The Pro-Cure Thread
Perhaps I am unique in this, but prior to discovering that I had A.S., I did want a "cure" for whatever I perceived as being "wrong" with me. Since finding out what that is, though, I have lost all desire to be like everybody else and embrace A.S. as a gift, not a curse or disease. To be "cured" is the last thing I would ever want.
The comparison may seem juvenile to some, but the debate over a cure is analogous to what mutant characters face in X-Men comics. The reasons for being cured or not cured are largely personal and I don't think there is right answer for everybody or even a majority of people with A.S. It is something everybody must decide for themselves.
The comparison may seem juvenile to some, but the debate over a cure is analogous to what mutant characters face in X-Men comics. The reasons for being cured or not cured are largely personal and I don't think there is right answer for everybody or even a majority of people with A.S. It is something everybody must decide for themselves.
Problem is if there is ever an easy cure, they will fin some way to force it onto those who don't want it.... such as parents forcing young children who can't make that decision, or public health telling you you must cure your children for the sake of society.
The comparison may seem juvenile to some, but the debate over a cure is analogous to what mutant characters face in X-Men comics. The reasons for being cured or not cured are largely personal and I don't think there is right answer for everybody or even a majority of people with A.S. It is something everybody must decide for themselves.
Problem is if there is ever an easy cure, they will fin some way to force it onto those who don't want it.... such as parents forcing young children who can't make that decision, or public health telling you you must cure your children for the sake of society.
There is the real question. If a true cure is found, do we force it onto children or let them decide for themselves when they are older? I don't think I can really argue for either side without bias. I suspect that my 4-year-old son may have A.S., and though I notice he has trouble with some things, I feel like "curing" him would be akin to killing him. Everything that he is, I think, would change, and he would be a totally different child. I don't think I would do it, if the option existed. And Thor help anybody that tried to force me to...
The comparison may seem juvenile to some, but the debate over a cure is analogous to what mutant characters face in X-Men comics. The reasons for being cured or not cured are largely personal and I don't think there is right answer for everybody or even a majority of people with A.S. It is something everybody must decide for themselves.
Problem is if there is ever an easy cure, they will fin some way to force it onto those who don't want it.... such as parents forcing young children who can't make that decision, or public health telling you you must cure your children for the sake of society.
There is the real question. If a true cure is found, do we force it onto children or let them decide for themselves when they are older? I don't think I can really argue for either side without bias. I suspect that my 4-year-old son may have A.S., and though I notice he has trouble with some things, I feel like "curing" him would be akin to killing him. Everything that he is, I think, would change, and he would be a totally different child. I don't think I would do it, if the option existed. And Thor help anybody that tried to force me to...
Precisly the point I wanted to make by comparing it to genocide.
The comparison may seem juvenile to some, but the debate over a cure is analogous to what mutant characters face in X-Men comics. The reasons for being cured or not cured are largely personal and I don't think there is right answer for everybody or even a majority of people with A.S. It is something everybody must decide for themselves.
Problem is if there is ever an easy cure, they will fin some way to force it onto those who don't want it.... such as parents forcing young children who can't make that decision, or public health telling you you must cure your children for the sake of society.
There is the real question. If a true cure is found, do we force it onto children or let them decide for themselves when they are older? I don't think I can really argue for either side without bias. I suspect that my 4-year-old son may have A.S., and though I notice he has trouble with some things, I feel like "curing" him would be akin to killing him. Everything that he is, I think, would change, and he would be a totally different child. I don't think I would do it, if the option existed. And Thor help anybody that tried to force me to...
Precisly the point I wanted to make by comparing it to genocide.
If that happens, we will just rally around a charismatic leader that gives grandiose speeches about how superior we are to the "normals" and that we should elminate them with are superior abilities...while he stands back and watches as we are used as cannon fodder... Hmmm... Sounds like a movie I saw once...
ephemerella brought up a lot of great points, and I for the most part agree with her.
One thing I've noticed from my own experiences with the social skills and NT world, is that when you switch to the NT world and then come back again, one never really returns to full-blown AS like one was before the world traversal. Each time we do switch, the social skills we learned during that time remain with us, even while we are AS. This has the dual benefit of making the NT world easier to understand and get back into, but also to help put our AS in a more third-person perspective.
Unlike ephemerella, however, I have chosen to do my best to straddle between AS and NT. It takes a lot of energy to act with all the social skills and it will always be that way. I could never be able to act like an NT 100% of the time, and the more NT-like I act, the faster my energy is consumed and the sooner I'll have a meltdown. Nor would I want to be NT! 100% AS and 100% NT have some significant weaknesses, and by blending them together, I can try to minimize their weaknesses while still retaining some of their strengths. It's oftentimes difficult to blend them together, so sometimes I will resort to being a bit more NT-like with the social skills, or a bit more AS-like, depending on the situation. Even then, I need timeouts every so often to recharge that energy; acting NT does not come naturally to me, so any aspect of NT drains my energy, regardless of whether I understand its uses or not, and it'll always be that way.
To the AS folks who hate being Aspies and want a cure, I think it is unfortunate that you feel that way, but at the same time I do understand that feeling and I cannot blame you for feeling that way. It's just that AS actually has a lot to offer people that the vast majority of NTs do not recognize at all, we were born with a lot of strengths that can do the world a great deal of good. At the same time, AS has considerable weaknesses, and it's most likely these weaknesses that you are conscious of, and that make you want to rid yourself of your AS. However, NTs have strengths and weaknesses of their own, usually the opposite of the AS set of strengths and weaknesses. When you talk to NTs, you can get an idea of how that strength affects their lives, yet at the same time see how their weaknesses keep them down. Then the NT life doesn't look so great after all... NTs could potentially learn a lot from AS folks, just as we can learn a lot from them. A middle ground does exist, but most NTs don't even bother to try to reach this ground, which is also very unfortunate. We Aspies are always expected to reach this middle ground as a minimum, if not totally suppress the AS outright. That's also very unfortunate.
ephemerella brought up an interesting theory about pack animals and humans. The way that I've seen AS for a while now is kinda like a "caveman society," an almost anarchistic type of social structure. If it's dog-eat-dog out there, there is less need for social skills because, well frankly those outside of your family group is a threat anyway. And because of all the threats, the family group is a lot more tightly knit than it is now. The family group is there for survival, not merely for convenience, and everybody has to get out and work hard and not worry about the fluff social niceties, because your life depended on it. You don't waste energy and resources on making stuff look pretty, because resources are difficult to get. Everything has a logical, functional role, and conservation is key.
It's just that with the advent of larger societies (possibly coinciding with the rise of basic religious beliefs), people eventually learned that life could be easier and less threatening on a day-to-day basis if they only cooperated more instead of going dog-eat-dog. But cooperation on a larger scale requires a level of uniformity -- an idea of right and wrong that applies to everybody in the group, leading to the basic concepts of law and order and culture. After all, if everybody had the same idea of right and wrong, you would minimize interpersonal conflict since you'd be following the same set of rules/laws. However this has had the side effect of penalizing those who don't have the same idea of right and wrong (e.g. AS), and increasing the amount of intersocietal conflicts (larger-scale wars). So I think AS had a huge role long long ago for human survival, but has since fallen into "vestigial" status due to the rise of society. But it's only "vestigial" because most people don't know how to use AS skills effectively.
In the end, however, there are no perfect solutions to anything, and every solution brings with it another problem. Good and bad are two sides of the same coin. The best we can do is manage and cope with whatever life brings us, learning and growing along the way. Hopefully by acquiring enough knowledge and wisdom we won't have to worry about "being AS" or "being NT", rather just be ourselves.
_________________
Won't you help a poor little puppy?
The comparison may seem juvenile to some, but the debate over a cure is analogous to what mutant characters face in X-Men comics. The reasons for being cured or not cured are largely personal and I don't think there is right answer for everybody or even a majority of people with A.S. It is something everybody must decide for themselves.
Problem is if there is ever an easy cure, they will fin some way to force it onto those who don't want it.... such as parents forcing young children who can't make that decision, or public health telling you you must cure your children for the sake of society.
There is the real question. If a true cure is found, do we force it onto children or let them decide for themselves when they are older? I don't think I can really argue for either side without bias. I suspect that my 4-year-old son may have A.S., and though I notice he has trouble with some things, I feel like "curing" him would be akin to killing him. Everything that he is, I think, would change, and he would be a totally different child. I don't think I would do it, if the option existed. And Thor help anybody that tried to force me to...
Precisly the point I wanted to make by comparing it to genocide.
If that happens, we will just rally around a charismatic leader that gives grandiose speeches about how superior we are to the "normals" and that we should elminate them with are superior abilities...while he stands back and watches as we are used as cannon fodder... Hmmm... Sounds like a movie I saw once...
I'm sorry, that sounds like Hitler.... Should we call this group the Autsies too?
And because some people, like me, have trouble with sarcasm, that was sarcasm.
Although I do like the idea of autistic pride, but all that comes to mind is a whole lot of people in an almost vegetative state rallying to be known as not being vegetative, and breaking out into useless grunts of approval. I know this is a very bad stereotype, but even being under the spectrum and knowing its not true, I still think of it like that. However, I don't want the stereotype to live into the next generation of people.
MomofTom
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Yes, it is true, that is one way to appear NT, is to build the skills and integrate it into your own mind.
But to become truly NT, in the sense of having a real-time social mind, you run into "bandwidth" problems. We are all limited by cognitive bandwidth. We can only process so much information at a certain rate, and integrate it into memory and procedural memory fetches and real time execution of an online "personality". All the routines that support external interaction, moreover, are loaded with sensorimotor process time limitations, or windows in time where certain sensorimotor processes are designed by nature to hook into (say) a speech process so that speech can happen. If timing is off, like the tongue doesn't form shapes so we can make sounds within the window of time that we have to create a syllable, the word gets mangled. The timing and coordination of our selves, and how we interact with the external world, is very complex and very sophisticated. In order to run the system, our brains are essentially self-programming, adaptive computers with distributed processing centers.
One limitation that affects social function is bandwidth. Because of all the tight timing and close coordination needed to run the machine and process all the information, we can only process a certain amount of external information at a time. Yet, social interaction involves a lot of abstract information and heavy processing that is very fluid and real time. How do you add social interaction to a system that is so complex without running out of bandwidth?
I have a theory. That is basically that pack animals and humans have developed identity and personality functions that enable them to have a firewall between the outside world and their backend processing. They don't interact with direct, immersive reality in the way non-pack animals (say, cats or AS people) do. They interact with personality and identity functions and these functions mediate both social skills execution and the flow of information from the outside world. An extra stage, like a filter. It is a kind of recognition system design that has the identity and personality as "agents" mediating with the outside world.
I.e. NT's don't deal with a direct, objective reality as we do. They live in and through their identities and personalities, and through these maintain low-bandwidth connections to external sensory experiences. This is why their egos are so important to them, because their egos is now they define the world and their place in it. Their egos and their personalities and identities are the boats with which they navigate through life.
All you really have to do is spend a lot of time with deep neuropsychological training on how to develop certain jumpers and "wire" in low level cognitive behaviors you have trouble with, spend a lot of time training on social skills and the thinking behaviors of people, and then transfer the seat of consciousness from the AS immersive reality into living through your world of Ego and use that to connect to other people.
I did that when my mother was dying of cancer, because she was having a really hard time and I was at the stage in my developmental experiments where I could attempt something like that. Before she died, she told me I was "so much better" and that it was as if I had been "locked away inside myself" my whole life.
But I was never "locked away inside myself". I was always there, with her. It was just before I never knew how to see what she needed to hear from me in order to value the things I said. By connecting to her through Ego mind, I was simply able to see, for the first time, that she needed to see and hear certain things from me, and I supplied her with those things to make her happy. But I was always there, with her, as a child, never "locked away". She was just not in a place where she could see that I was there.
Leaving a mind that exists in an immersive, objective reality and moving into a world of Ego and identity and personality isn't something that I liked. Maybe it's something others would do -- destroy the mind that you have in order to learn how to be and say things that others recognize as important. I can leave the mind of AS and shoehorn my mind into the mind of Ego, but why? The minds of NTs aren't better minds, just different. And they are not suited to me.
The fact that I prefer myself as an AS, that I prefer the mind of AS to the mind of NT, doesn't mean that I'm ignorant, xenophobic, fearful, hateful or militant. Those are the words of someone who hates his/her AS, and themselves for having it.
Edited to add: The stuff I learned has not gone away... I am just not using it. Presumably, if I ever had to think like an NT again, I could do it again. But there's nothing there that is worth staying in the world dominated (mediated) by my identity and personality functions (Ego). All the things I like to do and think about are in my AS mind. I would not trade that to be "popular" and socially appreciated. And someone who ceases to be himself and herself just to be popular and socially appreciated, is not going to find what they are seeking because there is nothing meaningful at the end of that shallow rainbow.
I like how you addressed the 'bandwidth' issue. If there is one thing that is somewhat unattainable for me is eliminating social exhaustion. That, and I'd really love to be rid of the pain I feel whenever looking at bright blue and bright red contrasted in the same object. That's freaking annoying because a lot of baby toys use those colors for brain stimulation.
_________________
Apathy is a dominant gene. Mutate.
The comparison may seem juvenile to some, but the debate over a cure is analogous to what mutant characters face in X-Men comics. The reasons for being cured or not cured are largely personal and I don't think there is right answer for everybody or even a majority of people with A.S. It is something everybody must decide for themselves.
Problem is if there is ever an easy cure, they will fin some way to force it onto those who don't want it.... such as parents forcing young children who can't make that decision, or public health telling you you must cure your children for the sake of society.
There is the real question. If a true cure is found, do we force it onto children or let them decide for themselves when they are older? I don't think I can really argue for either side without bias. I suspect that my 4-year-old son may have A.S., and though I notice he has trouble with some things, I feel like "curing" him would be akin to killing him. Everything that he is, I think, would change, and he would be a totally different child. I don't think I would do it, if the option existed. And Thor help anybody that tried to force me to...
Precisly the point I wanted to make by comparing it to genocide.
If that happens, we will just rally around a charismatic leader that gives grandiose speeches about how superior we are to the "normals" and that we should elminate them with are superior abilities...while he stands back and watches as we are used as cannon fodder... Hmmm... Sounds like a movie I saw once...
I'm sorry, that sounds like Hitler.... Should we call this group the Autsies too?
And because some people, like me, have trouble with sarcasm, that was sarcasm.
Although I do like the idea of autistic pride, but all that comes to mind is a whole lot of people in an almost vegetative state rallying to be known as not being vegetative, and breaking out into useless grunts of approval. I know this is a very bad stereotype, but even being under the spectrum and knowing its not true, I still think of it like that. However, I don't want the stereotype to live into the next generation of people.
Actually, I was referring to Magneto from the X-Men. It wasn't meant as a course of action, it was just an attempt to be funny.
The comparison may seem juvenile to some, but the debate over a cure is analogous to what mutant characters face in X-Men comics. The reasons for being cured or not cured are largely personal and I don't think there is right answer for everybody or even a majority of people with A.S. It is something everybody must decide for themselves.
Problem is if there is ever an easy cure, they will fin some way to force it onto those who don't want it.... such as parents forcing young children who can't make that decision, or public health telling you you must cure your children for the sake of society.
There is the real question. If a true cure is found, do we force it onto children or let them decide for themselves when they are older? I don't think I can really argue for either side without bias. I suspect that my 4-year-old son may have A.S., and though I notice he has trouble with some things, I feel like "curing" him would be akin to killing him. Everything that he is, I think, would change, and he would be a totally different child. I don't think I would do it, if the option existed. And Thor help anybody that tried to force me to...
Precisly the point I wanted to make by comparing it to genocide.
If that happens, we will just rally around a charismatic leader that gives grandiose speeches about how superior we are to the "normals" and that we should elminate them with are superior abilities...while he stands back and watches as we are used as cannon fodder... Hmmm... Sounds like a movie I saw once...
I'm sorry, that sounds like Hitler.... Should we call this group the Autsies too?
And because some people, like me, have trouble with sarcasm, that was sarcasm.
Although I do like the idea of autistic pride, but all that comes to mind is a whole lot of people in an almost vegetative state rallying to be known as not being vegetative, and breaking out into useless grunts of approval. I know this is a very bad stereotype, but even being under the spectrum and knowing its not true, I still think of it like that. However, I don't want the stereotype to live into the next generation of people.
Actually, I was referring to Magneto from the X-Men. It wasn't meant as a course of action, it was just an attempt to be funny.
I will say that XMen 3 does put into perspective what would happen if a cure were available.
The comparison may seem juvenile to some, but the debate over a cure is analogous to what mutant characters face in X-Men comics. The reasons for being cured or not cured are largely personal and I don't think there is right answer for everybody or even a majority of people with A.S. It is something everybody must decide for themselves.
Problem is if there is ever an easy cure, they will fin some way to force it onto those who don't want it.... such as parents forcing young children who can't make that decision, or public health telling you you must cure your children for the sake of society.
There is the real question. If a true cure is found, do we force it onto children or let them decide for themselves when they are older? I don't think I can really argue for either side without bias. I suspect that my 4-year-old son may have A.S., and though I notice he has trouble with some things, I feel like "curing" him would be akin to killing him. Everything that he is, I think, would change, and he would be a totally different child. I don't think I would do it, if the option existed. And Thor help anybody that tried to force me to...
Precisly the point I wanted to make by comparing it to genocide.
If that happens, we will just rally around a charismatic leader that gives grandiose speeches about how superior we are to the "normals" and that we should elminate them with are superior abilities...while he stands back and watches as we are used as cannon fodder... Hmmm... Sounds like a movie I saw once...
I'm sorry, that sounds like Hitler.... Should we call this group the Autsies too?
And because some people, like me, have trouble with sarcasm, that was sarcasm.
Although I do like the idea of autistic pride, but all that comes to mind is a whole lot of people in an almost vegetative state rallying to be known as not being vegetative, and breaking out into useless grunts of approval. I know this is a very bad stereotype, but even being under the spectrum and knowing its not true, I still think of it like that. However, I don't want the stereotype to live into the next generation of people.
Actually, I was referring to Magneto from the X-Men. It wasn't meant as a course of action, it was just an attempt to be funny.
I will say that XMen 3 does put into perspective what would happen if a cure were available.
What I wonder is would we see a certain level of resentment from those that don't want to be cured towards those that do? I personally wouldn't care, as long as it wasn't being forced on people. I am of course, speaking of adults only, not children. I think those are two separate issues.
One thing I've noticed from my own experiences with the social skills and NT world, is that when you switch to the NT world and then come back again, one never really returns to full-blown AS like one was before the world traversal. Each time we do switch, the social skills we learned during that time remain with us, even while we are AS. This has the dual benefit of making the NT world easier to understand and get back into, but also to help put our AS in a more third-person perspective.
Unlike ephemerella, however, I have chosen to do my best to straddle between AS and NT. It takes a lot of energy to act with all the social skills and it will always be that way. I could never be able to act like an NT 100% of the time, and the more NT-like I act, the faster my energy is consumed and the sooner I'll have a meltdown. Nor would I want to be NT! 100% AS and 100% NT have some significant weaknesses, and by blending them together, I can try to minimize their weaknesses while still retaining some of their strengths. It's oftentimes difficult to blend them together, so sometimes I will resort to being a bit more NT-like with the social skills, or a bit more AS-like, depending on the situation. Even then, I need timeouts every so often to recharge that energy; acting NT does not come naturally to me, so any aspect of NT drains my energy, regardless of whether I understand its uses or not, and it'll always be that way.
To the AS folks who hate being Aspies and want a cure, I think it is unfortunate that you feel that way, but at the same time I do understand that feeling and I cannot blame you for feeling that way. It's just that AS actually has a lot to offer people that the vast majority of NTs do not recognize at all, we were born with a lot of strengths that can do the world a great deal of good. At the same time, AS has considerable weaknesses, and it's most likely these weaknesses that you are conscious of, and that make you want to rid yourself of your AS. However, NTs have strengths and weaknesses of their own, usually the opposite of the AS set of strengths and weaknesses. When you talk to NTs, you can get an idea of how that strength affects their lives, yet at the same time see how their weaknesses keep them down. Then the NT life doesn't look so great after all... NTs could potentially learn a lot from AS folks, just as we can learn a lot from them. A middle ground does exist, but most NTs don't even bother to try to reach this ground, which is also very unfortunate. We Aspies are always expected to reach this middle ground as a minimum, if not totally suppress the AS outright. That's also very unfortunate....
Thank you for your contribution. I started to write about what you are referring to, keeping a foot in both minds. Actually, what you said is true, I am changed by the experience. I'm having difficulty, tho, maintaining a foot in both NT and AS minds because I'm psychologically damaged by trauma in my NT mind. I had trauma with sociopathic academic abusers and so incurred narcissistic injuries and other damage to my "Ego" structures that are central to the functioning of my NT-mind. I am here, in part, trying to understand and fix that damage and remove the sociopathic influence that was impressed in my NT mind. Presumably, if I were less distressed, and had a healthier NT mind, I could do as you did. Perhaps one reason why I didn't like the NT mind is that it was damaged in some ways and has to be fixed, as I am trying to do now.
I like your contribution because it is wise. In particular, there is a sense that I have that we all start out with an NT mind or an AS mind or whatever mind, and then the path toward self-realization involves both. NTs who seek "enlightenment" spend a lot of time doing things to make themselves more like us... meditate, remove themselves from society, stop thinking about Ego and the world of Illusion and focus on an immediate reality, stop lying, and so on. They are starting from one place and trying to develop a fuller mind. I.e. NTs start from NT mind and their enlightened mind grows toward being more AS. I've had the sense, lately, that AS simply start from the other place. Whether I was born NT or AS, if I become fully realized, that fully realized mind would have both NT capacity and AS capacity.
I use yoga and things like that to connect more to the real-time world of self-awareness, social insight, etc. When I am heavy into yoga ("transcendent"), I have the capacity for allocentrism and other cognitive features of a social mind. I never realized that NTs used yoga to go in the other direction. So the same mind-body training that I use to support more of a social mind's cognitive features are the same mind-body training that NTs use to be more AS-minded. It is as difficult for NTs to abandon their worlds of illusion and Ego as it is for us to become adept at it.
A lot of the mind-body exercises and enlightenment training is about maximizing bandwidth, BTW. The more honest, courageous, clear and excellent your mind is, the more information it can flow and process. If you run, exercise and work out, you maintain very high energy (Chi) levels, which the brain consumes a lot of when it is processing a lot of information. A lot of what I do, to increase or maintain higher social functioning, is simply geared toward freeing up bandwidth and increasing the energy available to my cognitive processes. When I can use yoga or mind-body training to channel and focus my disorderly sensory processes, that frees up clear bandwidth, too.
Some of the mind-body exercises that Eastern spiritual NTs use to be more contemplative, meditative mind and experience an objective reality are some of the same things that I use to support the social mind feature training. IMO, a fully realized mind grows into being both NT AND AS, whether you start first as NT OR AS.
That is not, strictly speaking "a cure". If enlightenment and self-realization are "cures" then they are a cure for simply living a sub-optimal life, or being young and needing to grow wiser as you get older.
"IF" they found a cure you think there would be a choice for those who refuse it...like the choice that young girls are now given as to whether they take the pill for genital warts ? Or the chose that young children have as to if they receive electric shock, ABA, chelation therapy from their parents . The government wouldn't have to even be very involved as the media seems to prefer the "cure groups" to those who speak against it and are very good at manipulating statistics to favor that agenda . I always prefer choice for individuals but trust the media, the medical,and pharmacutical industry. government, special interest groups who have financial incentives of their own...about as far as I can spit...(about 3 feet on an average day.)
I didn't know what was causing all my pain and confusion for most of my life ,so my idea of a cure was death. Life was the disease and I didn't think there was another cure for it . Saying, I understand that having AS can be very difficult and challenging and I would love to have some relief from some of the sensory and cognitive issues but realizing now, that the trade off would be the very things that I do enjoy about being me...it just makes more sense to "ride it out" this life time and try and make some positive changes to make the life of autistics a little less painful . I actually think that might be possible and think the alternative would be a lose to society as a whole and myself as an individual . I would rather see society invest their time, energy and money into making this a reality as I don;t think there is a cure for something that I don't really believe is a disease but a difference .
On a related note...Please don't ever think that just because NT's run around yahooing and smiling that many of them aren't
just as miserable as many of us, just for different reasons. How many of them are on antidepressants, seeking therapy, engaged in addictive behavior to avoid their own pain . A cure for AS is not the same as "instant happiness" .
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I didn't know what was causing all my pain and confusion for most of my life ,so my idea of a cure was death. Life was the disease and I didn't think there was another cure for it . Saying, I understand that having AS can be very difficult and challenging and I would love to have some relief from some of the sensory and cognitive issues but realizing now, that the trade off would be the very things that I do enjoy about being me...it just makes more sense to "ride it out" this life time and try and make some positive changes to make the life of autistics a little less painful . I actually think that might be possible and think the alternative would be a lose to society as a whole and myself as an individual . I would rather see society invest their time, energy and money into making this a reality as I don;t think there is a cure for something that I don't really believe is a disease but a difference .
On a related note...Please don't ever think that just because NT's run around yahooing and smiling that many of them aren't
just as miserable as many of us, just for different reasons. How many of them are on antidepressants, seeking therapy, engaged in addictive behavior to avoid their own pain . A cure for AS is not the same as "instant happiness" .
Very well said. You mirror my thoughts exactly. I am especially touched by what you said about death being the only "cure" for your pain, prior to discover A.S. I felt the same way and actually had that exact same attitude. I never spoke of it to anybody before right now, but I had felt for a long time that I just didn't like life and wanted to be rid of it. I now, however, embrace what I really am, the good and the bad, and am much happier now that I know what makes me different. I only wish I had known about this years ago.
After reading this whole thread, I think this is one of the best sentiments on the topic.
Everyone experiences some pain in their life. Of course you can always work to improve yourself regardless of what's going on. If I got the flu, I would seek treatment to cure it. If I have Asperger's, then I seek to understand it, and work with it, to be happy in my life. I agree that autism and asperger's are not diseases. They are states of being. No one suggests a "cure" for giftedness... yet people who are gifted experience many of the same social problems that aspies do.
Everyone has something they are dealing with, whether alcoholism, cancer, or autism. Each person can only try their best to improve their lives according to their own standards.
Last edited by Acacia on 18 Dec 2008, 2:08 pm, edited 2 times in total.
I like your contribution because it is wise. In particular, there is a sense that I have that we all start out with an NT mind or an AS mind or whatever mind, and then the path toward self-realization involves both. NTs who seek "enlightenment" spend a lot of time doing things to make themselves more like us... meditate, remove themselves from society, stop thinking about Ego and the world of Illusion and focus on an immediate reality, stop lying, and so on. They are starting from one place and trying to develop a fuller mind. I.e. NTs start from NT mind and their enlightened mind grows toward being more AS. I've had the sense, lately, that AS simply start from the other place. Whether I was born NT or AS, if I become fully realized, that fully realized mind would have both NT capacity and AS capacity...
Thanks very much for the response, I agree with you and I think you put it more eloquently than I ever could.
The part where you mentioned the Eastern religions makes a lot of sense to me. The sense I'm getting about the major belief systems is some kind of feeling that for true enlightenment there has to be some kind of mixture of NT and AS traits, whether it be to instill a firm work ethic (AS), to be generous and kind to strangers (NT), to withdraw from the world and shun worldly excesses (AS), etc.. Also, stable societies tend to try to keep a mix of NT and AS traits also, though I'm not sure modern societies today are doing such a great job keeping NT and AS in balance.
I think I've been lucky on my own path to enlightenment because I always had somebody to turn to for help. We Aspies may be loners but for whatever reason we don't like being alone all the time. I have a twin brother with AS also, so there was always somebody there who shared my experiences at home, at school, everywhere. We understood each other completely and, whenever we had meltdowns, we knew they were always transitory. Having that kind of unconditional emotional support helped both of us to continue "fighting the good fight" so to speak, to stay on our paths of understanding. There's still a lot more to learn, after all I'm only 30, and I still have my difficulties but with age hopefully I'll manage them better. And you're absolutely right, this isn't strictly-speaking a "cure", more of an understanding of how people are and how the world is, and an acceptance of what we are born with. We may start off with AS or NT minds, but it doesn't mean that we are slaves to those labels. In the end we are ourselves.
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