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Uh...I'm not that fussed about the jargon used here - as sites go, it's one of the better ones.

I take the disabilty pension, therefore I accept that I have something that sets me apart from others and makes work and socialising difficult. There's negative jargon involved, feh, so what, I'm over it. All dsm categorising involves negative medical jargon.

I prefer syndrome. Syndrome means a simular set of charistics appearing in individuals.

So I've got two arms, two legs, one nose syndrome?

The issue is that some of us are been considered lacking because of things we have no interest in anyway! Who cares about eye contact, and what use is it? Using a non issue to define a "condition" (by any name) is absurd.

Another problem with current definitions (and the DSM is not the only standard, and they don't "own" the definition) is that they include people of quite different outlooks! That I have no instinct for picking up non verbal clues surely puts me among those which Asperger wrote about, but I don't find that a disorder; I can communicate perfectly well with formal language. I only have problems when having to deal with people who seemingly cannot, so who has the disorder here?

If visual communication is so advantageous or desirable, why do so many enjoy talking by phone to people they can't see? This "disability" is completely bogus, and a pointless imposition by an establishment which regards conformity as all that matters. This because the previous "Aspies" of history have already given them suficient of the comforts of science and technology that they now count us as dispendible! There's nothing fair nor reasonable in this; it's just one part of humanity (the greedy part) trying to eliminate competition, and make their own lot easier.

Another question is that of autism, which was a word that had a specific meaning before it was approporiated by Asperger and Kanner, and it was originally an aspect of human temperament (i.e., that part of personality which is innate) and it's still used in this sense in aptitude tests (like the Chandler & Mcleod test featured elswhere; those of you who haven't taken it yet really should). In that aspect, tests show I'm highly autistic, but I can assure you it's not a problem; in fact it's a wonderful gift. We have among us though, some who don't share this gift, they see AS as a problem, something which prevents them from fulfilling their desires and social drives (those who are highly autisitic revel in their independance of mind and freedom from the social needs of the NTs, and they know AS is not the problem, it's the irrational behaviour of less able others which is the problem) and they too, by the current absurd and unscientific diagnostic method used by the DSM, are called AS (and autistic!). It's clear from the debates between these disparate groups that they do not, can not, think alike and are thus neurologically distinct, so why are all lumped together by the DSM? I think it's deliberate!

Andrew Walker suggests in in his article WHAT IS THE POINT OF AUTISM? that "autism may be a genetic trait with a racial basis rather than a metabolic disorder". Assuming that is right, would the the conclusion not be that labeling autism to be a disorder equals discrimination on a racial basis?

Would it than not be conforming to international human rights standards to get a court order to all those labeling autism in order to this kind of terminology? Would it not be racism to call autistim a 'disorder'?

Andrew Walkers article 'WHAT IS THE POINT OF AUTISM?' is online here: http://www.autismandcomputing.org.uk/walker2.htm

Asperger's Disorder, Autistic Disorder, Rett's Disorder, Childhood Disintegrative Disorder, and Pervasive Developmental Disorder - Not Otherwise Specified are all classified as Pervasive Developmental Disorders in the DSM-IV-TR. That is the current formal name. Why not use what's known and recognized?

I maintain my opinion, that autism is not a disorder, nor an illness than could or should be cured. Therefore, I argue it is wrong to compare autism with for instance a "metabolic disorder".

Interesting! The above post is not incompatible with either the purported link with Neanderthals, not the classic understanding of "autism" as a facet of the human temperament (any human's temprament) an aspect of which was borrowed by both Kanner and Asperger to describe what they saw. They did not invent the word (and it would have been a whopper of a coincidence if they had!) so autism should not be seen as an illness.

Excess autism without sufficient controls can undoubtedly cause problems, especially in interacting with low autistic types, but to describe autism itself (or Aspergers System which includes strong autism; the junk DSM method doesn't actually test directly for this; the UK system does, and many of those diagnosed withthe US system would not be so described in the UK, so it's as well to be sure which definition we are refering to when discussing such issues) as a "problem" is just plain wrong.

It's worth noting that, though we agree on this, attention-tunnel and I come at it from entirely different directions.

To some extend, the concept uf undevided attention can explain present dianosis criteria in use. But here is a question for you.

What do you think the theory of mind as an interest system cannot explain?

I think that Asperger's is a disorder, if not for the reason that it impairs my ability to function normally in society then for another reason that is stretching things a bit, so bear with me.

The word Disorder implies "unable to order or not ordered", correct?

Asperger's makes it difficult for me to put into order the various stimuli surrounding me. For example the sound of the television in the next room, the sound of the refrigerator running and the feel of the wooden chair under my bum all take up as much priority as my mother's voice. In this example, my mother is telling me that I have to do something. As a result of this inability to prioritise or order my attention, I fail to hear that I have to go to the store and buy milk. I only drink milk. I go buy pizza instead. I am now thirsty. Therefore, my inability to order things, or my "disorder" has caused me a problem.

That may seem like a stretch, but the disorder of my mind is now, by definition, a disorder, as it has inhibited my ability to function "normally."

Does that make any sense to anyone but myself?

What you describe Taineyah can be fairly seen as a disorder, but do you think that all Aspies share this problem? The DSM, last time I looked, designated as AS any one who shares six out of twelve conditions, so there's going to be considerable variety among Aspies, even if we accept such an absurd diagnostic method as scientific (it isn't; it doesn't even test directly for autism).

The UK method on the other hand is much more systematic, it does test for autism, and if you don't clearly have a majority of the attributes tested for in stong enough form (there'll always be the question of degree) you don't get so diagnosed. Even so, the diagnosis is somewhat broader than desireable, for use in describing a single class of people.

When all said and done, both systems claim AS is on the autistic spectrum, and it's quite normal for highly autistic people (by the classic definition) to have none of the problems used in the DSM diagnostic in any significant, impairing strenght. AS by any rational definion is not a problem, some of the impairements associated with it (validly or otherwise) may be. If we are arguing definitions, please be clear on which definitions you are using.

I recently went to Turkey to visit a friend there. It seemed to me that people there were more realxed about eye-contact. Now let's assume that is an accurate observation which I made.

The conclusion does not have to be "I am diasabled" at least in the western world" but maybe you could say "Turkey is a less disabeling soceity" towards people with a monotropic disposition.

My opninion that Asperger ist not a disability does not mean that I don't see the difficulties people experience with AS. However, I think the task is to find out what environment is a good one for people with AS.