Okay, bear with me here. This is about anorexia...

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what i'm saying is that i don't think there is such a thing as totally individual psychology.

individuals are different, obviously, because of different genetic/biological make-up, brain chemistry, etc. but psychology - as i understand the term, and as distinct from neurology/biology - is, as far as i can tell, all about what humans do to each other...

sure, some people would still starve themselves - people throughout history have found reasons for that and for all kinds of other forms of "self-abuse" (not that i believe it always is "abuse", but for want of a better term). people have done it because of religion, for example - but that too is social...

and i think a massive problem (if notthe problem) that our present day society has is trying to medicalise/"psychologise" (thus blaming the individual for) all sorts of personal problems which actually have roots in society (including the family, economic/political structures, religion/ideology/etc) or in society failing to accommodate individual differences which exist because of biology (the social problems suffered by most people with AS being a pretty obvious example of the latter)...

i think we actually agree with each other (on the fundamentals if not on precise terminology)...

i'll post again with reference to Nomaken's "don't be daft" attitude and AS when i can coherently put together what i was going to say...

LOL. i think we do too.

Ok folks, the way I see it, there are people with Anorexia, and then there are try-hard attention seeking people who try to starve themselves because it's trendy.

The people with Anorexia genuinely have issues with eating. I have known several people with genuine anorexia, and had to witness two of them sitting side by side, both saying they felt like an elephant sitting next to the other. (Both were waffer thin). I remember one girl in particular. She was in and out of hospital for over a year because she was so underweight. She spent a large amount of that time on bedrest to conserve energy. She absolutely HATED eating, she genuinely felt fat, and yet aside from that, she was an amazing person. She was a music prodigy who made a cello come alive (she had prefect pitch), she was kind, friendly, very academic (she loved school and really wanted to be allowed to go but she wasn't), yet despite all this, she had a hard time relating with her family, and was genuinely convinced that she was fat and ugly. There is no doubt in my mind that she was genuine: I simply refuse to believe that anyone as nice and as intelligent as her would starve themselves because they felt like a bit of extra attention. Besides, Nasal Gastric Tubes are NOT FUN!

Then there are the people who want attention. In other words, middle to upper class girls in middle secondary school who have been influenced by the number of weight loss clinics available, and think the whole 'OMG MY BUM LOOKS SO BIG IN THESE JEANS I SO HAVE TO NOT DRINK SOFT DRINK AND JUST STICK WITH MY EVIAN COS IT'S WAY TRENDY' thing is cool. I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be judging, but I feel it's true, although I admit that it is heavily influenced by society's ideals of weight and figure. In the same class, I group the 'omg life is so depressing and my parents don't love me anymore because they didn't buy me alcohol and let me go to *insert name of dodgiest guy at school*'s party, and they just don't understand what it's like because life is soo hard for me and nobody even cares... oh I know, I will start a blog and spurt crappy poems to the world about how I cut myself and how I starve myself (like, totally, I mean, I might have like, a 5 pack of doughnuts when I get home, but I swear I only ever eat sugar-free gum when I'm out, and I eat laxatives like you wouldn't believe' people. Again, I know I sound harsh. Again, I think that a lot of this comes from external pressures. And yet, it is people like this, people who make a big fuss about starving themselves and only last a few days that give people with Anorexia, a real and deadly disability, a bad name.

I once knew a girl who threatened to poke her arm with a sewing needle and rupture a main artery and die. She also attacked her wrists once with a vegetable peeler, leaving tiny little surface marks. Sure, she was depressed, she was sad, she was lonely, she wanted attention. This was all very real to her, and I don't judge her on that. But was she genuinely suicidal? No. If she had been, she would have taken a knife to her wrists, instead of telling everyone that she *would* kill herself. I had another friend who carved profanities into his skin, covered it up with pieces of A4 paper, and then went around telling everyone that he had paper taped to him so... oh s**t.

good points, kitten.

in my job, you learn very quickly that even "attention seeking" behaviours as kitten describes warrant some intervention. yes, it might be histrionics. but it's worth (although irritating and exhausting) following things up - the risk of missing a genuine cry for help is too great.

someone who is self abusing is doing it for a reason, and "teenage angst" isn't necessarily a trivial thing.

*sigh* I just realised that the guy that taped paper to himself and ran around telling everyone that it was there to hide that he cut himself... he committed suicide within a year. I'm sorry... I don't know what I was saying. I wasn't trying to diminish the attention seeking because there is a reason that they are seeking attention... but it's different to Anorexia, where it is less about seeing attention and more about being just plain sick.

*sigh*

I've wondered if "attention seeking" is just the extrovert's way of expressing that something is wrong. How do we know that the more quiet/insular self-destructiveness of the people who are taken seriously is not just the introvert's way of expressing the same thing?

How much of histrionics are false words intended to win sympathy, and how much are just born of the lack of fear of letting others see what state your mind is in?

great way of putting it, pyraxis.

My sister took ballet when she was little. The teacher made her be really skinny. And in high school or something she made her self throw up when she had lunch.

I hope it wasn't because of that ballet teacher! Good teachers DO NOT encourage that at all! But the truth is that a person has to be thin to do ballet. When teachers tell dancers to watch their weight they usually just tell them to stop eating junk food and eat more salads etc.

I think my mom has it but is too ashamed to admit it

Is may possible that people can have anorexic-like behaviours that are caused by other mental disorders and not anorexia nervosa.

For example, my mother has been thin since she was in her 20's, teetering between 40 and 45 kilograms. Her BMI is around 16, and everyone knows that she is very underweight.

But this is where the similarities with Anorexia end. Mum has terrible bouts of anxiety and has had severe clinical depression for most of her life. She is on medication. To help with her anxiety, she does the same type of housework over and over again, and as a release, she walks around the block, or down town - which is around three kilometres from home. She says that it helps with her nerves.

Many people beleive that she is anorexic (some of her aquaintences have even checked the toilet to see if she has been vomiting) and one rude lady frankly told her that she needs to snap out of her bahavior and start eating.

But she can't.

Mum doesn't beleive she has the condition, and I don't either. Unlike anorexics, who think their fat, she knows that she's underweight, and she doesn't have any obcessions that she is. She cooks for the family, and enjoys it, and doesn't have issues as to what is fattening or not. She does, however, have very small portions during meals; she has a very hard time eating a large volume of food; she gets full quite easily. Mum likes to have nibblies and snacks often; she craves sweet things, like chocolate and licoriche, and she occasionally shares them with us. There is rarely a time where there isn't candy in her handbag. Mum doesn't have a problem with takeaway eihter; she just eats the same amount as she doess with her home-cooked meals.

I beleive that her behavior is not some eating disorder, but as an indirect result of her depression; and her medication too may have have a part - certain types of antidepressents can and do alter a person's behavior; usually intended for the good; but there are some strange side effects too. Mum, for example, not only has trouble eating, but also sleeping and - occasionally - impaired judgement.

INSTRUCTIONS FOR POPULARITY:

Eat all the contents of your Refridgerator/Cabinets

Vomit it all into a revine or stream (fish can eat it...best not to waste)

Hate yourself

When I was in highschool a friend's sister told us (me and the friend) that she thought she was getting fat. I'm still not sure whether she was serious or whether she was fishing for an affirmation of her attractiveness, but both of us yelled "No!" I wouldn't dare joke about something like that because if I ever thought I'd contributed to someone's anorexia...

What can one do in such a situation? I always tell people that the media is wrong, that being too thin isn't healthy and you need all food groups -including fats- in your diet for various metabolic processes - but does that help? Or if there is a serious problem, will people not listen to that kind of explanation anyway?

I think eating disorders can often be tied to OCD. I know body dysmorphia is and I know a number of people with both anorexia and OCD. I think culture has a major influence on people and can drive people to be anorexic who might not be otherwise, but I do think some people have obsessive tendencies that just happen to take them in the direction of obsessing over food. Anorexia was around long before modern culture.

Not everyone finds a thin body appealing. That's all I have to add to this conversation.

Ok time to come out of the proverbial closet.
Let's get a few things straight. One, I don't give a f**k how I look. Two, I'm a guy. (Down go two stereotypes) Three, I'm very poor, I can barely afford to eat but I could eat more on my budget. Four, I don't want to be popular. Five, I don't think I'm fat, in fact I know I'm fairly thin. For me this is an addiction. It started as me just not feeling like eating because of the abuse I was undergoing and it just became a need.

I've been eating disordered since I was thirteen. It was and is destroying my health. I know it. I've read the books. It doesn't help that I don't feel what other people seem to describe as hunger. I very rarely crave. Very rarely think of eating. I scared my girlfriend with this next statement: I equate needing to eat with being dizzy. That's what tells me it's time.

I'm also bipolar. I hate eating when I'm depressed and I don't feel the need to when I'm manic. So that just adds to the mix.