NTs DO THINGS with conversation...

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Neither can I

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I wish I had known this 7 years ago.
I re-discovered the first part of this about 10 months ago, but still had no idea about what the NTs might be specifically doing other than generally testing each other for positions in hierarchy, emotional manipulations, or looking for validation of their own identities. I hadn't considered possibilities much beyond that because they all seem to exist in some completely imaginary deluded shared mental game. Most of what I hear them say equates to a bunch of nothing to me. They use words that don't say anything at all.
Translating the words they say literally has been a trap I've been falling into for my whole life.
It's like a massive cruel joke on all the un-cool rejects.

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Now with this knowledge we can dispense with honesty and proceed to mimic the acting of psychopaths like everyone else is doing.
-not the best of situations.

YEAH. I've witnessed entire conversations that literally sounded like absolutely nothing but pure nonsense to me. Just devoid of any meaning at all.

Sometimes I just watch other people talking and babbling I cannot fathom what it is they are actually talking about or what they find so interesting.

And then those same people try to strike up conversations with me, and from the first thing they say I'm just baffled, wondering what in the hell are they getting at? Because I definitely sense that they are "getting at" something, implying something, driving at something, but I don't know what it is, and I can't really think of anything to say in response to it. So no freaking wonder that I've had a lifelong problem of feeling like people basically just run me over in conversations, manipulate the s**t out of me and god knows what else that might be going right over my head.

Can a NT confirm this???

Yes, it's all true. Which part do you find hardest to believe?

Hold on... I have to go add this to the "What new thing I learned today" in the Miscellany forums...

I wanted to make sure this wasn't just a theory. Are you doing something in every conversation?

I'm in my 40's and I guess I'm a bit oblivious to a NT's intent in a conversation. My main purpose is usually to share knowledge about a topic that the other person find's interesting. I discovered years ago that most people could care less about my special interest. The problem I have is that it is hard for me to find a topic that most people find interesting. I spent time with a friend on the weekend and instead of talking about her interest in music which I know almost nothing about I talked about my latest interest in 911 conspiracy theories and rare genetic disorders. Needless to say as I was talking about what I had learned she told me she was bored and was ready to leave. As far as the emotions in the conversation I felt nothing. Luckily this only friend says is likes me no matter how strange I am. I guess that was a complement.

It's true, but of course we aspies learn to adapt to a certain extent, so for example I as an aspie do things with conversation too, because I know that's how NTs communicate. Besides, sometimes NTs just mean to exchange info with conversation. So it's true in essence but not in 100% of cases.

But it's so very true, that my communication with NTs improved very much since I discovered this rule (6 years ago, per the date on my OP). Unfortunately, it doesn't help much in order to make friends, because there are some other crucial rules I haven't discovered yet. Eg what Deb said: the art of finding a topic that is interesting to the other person or to most people - I don't have a clue how to do this, and people are generally bored with my conversation.

I agree, and I think that's a very clear and concise way of describing something that's very useful for ASDers to grasp.

At first I didn't even realise that people communicated their feelings unless they actually said "I feel [insert emotion]."


Pretty much, yes. I think it's usually a "hailing signal," an attempt to establish that the relationship is basically peaceful and co-operative.


I'm not so sure. If somebody rants to me, I tend to take it as sharing a grievance about something, sharing feelings about it, seeking an empathic response. Possibly giving me new information about the thing too. If they're attacking something I like, they might annoy me, but I think they're only attacking me if they know I like the thing. Even then, I try to allow for insensitivity - people can get carried away trying to get their exasperation, and overlook the fact that they may be offending the listener. But if they know the effect they're having but choose to continue, it's probably passive aggression, and yes that's an attack.


I agree that's very often what NTs are doing. As an Aspie I don't think I'll ever be able to join in with it in quite that form of interaction. I can't bring myself to lie about such things if I feel friendly towards the person, and even if I don't, it's still problematic. I'll show discretion and play down my negative gut reactions to the things they love, and cherry pick the positive. I might show happiness at the fact that they've really enjoyed something, but I'll go no further. I think some people, even NTs, see friendship as more than sugar coating. Some people feel that friendship is also about challenging each other's ideas. I probably don't get on well with people who give or expect too much artificial empathy.


I think a lot of it is very likely obvious to a great many NTs. I also think those are the ones with whom I'd be least able to establish rewarding, meaningful bonds.

Thanks for your insightful post. In answering it, something very central to my relations with the human race has become much clearer to me.

Thank you for your comments, TD. I thought you had read it back then when I wrote it.

One example that comes to mind right now is sometimes an NT will ask "Where are you going?" when they mean "I'd like you to go to X place". For the (NT) listener, it's totally clear what the speaker wants, probably from teenage years. It took me 4.5 decades to discover.

Moondust - I consider this one of the more interesting topics on WP.

With that being said, I am a bit skeptical that you can really generalize what all NTs mean, when they ask, "Where are you going?" (or make any particular statement, for that matter).

Anyhow, I am curious. How do you figure out what they really mean when you converse with them?

As a note, I believe I "do things" with conversations too. Say, I want someone at work to be more apt to cooperate with me (say, when I ask for their assistance on a work project). In that case, I may make it a point, when passing them in the morning, to say "Good Morning". I have no intention of conversing with them. I have no intention of becoming "closer" emotionally with them. I don’t necessarily like (or dislike) these people. In fact, I am not altogether certain I care about them (as individuals). I simply want to establish a rapport with them (so that later, if I ask for their help on something, they will be more apt to help me). I suppose I am simply being “friendly”. Perhaps, I am being manipulative. I don’t know. And, by the way, I have no idea if it works or not.

I agree with all of this, but I think it does work--being generally polite and making an effort to greet people does establish some kind of basic rapport. I think this is a very low level of the kind of thing that Moondust is talking so well about, but it's on the same axis of communicative technique.

I would think that "where are you going?" is a sincere question in all but a handful of contexts (such as a boss just asked me to get something from the north side of the building and I have just turned toward the south side of the building unexpectedly)

I should've given a context. Here it is:

A friend and I were walking in the direction of her house. She feared I might want to come in (it was late, she was tired and in a bad mood and we'd been together already for hours). So instead of saying, as an aspie might: "I'm tired and don't want you to come in now.", she asked me: "Where are you going?" She was not asking for info, she was doing something - establishing boundaries.

I answered "To my car. It's parked a bit past your house."

NT's conversation requires translation very often. The translation of the exchange was:

She: I don't want you to come in.
Me: Don't worry. I imagined so, I never meant to.

The latter exchange (the "translation") is how aspies would exchange information. The former exchange is how NTs do things with conversation, in this case she is setting boundaries and I am expressing acceptance of those boundaries.

Now look at this exchange:

She: Where are you going?
Me: Don't worry, I didn't mean to go into your house.

"Me" comes out as terribly offensive.

This is how, very often, we alienate people. By exchanging info when conversing instead of doing "something".

That's exactly the kind of thing I have a tendency to do...if I figure out the underlying meaning of what the person is saying, I call it right out in the open and respond to it directly. When they are really expecting me to respond indirectly, without saying the thing they are avoiding saying.

Wow, this gives me such a headache.

And if I can't figure out the real, underlying meaning, I tend to want to keep talking and driving at it, until the other person comes right out and says it.