WTF!!? PLEASE Help Me Understand!! !!

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I also agree with what Greentea has said, and that it was beautifully put!

I used to be a member of a forum that gave advice to pet owners. I seemed to be doing all right, until somebody asked a question about weaning puppies. I know a lot about the subject, but because my reply was slightly different to the standard one that had always been given before, my God, did they go for me. I was flamed in public on the site, and on the member's discussion forum, and the several attempts I made to contact the aggrieved parties and discuss it were completely ignored. I left, in the end - there was no point in remainng a member when the existing ones were more than capable of regurgitating their pre-formed answers.

And the person who originally posted the question was more than happy with my response.

Not all NTs are like this. Just the ones that infuriate you are!

Not all NT communication is about bonding. Most social niceties are ways to ease someone into the exchange of actual information. I try to limit niceties to work related situations and my bf’s family. With friends and family, I just come right out and say what I need to. My friends and family are the same way.

Siuan, you should take pride in helping someone; that is most important. Now all the other meanies look like a fool because you were right. Now they will ignore you because they are embarrassed.

I find a lot of NTs do that, ignore you when they are wrong. I don’t let it bother me. It’s their loss.

Always ask questions! My bf always gets mad that I don’t ask enough. I’ll give him a fact, and he can’t understand why I didn’t get every detail. Example, “Friend is in town. We’re going to dinner tonight”. He will want to know where, what time, etc. Those are details I worry about come dinner time. I will then call my friend and ask what time, where, etc. I can’t handle every detail at once. I am learning to ask for more details if it is a topic I will be discussing with him. For work, I will still show up at meetings having no clue what they are about until I get there. I am lucky to get the place and time correct!

Yes, God forbid you acknowledge the existence of the powers that be. You're instantly called delusional, and ostracized. You're supposed to pretend you don't notice the powers that be at work. Everyone notices them, but everyone is busy pretending they don't. The day I discovered the powers that be and acknowledged them innocently like the girl that says the king is nude, even my therapist turned against me like a furious animal. Now I know better than acknowledging them in public.

Lots and lots of people live like me, shutting up what is obvious because it's dangerous to express it. In a way, we're happier than the rest, because when we can't comply with the "socially appropriate" we don't feel inadequate as human beings, we only feel like bad as sheep. I pity people who still think the ""socially appropriate" is a god to worship, a valuable thing, and when they can't, they feel like flawed humans rather than flawed sheep.

Powers that be?

YOU'RE PARANOID! WRONG! BAD BAD BAD! GO TO A SHRINK! GET YOUR HEAD CHECKED!

THERE IS NO MAN BEHIND THE CURTAIN!


Baaaaaaaaaaa.......



I just don't talk about it anymore, when I see how absolutely blind people are to what's going on I just get upset, and I don't think that there's any benefit in putting more negative emotion out into the atmosphere. So I try and focus on the good, and speak to those who do have a clue so we can share our truths and learn and grow together, and the rest of the time go along with the rest of the population and feign interest in shopping and clothes and shoes and pretend to be just another sheeple.

I live in a fundamentalist country, so here you couldn't find friends who acknowledge these things. So I'm used to not sharing about these things.

Last year I went on a blind date, and I dared say that we don't get Western literature here because the gov't blocks it. We have only one bookstore in the country, and it's fostered by the American gov't. He cursed me and that was the end of the date. I wouldn't dare go on another blind date ever again, but if I did, I'd have to be so cautious of what I say, that I don't know how I could spend a lifetime with that person being careful about each and every word I say.

"I've come to the conclusion that most NT communication is NOT about getting the job done or making things happen - it's about bonding, this magical bonding stuff that makes you - allegedly - feel all warm and fuzzy and one of the gang."

Yes, I think this nails it too. Which smacks right up against the whole small talk annoyance I have such issue with. People much prefer to talk about things that have no point and share fake intrest rather than actually sharing a real interest and having meaningful conversation. Thus, when I try to engage someone in the latter, I'm often bounced right out on my ear.

Deefor4: That is PRECISELY what I am talking about. The people to whom we respond are typically very happy with the response, and others - for reasons that have always left me baffled and frustrated - take great issue and band together for a nice group flaming party. Similarly, I've witnessed this in the opposite direction. I've had people answer my own questions in a thorough and informative manner, only to watch the fallout that comes as they get flamed. This is where the head trip is for me, I just don't get it. Yes, yes, I know there are NT-logical explanations to this, but I cannot wrap my head around the lack of actual logic in it. I'm really sorry you had that experience. It sounds like you had useful information to provide in that forum.

fivecents: Agreed, not all NTs are like this, but so many I've encountered. You're right, I know they move to ignoring because they're probably embarassed when it gets to the point that it is proven I am correct - thing is, it doesn't matter when I get banned from discussion forums for reasons exactly like that described by Deefor4.

"Yes, God forbid you acknowledge the existence of the powers that be. You're instantly called delusional, and ostracized. You're supposed to pretend you don't notice the powers that be at work. Everyone notices them, but everyone is busy pretending they don't. The day I discovered the powers that be and acknowledged them innocently like the girl that says the king is nude, even my therapist turned against me like a furious animal."

"Lots and lots of people live like me, shutting up what is obvious because it's dangerous to express it."

See, I know this is correct, but this is exactly what unnerves me to the point of wanting to move to some very isolated place in the wilderness, far away from this warped human civilization, where I don't have to play these ridiculous games. See, my problem is that I am the one who will not be silenced. I question authority, I do what is right (as opposed to what may be expected), I seek logic and utilize it, I ask questions and seek answers, I point out flaws and errors. I am the squeaky wheel. I'm not a sheep (sheeple? lol). I'm a logical human being. And boy does that piss off the majority.

ONE BOOKSTORE?

ONE??

,,,and they try and make us out to be paranoid delusionals...

boy oh boy, the people who run your country have massive problems.


Do you have to live there?

Goodness, what country is that? Bet you love the internet!!

Yes, the internet is my salvation. I don't talk to anyone outside of it. If you met me in real life here, you'd think "Oh, there's that poor woman Greentea, who is so boring. She's so quiet, for God's sake, does she have nothing to say ever?" This is what people think of me nowadays, because I've been fired from enough jobs for telling it like it is (very respectfully) and now I know better.

Siuan: It's the logical step to take, but the problems with living in the wild are the aloneness, the lack of help and that in many wild spaces there's a power that be that rules it, it's wild but not free. Most people in our situation flee society in other ways: try to make a living with minimal politics, and the rest of the time have interests and pastimes that don't go with the mainstream. I, for one, don't own a TV, don't go to mainstream cinema, don't vacation like everyone else, don't see the "popular" people, etc. etc. Also, people who shun society and go to live apart from it are often brought back against their will as an example that if you flee you'll regret it. Remember the guy that was taken to jail recently for taking his daughter to live in the wild? He was disgusted with the drugs, alcohol and shallowness of teenage society and wanted something better for his daughter. He was accused of kidnapping her and raping her, which was later proven untrue. Yet, he was made to go through hell before he was proven innocent, and his daughter was taken away from him forever. Try to escape society and it will find you, and give you hell for trying.

I find the best way to escape it is to 'become part of it'. Get a normal job, go out with normal people, do normal things like drink coffee at weekends and go shopping and watch TV and go to the cinema. Don't do anything to raise anyone's suspicion. But then in your free time read. Read, read, read. Research, learn, teach yourself. Be completely aware of everything that's going on and don't let yourself be blinded by propaganda and hidden agendas. Then, when the moment comes up in conversation with a sheep, slip something in that might just have them thinking. A fact, a figure, a comment slightly off the norm. They'll ask you about it, you act cool and nonchalant, and then hit them with the truth. And another thinker is born.

From profuse experience in doing what you say, Lekiwi, another enemy is born, not another thinker. Those who don't think, it's not for lack of exposure. It's because they don't want to. And they see thinkers as dangerous.

I just want to say that I do see this here on this forum as well especially on certain topics and by and against certain posters, and I belong to several (I assume) mostly-NT forums (two related to a medical condition I have, one related to religion and politics) where people have the exact same complaint as you do about other sites, so I don't think it's an NT thing at all. I think it's completely unrelated to one's neurodiversity status.

If I had to hazard a guess, I'd say it's more related to one's level of education, insofar as people who are educated expect others to be educated as well, and people who are not educated may feel threatened by people who are. So sites that attract people who are more educated will have this less, and sites that attract people who are less educated will have it more.

Every bit of what I am hearing, I know as truth. Society loves to make examples of those who deviate from the path. I find some humor (the twisted sort) in the fact that we're supposedly a free country with all kinds of tolerance, but thinkers truly are seen as dangerous. That is, unless their thinking contributes something positive to the collective.

I think you're partially correct. In my experience, medical professionals often take great offense if a layperson knows as much as they do (or more). Sometimes people do, through personally acquired knowledge or experience, because even medical professionals cannot know every thing about every topic. That is why there is specialization. Still, they take offense. It is apparently easier to dispose of the offender than it is to admit a non-professional might have come by information they did not have themselves.

Sorry - I know that paragraph sucked gramatically, but I have had to come back to this post about 7 times between taking care of my little ones.

Einstein was ostracized and mocked for many, many years before anyone took a second look at his work. He went through hell and was totally alone, until one day it was already impossible to continue pretending he was just an idiot.

He donated all the fruits of his work, royalties, inheritance, any moneys that would ever be made of his work in future, everything, to my university. In the 6 years I studied and lived there, I didn't hear him mentioned ONCE. Nor is his name on any wall or monument or street around. He may have been a genius and given us all he had, but he's still ostracized and unforgiven for knowing more than the powers that be in science back then.

i came across a copy of Farenheit451 in 6th grade, which was already a favorite book of mine, but THIS edition had the above quote in the front of it.

and i thought i was the most brilliant thing i had ever heard and i thought about it for hours...

i was so excited about it.

i turned in a paper written vertically... i got an F.

i can't remember if i found it before of after i started wearing different colored socks... for some reason, it was a fad in my school to have a certain brand of socks that cost $10 a pair, and people started to ask me-- why i didn't have any and couldn't my parents afford to buy me some? and i was like, why the heck would i want them to??

so i started to wear mismatched socks to make it even more obvious that i was against the sock movement, and the experience actually amazed me because i got a lot of things thrown at me and stuff... but when people would ask why i wore mismatched socks, sometimes i would answer with, "if they give you ruled paper, RIGHT the other way..."

which no one ever got, but it made me a little bit happy anyway, and back then i had a lot more hope that "my people" were somewhere out there to be found... so i just kept hoping someone would break into laughter when i said that.

so i have always been looking for the path to find the people who are NOT on the path, whatever they are called... and i think at least one or two are here on WP.