Is being fake a social skill?

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DonkeyBuster
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15 Oct 2009, 10:54 am

WritersBlock wrote:

Greentea wrote:

Exactly. That's why Aspies can't learn social skills.

I don't know about that. I have amassed quite a repetoire of social skills that allow me to function quite well (for short periods of time) without raising any suspicion. I'd have to respectfully disagree with "can't".

I agree with WritersBlock. Learned social skills, as opposed to innate and instinctual, is what makes Dxing adult Aspies difficult. I've also learned a lot of social skills, even my brother the classical autist has learned some.

Greentea
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15 Oct 2009, 11:00 am

i_wanna_blue wrote:

Greentea wrote:

i_wanna_blue wrote:

people who seem to have it made socially

Ok, I'll give you a hint: the key of the definition is in the word "seem".

I guess you're saying appearances can be deceiving.

So...what's your definition of "having it made socially"?

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i_wanna_blue
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15 Oct 2009, 11:09 am

Greentea wrote:

i_wanna_blue wrote:

Greentea wrote:

i_wanna_blue wrote:

people who seem to have it made socially

Ok, I'll give you a hint: the key of the definition is in the word "seem".

I guess you're saying appearances can be deceiving.

So...what's your definition of "having it made socially"?

I think it's very much having a social instinct. It's about being natural as a social being. Like an ant for example, it's a social animal, as opposed to a leopard which is solitary. It's instinctive, it runs through your blood. You have it hard wired in you in order to integrate with the rest of the 'colony'.
I just feel like I don't have it. Other people mix with other human beings, like it's a natural human trait. That's how I define those who have it made socially.

Greentea
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15 Oct 2009, 11:20 am

But "to have it made" means to have achieved something, as you correctly imply here:

i_wanna_blue wrote:

I kinda look at people who seem to have it made socially, and (usually) regard their behaviour as a bench mark. I mean they must be doing something right or figured out some way to play the game.

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KevinLA
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15 Oct 2009, 11:34 am

If you can't beat them, join them.

Think of being fake as acting. That is what I do.

It doesn't matter how disingenuous you come across. It will be accepted.

i_wanna_blue
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15 Oct 2009, 11:48 am

Greentea wrote:

But "to have it made" means to have achieved something, as you correctly imply here:

i_wanna_blue wrote:

I kinda look at people who seem to have it made socially, and (usually) regard their behaviour as a bench mark. I mean they must be doing something right or figured out some way to play the game.

I'm sorry Greentea, but I don't really seem to get the gist of your replies. Are you saying that those who have it made, indeed have something of benefit? Or is it that, what appears to me as having it made, isn't really that at all?

Greentea
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15 Oct 2009, 12:15 pm

KevinLA wrote:

If you can't beat them, join them.

Think of being fake as acting. That is what I do.

It doesn't matter how disingenuous you come across. It will be accepted.

So true! It's what amazes me the most about humans. If one day they find out that you faked/lied, they'll never get angry. As long as you made them feel good with your lie / faking, you're cool.

I_wanna_blue, I was just trying to show you that you have the answer to your question yourself. People who fake it indeed, as you point out, seem to have it made (ie seem to have achieved something). Their achievements are in keeping with the means to achieve them: ie fake too. We usually surround ourselves with people similar to us, and if we choose to fake, those who'll stick in the long run are the others who chose to fake. The relationship is, inevitably, fake. The more you fake, the more relationships you'll have. But they'll be fake. Quantity is not quality.

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Janissy
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15 Oct 2009, 1:03 pm

i_wanna_blue wrote:

I'm just wondering. Creating a false impression seems to be something my family are rather good at, and I suspect many others too. I know this is a tactic my family uses because they say certain unpleasant things about someone and then, when in the company of that person, they carry on in a totally different way to which you would expect.

I'm not saying they should be absolutely rude and horrible to the person, but if you have so much against them, why behave like you actually like the person, when deep down you don't?

A fake courtesy is what I call it. I guess being two faced is one the things you need to be good at, in order to survive in the outside world. My problem is that I am no good at being fake. If I don't like someone, I won't be rude to them, but i won't act as if I'm their friend. It's just too much of an act. Despite this behaviour seemingly being an asset, I'm glad I don't use it as much, if at all as others do.

What do you guys think?

Yes it's a social skill and yes I use it when it seems appropriate. (Since I am NT it causes no cognitive dissonance.)

To me it all depends on why I don't like the person. If I don't like them because they crossed me in some totally unacceptable way, then I don't bother with the fakeness. I am merely cordial. (if they tried to take credit for my work, swindle me out of money, give grief to my daughter etc.).

If I don't like them because something in their personality gets on my last nerve, then I do bring out the social fakeness. I "fake it till I make it" and sometimes ultimately do come to like them. Examples would be if I don't like somebody who seems too bossy, too nitpicky, too bigoted, too much of any personality trait I don't enjoy. That's about them and has nothing to do with me and my personal likes and dislikes about personality shouldn't affect the relationship. Then I do fake social niceness.

SINsister
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15 Oct 2009, 1:09 pm

WritersBlock wrote:

By being selective of the company one keeps one needn't worry about presenting a false front. After all, acquaintances and relationships of any sort are chosen, not forced upon us.
There are numerous people in my workplace that I have a rather apathetic disposition towards- so I don't even bother with any interaction unless it involves a job or project I'm working on.
Outside of work I simply do not bother with people who's expectations would require me to be who/what I am not.
Simple as that.

Yes...which is why, if left to my own devices, I'd probably never interact with *anyone* in the "real world," save for my ex-bf and a handful of close relatives.

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DonkeyBuster
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15 Oct 2009, 1:12 pm

janissy wrote:

To me it all depends on why I don't like the person. If I don't like them because they crossed me in some totally unacceptable way, then I don't bother with the fakeness. I am merely cordial. (if they tried to take credit for my work, swindle me out of money, give grief to my daughter etc.).

If I don't like them because something in their personality gets on my last nerve, then I do bring out the social fakeness. I "fake it till I make it" and sometimes ultimately do come to like them. Examples would be if I don't like somebody who seems too bossy, too nitpicky, too bigoted, too much of any personality trait I don't enjoy. That's about them and has nothing to do with me and my personal likes and dislikes about personality shouldn't affect the relationship. Then I do fake social niceness.

Aaaah.

Soooo.
This makes sense to me. And one's view of another does change so often.

Thanks for the insight!

SINsister
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15 Oct 2009, 1:16 pm

WritersBlock wrote:

I have amassed quite a repetoire of social skills that allow me to function quite well (for short periods of time) without raising any suspicion. I'd have to respectfully disagree with "can't".

Same here. One of my new therapists calls me a "professional" at acting "normal." With enough time (and intellect), any NT social skills can be learned and imitated (if not wholly convincingly, and certainly not 100% of the time). It's exhausting, not being able to be "me" for hours on end.

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15 Oct 2009, 1:23 pm

DonkeyBuster wrote:

janissy wrote:

Aaaah.

Soooo.
This makes sense to me. And one's view of another does change so often.

Thanks for the insight!

Far too complicated and convoluted for my liking; I haven't the patience or the intestinal fortitude. It's a minefield that I can't navigate without fear of losing a limb - or worse. This is why I'd rather not deal with it - or have to deal with it - at all.

Greentea
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15 Oct 2009, 1:30 pm

If it was about learning social skills, gov't wouldn't support you for life. They'd send you to a course.

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oppositedirection
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15 Oct 2009, 3:26 pm

Being fake means you'll get on with a lot more people. Now you might not wish to get along the person you are being fake towards but if you stopped talking to them then other people might notice and distance themselves from you. It allows you to opperate in a group and gain benefit from the other members of the group by compromising yourself over the one you don't like.

Not, of course, that I'd actually endorse the above. It's just how normal people act...

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15 Oct 2009, 7:32 pm

It is absolutely a social skill, including all the other varieties of lying. I've lived and worked in the business world for more or less 40 years - it's a survival skill there, so if you intend to go there, be ready to learn.

As DonkeyBuster says, it appears to be an instinct for the NTs - they do it unconsciously, and are more successful because of it. It doesn't bother them at all. But if you want to offend them, and make enemies among them, tell the truth.

As the poet T.S. Eliot said - 'Humankind cannot bear very much reality.'

That's why we feel we're on the wrong planet.

AC

Greentea
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16 Oct 2009, 1:02 am

'Humankind cannot bear very much reality.'

It must be more complex than this. Otherwise, why do they explore outer space and don't continue to think that the moon is made of cheese?

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