does attention span improve with age?

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Psycho_jimmy
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04 Apr 2008, 6:30 am

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This is the absolute best reason for not telling your child about Asperger's until they ask, or until they are much older -- and I know there are a lot of people that would disagree with me -- but who knows what my son is capable of? Just like you, ClosetAspy, he seems to do better without the knowledge of his "syndrome", and I'm very afraid that if I told him, he would use it as an excuse to not do as well as he is currently doing.


Now, I'm sorry, but I have to strongly disagree. People need to know, regardless of any difficulties that could arise. If my parents ever did not tell me, I'd have left when eventually - and I mean when, it can't be hidden forever - I'd have found out. I'd never have spoken to them again.
Would you hide the knowledge that someone has cancer from them? Kidney disease?
What happens when they notice how different they are from everybody else? When they think it's their fault that they don't fit in?
You must always tell someone - both because of the potential consequences and because they have a right to know. It's their body, their life, it's them.
Nobody has the right - not even a parent - to keep that kind of secret.
As for whether or not your child would use it as an excuse, well, just how much faith do you have in your son? Remeber; it's nothing wrong, Aspergers is a difference - a difference shared most likely by both Einstein and Da Vinci, if evidence is to believed.
It's no disease.



schleppenheimer
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04 Apr 2008, 8:56 am

Well, see, Psycho_jimmy, that's kind of my point -- there IS nothing WRONG with him. He has difficulties remembering things, and even though I'm not on the spectrum I too have difficulties remembering things. He is kind of quiet, but not all the time. He's diagnosed, but would it be of benefit to him to know? Would it really help him? Right now, he has not asked me anything about it, and he hasn't talked about how he might be different from his peers. The minute he starts talking in that manner, then I would tell him -- I wouldn't want him to feel bad. Currently, he doesn't feel bad -- he's more confused by his forgetfulness than anything else.

We are in an unusual situation in that he has an older brother who would have been definitely on the spectrum (Asperger's). He's in his 20's now, with no residual "problems" associated with Asperger's, but as a child, wow, he had all of the hallmarks of Asperger's. The thing is, we didn't know what asperger's was at that time, and only really understood it when our other son (ten years younger) was diagnosed. That's when it clicked that the older one has Asperger's. We talked about it with him then, but it had absolutely NO impact on him at all. I think he just thought that I thought everyone had asperger's at that time. He was 15, and he continued to have some problems related to his AS (again, undiagnosed) including depression, forgetfulness, difficulty in school at times due to not handing in assignments, etc. But he also had great strengths -- terrific sense of humor, really bright, and generally friendly and social with his group of friends. By senior year, the AS became a non-issue for him.

If we do need to tell our younger son, it will be with the caveat of "Your grandfathers have it, your older brother has it, and it means that you have differences, but they aren't unlike the differences a lot of people have. You also have great strengths that many other people don't have." I also know my son, and currently his maturity level won't give him the ability to really understand what Asperger's means.

I totally understand that most people would like to know, and should know. It depends on how much Asperger's affects their lives. When my younger son gets to the point that it really bothers him, we will tell him. If it never seems to bother him, and he continues to improve in school, then I don't see why he needs to know, especially if he is mainstreamed fully in school, and has friends, and is comfortable with his situation in life. Once he is uncomfortable, or unhappy, I will tell him for sure.

Kris



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04 Apr 2008, 7:04 pm

I am what they call a Data Coordinator for a growing pre-clinical pharmaceutical research company. What my job duties require me to do is to take data from a central database and turn it into tables and graphs using a company-generated program. In addition I have to look over the data to make sure it has been entered correctly (no duplicate entries, for example) and in a format my programs will accept. What is challenging about this job is that there are tight deadlines, last-minute changes, multi-tasking like crazy (NOT an Aspy skill), and it involves some math, which I am not good at. I am on-call for at least 50 different people (yes, you read that right) and at any moment one or several may call or e-mail me requesting some task to be performed ASAP if not yesterday. There are days when I feel I can scarcely draw my breath. It is a high-pressure, high stress industry. The amazing thing is not that I can do it, but I manage to do it as well as I do.

That said, I wish I had known right from the beginning what I was dealing with in terms of Aspergers, because it would have saved me and my supervisors much grief. A constant theme in my evaluations is that I am not good at handling stress. Which is true. As it was, I lacked the tools to tell them that just as the computer gets bogged down when too much is thrown at it at once, so does my brain. But you must remember when I started working there was no such thing as the Americans With Disabilities Act, there was no such thing as diversity training, if you had problems coping with the demands of the workplace, that was your problem, not your employers'. It seems now the pendulum has swung the other way, and ASD students are given the unrealistic expectation that others should and will smooth the way for them and uncritically accept every little ideosyncracy. I hate to say it, but the work world does not operate that way. The work world is organized around one thing only, and that is profit. ADA notwithstanding, if you are a liability to your company, you won't be tolerated.

Right now I am officially still in the closet as far as my employer is concerned. The reason I am taking this risk and saying what I do, is that recently I have detected a new openness towards learning about neurological diversity in my workplace! One of my coworkers pasted up an autism awareness event poster outside her office and we had quite an interesting discussion. I understand there may be a neurodiversity workshop in the future. I am not sure I want to stand up in front of all 1600+ employees and tell them I have Aspergers, but I did tell her if such an event was organized I certainly wanted to be involved!



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04 Apr 2008, 9:56 pm

schleppenheimer wrote:
ClosetAspy wrote:
It's amazing what a little ignorance can do, if you don't know you are supposed to have limitations or admit to having them.


This is the absolute best reason for not telling your child about Asperger's until they ask, or until they are much older -- and I know there are a lot of people that would disagree with me -- but who knows what my son is capable of? Just like you, ClosetAspy, he seems to do better without the knowledge of his "syndrome", and I'm very afraid that if I told him, he would use it as an excuse to not do as well as he is currently doing.

May I ask what field of work you are in?

Kris


I can only speak for me and for what I have seen. You have a double edged sword armed with an official Dx and not telling him is a very different thing from not knowing that is what he's got and why he is the way he is.

Is telling him he's got Asperger's going to slow him down? I'd say yes, only because my ignorance allowed me to get to where I am. I'd say no, because I've seen how someone will react to having been lied to... What do you mean, you've known all these years what was wrong with me and didn't tell me.

I haven't got the "right" answer for you on that one. Go with your conscience, is all I can say and be prepared for the consequences either way.

I don't know how functioning your son is, but one thing I know is that once he gets his head wrapped around wanting to do it for himself, whether that be out of spite because someone said he couldn't or because it's something he's into... there'll be no stopping him.

We're a single-minded hard-headed bunch we aspies. :)

There is a alternate school program in our city where the kids essentially are given programs and lessons but the kids essentially choose the topics around which those lessons will be learned.

Otherwise, you have the option of homeschooling; I would have excelled at that, I think. For some Aspies, small classes specifically aimed at them works, although I've heard that those classes can be really expensive.

If you choose to homeschool, there are other ways to "socialize" your aspie... scouts, youth groups, etc. Some schools can help you arrange a lesson program that combines home schooling and school schooling; talk to the school board and find out what is available to you.

And for the record, I wouldn't call Asperger's a "limitation" so much as I would a "challenge".


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Pepperfire
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04 Apr 2008, 10:04 pm

schleppenheimer wrote:
Well, see, Psycho_jimmy, that's kind of my point -- there IS nothing WRONG with him. He has difficulties remembering things, and even though I'm not on the spectrum I too have difficulties remembering things. He is kind of quiet, but not all the time. He's diagnosed, but would it be of benefit to him to know? Would it really help him? Right now, he has not asked me anything about it, and he hasn't talked about how he might be different from his peers. The minute he starts talking in that manner, then I would tell him -- I wouldn't want him to feel bad. Currently, he doesn't feel bad -- he's more confused by his forgetfulness than anything else.


Why would he feel bad? There is nothing wrong with him, but trust me... he knows he's different.

I don't know if his forgetfulness is like mine... but is is forgetfulness so much as disorganization? In addition to being bad at organizing (prioritizing is impossible), I have short-term memory problems, I can't remember my own phone number, but I can remember conversations I had with people, verbatim, over two years ago... Memory can be a weirdly selective thing... Try teaching him how to clump things to remember them.

Quote:
We are in an unusual situation in that he has an older brother who would have been definitely on the spectrum (Asperger's). He's in his 20's now, with no residual "problems" associated with Asperger's, but as a child, wow, he had all of the hallmarks of Asperger's. The thing is, we didn't know what asperger's was at that time, and only really understood it when our other son (ten years younger) was diagnosed. That's when it clicked that the older one has Asperger's. We talked about it with him then, but it had absolutely NO impact on him at all. I think he just thought that I thought everyone had asperger's at that time. He was 15, and he continued to have some problems related to his AS (again, undiagnosed) including depression, forgetfulness, difficulty in school at times due to not handing in assignments, etc. But he also had great strengths -- terrific sense of humor, really bright, and generally friendly and social with his group of friends. By senior year, the AS became a non-issue for him.

If we do need to tell our younger son, it will be with the caveat of "Your grandfathers have it, your older brother has it, and it means that you have differences, but they aren't unlike the differences a lot of people have. You also have great strengths that many other people don't have." I also know my son, and currently his maturity level won't give him the ability to really understand what Asperger's means.

I totally understand that most people would like to know, and should know. It depends on how much Asperger's affects their lives. When my younger son gets to the point that it really bothers him, we will tell him. If it never seems to bother him, and he continues to improve in school, then I don't see why he needs to know, especially if he is mainstreamed fully in school, and has friends, and is comfortable with his situation in life. Once he is uncomfortable, or unhappy, I will tell him for sure.

Kris


I think it would be wiser and less shocking to let him know in a point blank plain as snow conversation without much importance and leave it lie until he's interested, at least then you can say... Gee, I was wondering when you'd get curious about that.

That way, at least, it won't backfire on you with a "you lied to me".

I'm glad it's not my decision to make.


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Prof_Pretorius
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05 Apr 2008, 12:00 am

In a word, NO ! !! !! !! !! !


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05 Apr 2008, 9:32 am

I was very much the opposite. I was so focused to the point of having "tunnel vision." I failed to see that working hard and studying were not the only avenues to success. I neglected relating to others, I believe now, to my detriment. I am still very focused on my work, and put it first, but I also make time to talk and be friendly with my co-workers.



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05 Apr 2008, 9:43 am

9CatMom wrote:
I was so focused to the point of having "tunnel vision.".


I wish I had a dollar/pound/euro for the number of times different people have accused me of having tunnel vision. A friend commented that I was very hard work to talk too because I was obsessed with specific topics. We sat in a pub one night and he said "I bet you haven't even noticed those girls that have just walked in". He was right of course. Oblivious to everything that wasn't my current obsession. On another occasion he said he wished I had my ability to concentrate on certain tasks and focus to the depth and level of understanding that I reached. Tunnel vision is good and bad - depends.



Psycho_jimmy
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07 Apr 2008, 7:22 pm

schleppenheimer, I understand your views; but I'll just let you know I was diagnosed at ten, told at ten - and I first suggested to my parents that I might be like my Autistic older brother when I was eight. I have that rare gift of self-analysis.
I suppose my biggest worry is does anyone have the right to hide information from anybody else?
Even though you say there is nothing wrong with him, well, why hide it then?
In essence, it's just a label. It won't really change anything.
I have much the same problems with forgetfulness and concnetration. But, the knowledge that I'm Asperger does help.
When I was a kid at school, I got angry, felt lonely, sad, etc. whenever I got into a fight (which was literally every day. Kids always seem to like to hit the different kid).
The constant name-calling, spitting, throwing and hitting made me feel as though there was something wrong with me, that I wasn't fitting in as such because it was my fault.
Upon learning I have Aspergers, I felt different about such. Not better, persay, by others to count of it, but of myself...
I began to feel not anger at myself, but contempt - with a little bit of hatred and pity - for those who opted to fight me for my differences. As I said, not of a necessity better, but still an improvement over hating myself.
Point being; no telling the outcome until the end. It might not improve anything, but it certainly wouldn't make it worse.
Also, thought I'd mention about your older son. It seems, at least in text, you regard - by using the term "residual" that Aspergers eventually goes away. It does not, I'm afraid. Neither does it lessen - though, a persons ability to cope does increase as they develop from child to adult, but no more so than such.



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07 Apr 2008, 8:04 pm

When I suggested a little ignorance regarding limitations might be a good thing, I was kind of speaking tongue-in-cheek. I do not believe ignorance to be a good thing in general. There is a scene from the book Black Beauty in which two grooms are sitting by the ailing Beauty's side and discussing how the ignorance of a younger, inexperienced groom has led to the horse's illness. It goes something like this, one of the grooms is sticking up for the boy and saying it was "only ignorance." At that the older groom says, "Only ignorance? Onlyignorance?" Those two words have been used to excuse more harm and wickedness than anything else, he says, and goes on to provide several vivid examples, ending, "but it was only ignorance." It's a great scene and I wish I could remember more of it, but it has stuck in my mind. The gist of it was that even if we are ignorant, we still need to take responsibility for changing that situation.

If I had known the truth about my condition decades ago, I would be a much more compassionate person today. I would be more compassionate towards myself and definitely towards others with problems. Instead, in order to live the lie that I was normal, I learned to hate who I was and anyone whose condition reminded me of who I was. Even though I do not have a formal diagnosis, learning more about Aspergers has brought me closer to healing.