NTs DO THINGS with conversation...

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What is does it "imply" when you correct someone or when you disagree with something they said?

it's not the content, silly, but it's the form, their form ! XD
con-form

the law of more stupid, there's always more stupid
idle conformity, lets turn this whole thing into mirror-palace

That must depend on context. It could mean all sorts of things.

In a public debate, it means exactly what it sounds like.

In a marriage, it could mean, "I'm mad at you about something else so I am going to be disagreeable and challenge everything you say until you telepathically discover what I'm mad about and make appropriate amends." No joke.

In an office, it could mean, "I'm challenging your authority out in the open and launching a move to destabilize your career."

In the military, it could mean, "I no longer care about the rules. To hell with you. I'm going AWOL at the earliest opportunity. Don't sleep without a guard tonight."

I think that they think that you are placing yourself above them in a higher position in the hierarchy, and/or knocking them down to a lower position.

This thread is great.. I joined WP recently look for exactly this. It's very enlightening, but also very disappointing because I'm realizing how much I have been manipulated and pushed around over the years (even by people I consider close friends). It usually takes somewhere between a few hours to a few weeks for me to interpret 1) the true intention of a conversation, 2) my responses, and 3) how those responses must have been interpreted by the other party. By the time I figure it out, it's too late to revise and explain myself properly.

Does anyone else feel they can better understand social interactions as a passive observer, but not when fully immersed?

Exactly. Very well put, I've been trying to understand this for a long time. I play in a few bands and when we're not playing music, we're [they're] playing this game, and it drives me insane! I didn't know for sure what was going on for a long time, but this sums it up perfectly. For now this at least confirms I'm not crazy..

Numbers 1,2,and 3 made me laugh because for NT women they are totally true!

True! NT men want to solve problems too. It's a guy thing.

LOL....what's wrong with wanting to solve problems? I like to try to solve problems.

I guess the cleaning aspect is where I'm deficient as a man. I'm not a very good housekeeper.

I don't mess up the house; I do the simple cleaning. But I'm not good at the "spring cleaning" thing.

"Good Morning" is just a greeting. People say it in passing and they may never even see you again.

The "rant thing". I just did that lately with my Aspie friend about some problems I'm having with my parents. I was ranting, but really just wanted to vent my feelings. Actually in this situation, I would have accepted any ideas of what I should do about my problem.

The dismissing part I do with people I'm close to including my Mama. If she's talking nonsense about something that I don't think is logical to what is being talked about, then I will dismiss what she said, but still want a close relationship. There is just no way she is going to get me to understand her way of thinking about whatever topic we were talking about.

Me and my Aspie friend actually have watched movies in order to discuss them. It allows each of us to know what the other's interests are.

So, IMO, I don't think the above are correct.

Because women really only want someone to listen and be empathetic about their situation. It's best not to try and solve the problem unless the woman asks you to. I believe it helps women to voice their problems then they are better able to try to solve the problem themselves. I think it's because men and women think with the opposite sides of the brain. Also I read that when a person has a problem then they should write it down because seeing the problem helps the other side of the brain in trying to help solve the problem. I also read in "Men are From Mars" that when men have a problem they usually go off by themselves to solve it and women shouldn't bother them, but if the man asks the woman for help in solving the problem then he really trusts her.

About the housework, it's true that when a guy does things like that the woman just gets all lovey dovey inside. The problem comes up when the guy doesn't do the housework like she does then she goes to correct him in how it should be done. I learned that in "Men are from Mars" too.

I'm believing she was saying that it was rude to interrupt her when she wasn't done explaining. Still, most NT's wouldn't say that you were being rude, they would just say something like "let me finish explaining and then you can try it."

My wife hates the way I clean. She feels she has to "go over" what I clean. Then she adopts this regal attitude about it being "her kitchen."

Sometimes, I do "just listen"--especially if I don't have the answer to the problem (which is more often than I like!)

What a person does for a living is only one thing about a person that is judged. I don't know how Aspies work, but NT's are judging others right from the beginning. Clothes, hair, how a person carries themselves, the way they talk, their ideas, their personality, facial expressions. All of that information is taken in by the brain and summed up in a matter of seconds. Then the person is judged by the answers to any questions asked of them - just like an interview. The "interview" is a way of figuring out if you want that person in your life or if the person is just "passing through". So exactly what Birdinflight was saying. The "what do you do for a living" comes up though most of the time because our jobs are what defines a person at that time and we spend most of our time at our jobs - it also shows what the person is interested in and where their intelligence lies.

Don't Aspies make judgements about other people - like their intelligence and whether the other person is worth hanging around? I think everyone judges everyone else.

Of course they do!

Ah, but it doesn't. Most people's jobs do not define them at all, because we can't all get paid for what we would really like to do all day.

That's my whole point. That's where that assumption and why people use it to decide "who" that person is goes wrong for a large proportion of people who work.

As I said, statistically most people are NOT in fact working in a field that is connected to "what the person is interested in and where their intelligence lies."

As I've said, many people have their true skills in the creative arts, or they are interested in archeology, or forensics -- but for one reason or another they are not able to make those things their living, the work that actually pays the bills.

That says nothing at all about their intelligence but more about circumstances or lack of connections and networking skills.

I had talent in three things that are creative -- I can write, I'm artistic, and I'm musical. I even had a certain limited success with my music for many years. But I'm a rotten networker -- I don't know how to schmooze or know the right people, and many creative careers are actually less about the talent level and more about how well that person socializes and pushes to be heard.

I clean houses for a living. I'm sorry, but that doesn't say ANYTHING about who I actually am.

Shall I tell you the reason I clean houses?

Because I cannot stand the conventional workplace, I don't want to interact, the things I'm actually GOOD AT don't in fact make any money unless you happen to wind up being Stephen King, Aretha Franklin or David Hockney.

And because I'm merely desperate to just do something I can show up for then leave the fck behind.

I want to be self employed in something that was easy to start (no start up costs) and easy to just DO then go the hell home.

Do you think I even like it? I hate it.

But it's the least of all "devils" for my personal needs, and therefore I can bear it better than other forms of work that pay.

That speaks of practical needs but it says nothing about what actually interests me, what I love, or even what I'm good at.

It doesn't speak of the fact that I sing quite well. It doesn't tell someone I have gifts in creative areas. It doesn't tell someone I'm intelligent, or that I'm well read, or that I have decent knowledge and was an A-student academically -- if anything they assume I'm an intellectual failure.

I have a job that people think LESS of me for when I tell them what it is. I have a job that people judge as instantly meaning I have no other skills, have low intelligence, couldn't possibly be an interesting person to know.

Someone who cleans houses is nearly always stereotyped as: uneducated, not well read, not intelligent, maybe illegal, probably doesn't have any ambitions or goals (I had PLENTY).

My job doesn't say ANYTHING about "what I'm interested in and where my intelligence lies."

In fact, the opposite. It leads people to grossly underestimate me and write me off.

Hence why I hate that question, because they'd find out more about the type of person I am by asking what I actually live FOR, not what I have to do TO live.

Last edited by BirdInFlight on 28 Jul 2015, 10:34 am, edited 2 times in total.