ASDs and Narcissism

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Sorry. My bad.

I really need to examine threads better.

I can't figure out why people wouldn't want to be narcissistic on some level.. it's far more fun for me than thinking I'm worthless.. and if I'm going to go for it, why not go all the way?

Ah, you have never known a narcissist then, example: a woman I worked for/was "friends" with, who shared so much stuff with me, I was close to the family, knew for years, was the person she told everything to etc. I started to share with her the fact my oldest son was diagnosed with a heart problem, was going in for tests, very scary, her first response to me telling her this near tears, me trying to hold it together, was:

"oh you have me so worried now my heart is acting up" as she looked around and clutched her chest.

I knew she was self centered, it was still a surprise and hurtful she could not consider me or my son for a moment. I don't have anything to do with her anymore, that was kind of it for me, and I couldn't wait to quit being near her.

My point, it is not a decision someone can make about their behavior, it is something disturbingly missing in their makeup that can't be faked. It's the person who hears about a terrible tragedy that happened, and not only thinks how it will effect them, but are irritated that they are expected to hear about it, or deal with it in any way. September 11th I worked at a major insurance company, someone got a call about the first tower, we all looked on the internet, found live video, watched the second plane hit the second tower, and one woman, an hour later started talking about how much money the company would lose because of life and property coverage on the people and the buildings, was it two events or a single event (difference in coverage) war or terrorism (less coverage, sometimes none depending on the policy) etc. I never could look at her again and not be pissed off.

Hmm yeah I'm not that narcissistic I guess, or maybe I'm so narcissistic that I know my heart could never fail in such a way, I'm too important. Really, it's difficult for me to relate to anyone, because if I do I know I'll have to comfort them, come up with something heartwarming, worry if what I'm saying is 'happy enough', etc. etc. I did used to feel 'bad' for people, but pity makes less and less sense to me all the time. It's so piteous.

And look now, I'm talking about me again..

Really, I don't understand why people wouldn't want to be narcissists. It's a far more fun way to live in general. There are certain would-be pitfalls, like wondering why 'bad' things happen if everything I do is good, but that can be handled by simply adopting a 'in the short term it may be bad but in the long term it's good' philosophy, or surely any number of infinite other philosophies. A dedicated narcissist never truly fails.. really, a dedicated anything never fails, but we're talking about narcissism here

Dedicated people fail, temporarily, they just keep trying. That's what life is. To try and figure out who we are, how we fit, how to do things better etc etc etc is NOT narcissism, Don't worry about it.

I have known many people that would step over someone bleeding in the street and complain about the mess they were making.

I am finding forgiving myself for all my real and imagined deficiencies, failures, lack of being loved etc is the most important thing. Lie to yourself it you have to, it's a fact that one of the major differences in those that suffer from depression and those that don't is that those that do not get depressed engage in a lot of self serving bias (look it up, interesting stuff). So instead of picking up on signals that this group doesn't like you, or that you are not good enough at some task or activity, they just psyche themselves up.

I know, telling people on here to lie to themselves is kind of funny, in a dangerous way.

I think everyone is a little narcissistic. I've read somewhere that everyone has it. It just becomes a disorder when someone has too much of it. Sometimes I see it in myself but I wouldn't be considered one because it's normal. I think all kids act like one too but it's normal. For one they want your attention and they like to get the attention, they also show off and go "look at me mom and dad." And how many people brag about their kids or their achievements or the great things in their life? Pretty much lot of people. Lot of people care about their appearances or else they wouldn't be showering or wearing clean clothes or looking nice or even having their hairs brushed. It's about them because they like to be clean. Women even wear make up so they look younger and prettier. Isn't that a little narcissistic? But it's considered normal so everyone would say that doesn't make them one.

Mea culpa. It's all about ME.

Narcissism is a self protection tool for the weak. It's in the description of its mechanism. It becomes pathological when it's lashes out on other people too much. Not necessarily, but usually it happens when the person suffers from delusions, which is borderline with schizophrenia, imo.

As many stated before, knowing about having narcissistic tendencies and making efforts to reduce its effects in itself proves the person in question doesn't have it.

Although, it's funny to think of how many traits of it I may have... Seriously, I may be love with myself, which is pathetic, to say the least..

...or maybe I'm only a self-pitying ignorant lazy self-indulgent selfish-a$$?!

It is extreme self interest to the point of complete lack of empathy for others, seeing people as tools and resources to get what one needs, using whatever means.

Huge personality flaw, nothing to do with schizophrenia, not delusional really, they just don't care

Mine stems from being able to relate more to myself than to others...I don't think myself to be above others, I just can't relate to them, I am not good at having friendships...there are very few people with whom I am closely bonded...also I don't really have a very clear sense of myself, as pertaining to how I am viewed by others. Flakey always called me a canary...I feel more like a goldfish who has to look in a mirror cause I keep forgetting what I look like....I have going on 900 youtube videos of myself, but when I watch them, I feel like I am watching someone else..I don't feel like it is me....Having this many videos, I have been called a narcissist..
I don't feel like I am the center of the universe...often I feel bad and lowly and worthless...so it is not as though I "worship" myself or anything...

I can be self-centered at times, but I don't think I'm better than anyone else. It's just that I find it hard to be interested in what someone else says unless it has relevance to me or my interests.

One theory is that narcissism isn't high self esteem, but fragile self esteem. Basically, the person acts like they have high self esteem, but really deep down their self-esteem is very low. That's why they freak out whenever someone challenges their overly positive view of themselves, because they're afraid the illusion will shatter and everyone will see how worthless they really are. They don't know how to see themselves with flaws and good points, and don't want to see themselves as flaws only so they convince themselves that they're perfect.

I also don't think I'm better than anybody else either. Maybe some really miserable people are "worse" than me, but that's a different story (they're still humans). There was a period in my life during which I tried hard to be or at least show up as being better than others, preferring the former. That's long gone, and although I like to compare myself to others sometimes in terms of success and knowledge, eventually I'm fine with being who I am. I can say I learned it the hard way. It can be motivating to me, though.

Narcissism is a term with a wide range of meanings, according to Wiki. In psychology, NPD is a mental illness, substantially different form what it meant originally, imo. I believe there may be a connection to schizophrenia through delusions. When someone doesn't like to be corrected and repeatedly refuses to accept most of the criticism, and in addition is prone to have paranoid thoughts, it eventually may result in false believes, an ever growing detachment from reality. The causes may be innate and/or environmental. The most prominent delusion of the narcissistic person is his delusion of greatness, and the delusion of inferiority for almost everybody else. They need people around them with whom they can be disdainful or contemptuous. This setup protects their fragile ego. Also, narcissistic (NPD) persons often think in black and white as part of their defense mechanism and are withdrawn just like autistics (not a contradiction, having people around doesn't necessarily mean friends or relationships), so I think there could be quite a few people borderline NPD/SPD/ASD.

They keep taking things off the list of what is considered a mental illness. Wasn't that long ago homosexuality was on there as an "illness" that needed fixin'. They also keep adding things. What does that tell you about that science?

And for pete's sake, who takes wikipedia as a credible source? It's NOT.

Don't know where you are getting all the stuff about narcissists not wanting people around, they use people, therefore they need them around like, oh, a chair or a frying pan. But only keep the ones around that allow them to maintain their view. Again, they are not delusional in the traditional sense, just have a skewed view of their own importance and a bit of denial. Closer to sociopaths than schizophrenics, and schizophrenia has an organic cause, is hereditary, usually manifests symptoms in early adulthood and progresses, usually to the point of needing some kind of care. Narcissists can live their whole lives not really changing much, might get worse in their demands, but that is in a response to having those around them giving in all the time. Disagree with what they want, and they go to great measures to get the rogue back into line. Master manipulators, never knew a schizophrenic that manipulates, they are operating with much less skills. Narcissist= desire for what they want, little to no concern for others, and huge amounts of skill to accomplish what they want.

Wikipedia is often a credible source. It's not a primary source. Much of the information on any given page has references linked at the bottom to verify it.

if you get told that somebody is better than you when ever you try something, or some dissatisfaction from a parent every time you do something, trust me, your aspie kid ain't growing up to be a narcissist, they aren't growing up to be anything.

what helps my self esteem and narcissistic tendencies at the same time is know that you are better than most people, AT SOMETHING. most people are better than most other people at something. because you are better at something than somebody in no way gives you reason to think you are a better person. YOU might think the thing you are better at is very important, the other person probably doesn't. Everybody gets good at something if they focus attention on it, just learn that not everybody places the same importance on things that you do, and it's not wrong, it's just different.

I admit I had in my mind Schizotypal PD rather than Schizophrenia. However, there's a range of various related disorders that bear in their name "Schizo-" besides Schizophrenia (schizophrenic and schizoaffective disorders; Schizoid PD).

I think many important symptoms of Narcissistic PD have the characteristics of delusions (the first three):
/Narcissistic PD will be probably removed from DSM-V, anyway/

- Has a grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements)
- Is preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love
- Believes that he or she is "special" and unique and can only be understood by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions)

The remaining six might explain why so few people are able to stay around them. (Maybe I contradicted myself, anyway. I wrote they need to have people around them but are withdrawn from friendships and relationships.)

- Requires excessive admiration
- Has a very strong sense of entitlement, e.g., unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with his or her expectations
- Is exploitative of others, e.g., takes advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends
- Lacks empathy, e.g., is unwilling to recognize or identify with the feelings and needs of others
- Is often envious of others or believes that others are envious of him or her
- Regularly shows arrogant, haughty behaviors or attitudes

There are many diagnoses for mental disorders and lots of subtypes (for NPD too), so I guess it's rather difficult to tell for certain if a person really has this or that condition, even if we read all what is available.