses between the phrases, like he has to think what to say next. It is almost like he thinks too much about what he is about to say, analyzing every word--i can practically see his brain moving and clicking inside. Talking drains him out, it is hard work

I guess the issue is me, because he is fine with the way he is, it is me who is suffering, so the real question is--should i leave him instead of trying to change and pressure him to talk an open up? But, then, again,he will have the same problem in future relationships unless he find someone like himself



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29 Nov 2007, 9:25 pm

You just seem like a really over emotional type, like my mom, always needing to talk. When someone has strong really intense emotions, I almost think the only person who can put up with them is someone on the spectrum, because they don't feel the really intense emotions that would cause pain for other people.

What you need to do is get out and have a life. Hang out with friends and do stuff that doesn't involve your husband. Just because you are married and live together doesn't mean you have to spend all your time together. I think too many people these days have this idealistic fairytale idea of marriage. They think that the husband and wife must share all the same interest and do everything together. That is unrealistic. Of course they will have certain things in common, but spouses need to respect each other as separate people too.

You shouldn't let how he is at family gatherings bother you. The fact he shows up at all is a good sign, and he probably wouldn't even want to do that without his computer.

I grew up with a classic aspie dad. I always tried to get him interested in me. Even though he would spend time with me he never gave me as much attention as I wanted from him sometimes. I don't regret having him for a father. I do regret believing that I was like him and would like the same things he did, just because I wanted to make money, but I was never really interested in engineering. I was always more interested in writing and art even though there is no money in it. I spent too much time believing that how I am is bad, and that I would be better off to follow some other way because I could make money in it.

I didn't realize until recently how the emotions of others became my identity, rather than just being myself.


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29 Nov 2007, 9:26 pm

Isaura wrote:
Guys, I understand that it is hard for him, i really do, when he tries to talk there is a painful expression on his face--it looks like he is being tortured, and he makes long pauses between the phrases, like he has to think what to say next. It is almost like he thinks too much about what he is about to say, analyzing every word--i can practically see his brain moving and clicking inside. Talking drains him out, it is hard work

I guess the issue is me, because he is fine with the way he is, it is me who is suffering, so the real question is--should i leave him instead of trying to change and pressure him to talk an open up? But, then, again,he will have the same problem in future relationships unless he find someone like himself


YEP, he sounds HFA if it is autism. But you must have known what he was like going in. How did you meet?

9 hours IS a long time to be silent in a case like that. if you can relate to any interests he has, and you drive, he should open up a bit. As for the apparent lack of feeling, etc... PLEASE don't hold that against him. The average woman feels that way about NORMAL men, and AS men are "worse".



Isaura
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29 Nov 2007, 9:40 pm

Guys, i do have a life, but it concerns me that i reach out to others for moral and emotional needs--my roommate, mom, i always hang out with my friends, and do most of the stuff on my own, and it bothers me, because i should be able to discuss issues with my husband instead of my boss at work

Of course i saw how he was from the beginning and it did bother me, but i thought he was just shy and would open up later when he got to know me. he was very attentive and caring and was always trying to help. there was also a very strong physical attraction that compensated for the lack of talking. Later I thought that he was unhappy with work/me and was depressed. It was only after i talked to his mom about his childhood when i realized that it was deeper. Before I thought he could change, or that he was just bored with me, so I was trying to get him interested in talking

how did we meet--on line, obviously! his job at the time was with computers and he emailed me all day long, so i did not notice at first that he did not talk much during dates--was to attracted to him, we were just having sex non stop. obviously after 3.5 years it is not like that anymore
Again, i did not know anything about autism at that time--i had no idea, never med anyone like him, so i could not put my finger on what was wrong

I know that many usual men are not affectionate and stuff, but still they get exited about SOMETHING, they have emotions and they are interested in others

I would not say that I am overly emotional--with him i am became kind of numb actually, and it bothers me, I am afraid that with time i will turn into him.My dad came to visit and it was difficult to talk to him in the evenings, because i was used to spend every evening in silence reading a book



Isaura
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29 Nov 2007, 9:47 pm

Taimaak, we are from russia--we have different traditions-russian families are very close, it is expected that sons in law are a part of the bigger family, so it is a problem--my parents dont get it, they think he does not care about me or them. His family has problems too--i can see that it is very hard for his mom and brother. She calls me to find out how he is doing, because he does not tell her anything.



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29 Nov 2007, 9:50 pm

Isuara wrote:
I guess the issue is me, because he is fine with the way he is, it is me who is suffering, so the real question is--should i leave him instead of trying to change and pressure him to talk an open up?

I think you have an obligation to him to try and make your marriage work before taking the decision to leave. That doesn't mean don't leave. But it means trying everything else you can think of first before you do.
And I meant what I said about laying out your needs in front of him - you have an obligation to try and give him some space and accommodate him, but he has an obligation, too. He has to try and make things work, to help you with your emotional needs. If he tries and fails, then that sucks. But if he won't try, that's not autism - it's just being an ass. So lay it out. Say you have needs that aren't being met. Say you need time to talk/communicate, ask him to make the effort. If he won't even try, you've got wider problems. If he will, and can't, then that's when counseling and therapy come in as the next line of trying to cope.
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But, then, again,he will have the same problem in future relationships unless he find someone like himself

Not your responsibility. Your responsibility is to try and make the relationship you have work, and if you can't, to break it off in as kind a way as you can find. But after that, you can't worry about him.

Re: Therapy. How's he with reading? There is so much material out there right now, it might instead be best to give him some books to read over, to see if that would help?


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Isaura
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29 Nov 2007, 9:53 pm

are HFA people good at learning foreign languages? he knows 3 languages, he can write,read, but talking in hard in any language, even in his own
please dont laugh at me for my ignorance

He also gets irritated when i show any signs of activity--like if I try to clean, or do something, he is always complaining that i am too active--asks me to sit down or lay down and watch tv, he always thinks that i am hyperactive, even though it is not the case, it is just he is much, much slower and does not like any commotion around, everything has to be quiet. And he gets very stressed if we have people over or guests from out of town, he says he cant handle it and needs to be alone, even though he is in his room and is not bothered.
On the other hand he always wants me around him, gets upset if i go to another room or leave,he immediately calls me back and wants me to sit quietly and read or watch tv next to him, but without talking. And he does not get why i am upset--he always asks, why arent you happy? we are together, why do you need to talk? why just being with me is not enough? why cant you learn to be happy without talking?



Isaura
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29 Nov 2007, 10:11 pm

mmaestro, i will give him the books, thank you, he reads a lot, likes it

as for trying and laying out my needs--we did talk about it. he does not get it, he thinks that i should just accept him the way he is and be happy. He does not understand that i have the need to talk, to communicate. He gets very frustrated.he is like--you talk to everyone else, isnt it enough? I asked him to try many times, but he just shuts down and says that he cant change, he tried,but he cant help it.

I cant imagine therapy--how would it work? he will not talk to the therapist, he will just sit there playing with his palm pilot.
Sometimes i do think that maybe he is just a selfish ass who does not care, thats why i am trying to find out--it is something beyond him or does he not care about me? The hardest part was when i miscarried,i needed him to comfort me, to tell me that he is with me, but he would hold me,hug me, cry, but not talk. I know he loves me, but he said it to me maybe twice in 3.5 years.