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ADHD and Autism

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MR_BOGAN
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17 Mar 2008, 2:18 pm

Grey_Kameleon wrote:
I've self-diagnosed myself with ADHD for years now, but when I found out about Asperger's, I sort of questioned it because ADHD didn't explain my social problems, and Asperger's explained everything about me except that I do have trouble staying focused even on tasks that interest me sometimes. The problem is that there are so many things that can cause concentration problems, even aside from ADHD and Asperger's.

What kind of social problems do you have?


Mainly listening to people and following what they are talking about. I have trouble keeping up with people because I think intensely on one idea they say and go off in a bit of a dream. Then I tend to go off in tangents because I think of another idea they say. Because heaps of ideas can come up in a conversation I can get lost very quickly. People just except me as being a bit odd. I don't have any problems with eye contact, I'm good at reading people. I think people also find me rude because it can seem like I'm not listening to them and paying attention to them, which I'm not, because it is difficult for me.

I've developed ways to pretend I'm listening to them through body language eye contact, also I concentrate on the over all subject they are talking about and make comments to pretend I'm following them to keep the conversation going. I do feel a bit guitly pretending to be social, but for me it is that is the only way.



Grey_Kameleon
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17 Mar 2008, 2:35 pm

You sound like me with social skills. :?



poopylungstuffing
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17 Mar 2008, 2:43 pm

I do have problems with eye contact...which is intertwined with having trouble reading people. Even when i do look at their faces...I don't know what I am seeing..are they indifferent? annoyed? amused? I have no idea...

i have trouble "bonding" with people. Most of my small group of friends could be concidered to be at least somewhere "near" the spectrum...we give each other alot of space.

i can participate in one-on one social banter to an extent. I will do the best I can to carry on a conversation..but within the conversation, I am in danger of going off on tangents, or directing the conversation towards my special interests..if I am not careful...
Also, if there is a conversation among a group of people, I will often become totally lost because I have auditory processing issues, so I won't know what anyone is saying and will become overwhealmed pretty quickly, and escape from the conversation.

Sometimes it seems as though alot of "normal"people just don't know what to say to me, so when they speak to me, it is in a very "forced" smalltalk sorta way, while I would not really be inclined to speak to them unless spoken to.



MR_BOGAN
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17 Mar 2008, 2:57 pm

Grey_Kameleon wrote:
You sound like me with social skills. :?


I'm older than you so have learned to be social, well I'm pretending a bit. :) I see it as good skills to have.

Do you have trouble with eye contact and reading people.



EvilKimEvil
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17 Mar 2008, 3:00 pm

ADD and ADHD are actually the same disorder. It was originally called Attention Deficit Disorder. Then the name was changed to Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder. There have always been several subtypes of the disorder: Predominantly Hyperactive, Mixed, and Predominantly Inattentive. A person who has symptoms of ADHD without any hyperactivity would currently be diagnosed with ADHD - Predominantly Inattentive Subtype.

Before AS and HFA were considered diagnostic options in the US, children who acted autistic but could communicate verbally were commonly diagnosed with Attention Deficit Disorder - Predominantly Inattentive Type. (I think they changed the name to ADHD around the time AS started to be diagnosed.) I was diagnosed with ADD-PI because I ignored what was going on around me and had normal verbal abilities. In the 1980s, many psychiatrists reserved the autism diagnosis for children who never spoke or spoke only in ways that were not considered communicative (echolalia, for example).

Today, ADHD is considered a common co-morbid of autism spectrum disorders. I've heard there is even some speculation that it could be part of the autistic spectrum.



MR_BOGAN
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17 Mar 2008, 3:05 pm

poopylungstuffing wrote:
I do have problems with eye contact...which is intertwined with having trouble reading people. Even when i do look at their faces...I don't know what I am seeing..are they indifferent? annoyed? amused? I have no idea...

i have trouble "bonding" with people. Most of my small group of friends could be concidered to be at least somewhere "near" the spectrum...we give each other alot of space.

i can participate in one-on one social banter to an extent. I will do the best I can to carry on a conversation..but within the conversation, I am in danger of going off on tangents, or directing the conversation towards my special interests..if I am not careful...
Also, if there is a conversation among a group of people, I will often become totally lost because I have auditory processing issues, so I won't know what anyone is saying and will become overwhealmed pretty quickly, and escape from the conversation.

Sometimes it seems as though alot of "normal"people just don't know what to say to me, so when they speak to me, it is in a very "forced" smalltalk sorta way, while I would not really be inclined to speak to them unless spoken to.


hmm it does sound like both disorders maybe related with you.

Have you ever tried studying people? I always try and figure people out and can figure out what sort of person someone is to a extent, it came from not understanding people. In some ways I'm more social than a lot of people. :?



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17 Mar 2008, 3:13 pm

poopylungstuffing wrote:
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I still have difficulty sequencing things. I cannot just stick to one activity and do it (unless I am in front of a computer)...my mind is constantly urging me in all these different directions....(including back to the computer where I can lose track of all time and stay hyperfocused for hours)
That is the way in which my ADD symtoms manifest the most.
I am not very good at multi-tasking, but my mind keeps wanting me to. I am constantly overwhealmed by all the things around me that need to be done....unmedicated, my overload leads to inertia, whereas medicated, I make attempts to do something about it.



wow, uh... poopy... you just described me perfectly, and the rest of you all sound very familiar.

To be perfectly honest, I had long ago accepted the idea that I was the only person who had all of these bizarre issues, so it's honestly very refreshing (and vindicating and validating) to read you all describe your symptoms.

I suspected that ADD was also a big player in my issues for some time, but I think this helps me solidify this notion. So, what is an ADD Aspie to do? (hypothetical question...)



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17 Mar 2008, 3:13 pm

poopylungstuffing wrote:
I do have problems with eye contact...which is intertwined with having trouble reading people. Even when i do look at their faces...I don't know what I am seeing..are they indifferent? annoyed? amused? I have no idea...


Same here. I can't read from faces, now I can notice the obvious laughter, but until I got my diagnosis I never knew that all these other people around me looked each other in the face and even had a purpose doing so.

Now that I am aware of the importance of eye-contact and intend to use it to appear as comfortable and self-confident as I feel despite the fact that I can't read the non-verbal cues that are supposed to be there, I often just plain forget to do it. I tell myself, I'm going to look a person in the eye and then just... forget that and stare elsewhere when something has successfully caught my interest. I find it hard to remember to hold eye contact, even when the other's eyes are beautiful to look at.



MR_BOGAN
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17 Mar 2008, 3:16 pm

EvilKimEvil wrote:
ADD and ADHD are actually the same disorder. It was originally called Attention Deficit Disorder. Then the name was changed to Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder. There have always been several subtypes of the disorder: Predominantly Hyperactive, Mixed, and Predominantly Inattentive. A person who has symptoms of ADHD without any hyperactivity would currently be diagnosed with ADHD - Predominantly Inattentive Subtype.

Before AS and HFA were considered diagnostic options in the US, children who acted autistic but could communicate verbally were commonly diagnosed with Attention Deficit Disorder - Predominantly Inattentive Type. (I think they changed the name to ADHD around the time AS started to be diagnosed.) I was diagnosed with ADD-PI because I ignored what was going on around me and had normal verbal abilities. In the 1980s, many psychiatrists reserved the autism diagnosis for children who never spoke or spoke only in ways that were not considered communicative (echolalia, for example).

Today, ADHD is considered a common co-morbid of autism spectrum disorders. I've heard there is even some speculation that it could be part of the autistic spectrum.


From what I have read about AS, I'm no expert. But I think people that are autistic have problems taking in to much information and they get overwhelmed and can't make sense of all the infomation that they take in. That is why they have great memories and a lot of knowledge and often more intelligent. Someone with AS may focus on a narrow interest because maybe something narrow may be something they can make sense of.

With ADHD it seems like the complete opposite you only take in a small amount of information and you interpret that information intensely, so in doing so miss a whole lot of other information. hmmmm ????



MR_BOGAN
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18 Mar 2008, 4:25 am

Wadena wrote:
Mr. Bogan.....

Here's an important bit of information amid all the speculation.

ADD can be treated with medication.

While I am too old to use Concerta (a strong stimulant and probably the best option) my younger brother has used it and found it to be a great help.

I have used a light dose (200 mg per day) of Wellbutrin (non-stimulant) and it seems to be of some help.

Since I also have NLD (which is almost identical to Asperger and can't be treated with medication) I can't expect a huge change......but any little bit can be a help.

Is there some reason why you can't get a formal dx and thus have the option of exploring the possibilities of medication?


Hey thanks. :) But I don't feel I need medication.
My life is a bit of a unorganzed mess, but I seem to tap into my hyperfocus and complete tasks, also doing one thing at a time helps and organizing myself on paper helps, I can plan what I want to do.

I let go and go with the flow of my mind, no point worrying about it.

I've got over poor health as well, so I have found that I'm functioning better.

I'm here to try to understand myself more.

Thanks for you comments early by the way. You were right about ADHD. :)



poopylungstuffing
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18 Mar 2008, 10:26 am

Quote:
EvilKimEvil wrote: I've heard there is even some speculation that it could be part of the autistic spectrum.


I think so.



Wadena
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18 Mar 2008, 10:59 am

Yes, Mr. Bogan, you sound like you are learning fast and have a plan.

You may very well (because you are young) experience some of the "growing out of it" that many people do.

That, along with an open mind and good strategies for coping, could help tremendously in your chances for having a good life.

Medication can be an option if you run into problems.

I, on the other hand, unlike many, never had any benefit of any "growing out of it."

I, undiagnosed and unaware, treated by all as a NORMAL person, bulldozed my way through my life without a prayer of getting any help at all.

In desperation, out of necessity, having no other option.....I steam-rolled over the problems I could and dodged those I couldn't, lied, cheated, stole and smashed my way through life.

The experience took quite a toll on me and other innocents, as you can imagine.

How much damage could have been avoided had I been diagnosed and helped early?

How many tears could have gone unshed?

Us folks on the autistic spectrum tend to focus on self.....on our own problems.

In that, we may miss how we impact others we pass along the way.

We should all, in an attempt to make the world a better place, focus on finding struggling people like I was for most of my life.

If we can help them, we can help a lot of other people who may be co-victims of an undiagnosed, unhelped life.


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Grey_Kameleon
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18 Mar 2008, 1:31 pm

MR_BOGAN wrote:
Grey_Kameleon wrote:
You sound like me with social skills. :?


I'm older than you so have learned to be social, well I'm pretending a bit. :) I see it as good skills to have.

Do you have trouble with eye contact and reading people.


Extremely.

I've always thought that AS and ADHD are different in that ADHD has to do with staying on the same 'frequency' as other people instead of shifting from one to the other, and AS has to do with shifting to that frequency in the first place. On the rare occasion that I do socialize, it's extremely hard for me to go back to 'introvert mode', almost as hard as it was to leave it.



nitramnaed
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18 Mar 2008, 2:13 pm

My daughter is diagnosed with both ADD and AS.



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18 Mar 2008, 8:49 pm

darkstone100 wrote:
I have read that ADHD and aspergers can go hand in hand.


Yes they do...which explains why I have both :D



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18 Mar 2008, 9:13 pm

I have a brother with ADHD and Classic Autism (Not listing everything else he has) but to my knowledge they're both closely related, but not the same thing. There are symptoms of each that are not like the other. But I've also noticed ADd/ADHD tend to occur a lot in ASD individuals.