"Fight your own battles" - an unwritten rule???

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I've always fought my own battles against bullies. Most of the bullies may have been physically stronger when I was growing up, but that's what aluminum bats and other environmental objects were for. When bullies said they were sorry and asked me to stop hitting them, I kicked them when they were down. I got in serious trouble for defending myself the way I did. I never wanted to injure or bloody other kids, but no adult would listen to my requests for help. Of course, if I were a kid these days and beat up a bully, he or she would probably shoot me at school the next day.

This is absolutely not the case.

If you have a life with zero conflict I am very surprised.

Might have been the 'kicking them when they're down' part. Well at least they learned a valuable lesson. There are consequences for f*****g with other people.

What was your punishment may I ask?

EDIT: Uh oh, three posts in a row. Could some fantastic higher power fantastically merge these into one post for me? Or something?

Last edited by The_Perfect_Storm on 27 Nov 2011, 7:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Oh but it is the case. Only cowards pick on the weak. If they had any guts at all, they would try bullying the popular people with lots of friends. If they did that, they would get their butts kicked and they are deeply insecure and afraid of this ever happening.

No, actually. Some bullies are insecure. Others have a very high sense of self-worth and confidence. They are more likely to escalate things when people resist.

I have never met a bully with high self confidence. I see them bow and totally kiss up to authority figures and popular people. They never try to disrespect them. It's like they know who is vulnerable and they go after them. In their families they are the kids that are either bullied by the parents and other siblings or are permitted to bully people in the family by the parents, sometimes both. I've seen families with kids who bully each other and are bullied by the parents. It's like the entire family is one big cycle of bullying. These have been the worst bullies in my life. They learn the bullying behavior this way and it is reinforced so it becomes their mode of being outside the home.

I grew up with a horrible bully, a neighbor. Her parents both doted and bullied her but they were relentlessly rough on her half brother who then turned around and bullied his half sister while the parents did nothing most the time. So she got these mixed messages. On the one hand, she knew her parents favored her over her half brother. On the other hand, they let the half brother hit her and generally bully her. She turned out to be the kind of bully I am talking about, the kind of person who is predatory and tries to victimize others and isolate them by spreading rumors about them and attempting to make their lives as difficult as possible or she picked on the people that already had a difficult time, the theme being isolation. She did her best to break up friendships and to get everyone to turn on her target if she could manage it. When her target became thoroughly hated, mostly because of her egging others on, she would then either try to get someone she knew to beat them up or she would do it herself after school. This is an example of what I am talking about.

What do you want me to say?

I assume that is rhetorical...

Well I generally think that "fighting your own battles" at best may be the initial approach, but then you may have to invoke 3rd parties (who are impartial, in theory). Prescribed examples would be that you tell the high school bully how his/her actions are causing you grief and nobody wins out of this conflict, it's not going to make his/her life better. THEN you go to your parents and/or the principal. Or dealing with the workplace bully, explain to them that their actions are not motivating you to do your best and you are truly perplexed by their approach. Something like that more or less.

HOWEVER, and it's a pretty big however, this is unlikely to yield results. It's just a way of telling the third party that you did your due diligence (because 9 times out of 10, they will ask "have you tried resolving this with the bully directly"?) I am very cynical that such approaches would work, simply because by definition, bullies have no concept of taking responsibility for their actions. They will either deflect or deny. Also, such a declaration of the negative effect on you would only confirm and validate the bully's intent was successful. Here's my example of expected dialogue (for a workplace bully):

Jayo: You know, I really am puzzled why you choose to berate me in front of others. Just that comment, about "oh, you're so clueless", while burying your head in your hands - I felt that was very belittling."
Bully: Excuse me??! Well, LOOK, Jayo, I wouldn't HAVE to do that if you would only do [insert desired action]."
Jayo: "Well, that's the thing, sometimes it's not clear what [desired action] is - and if I knew what it was, things could go smoother."
Bully: (shaking head or rolling eyes, sighing, other negative non verbal) "Jayo, how long have you been here??? It just seems that everyone else except you is able to tell what's expected of them without people having to spell it out for them."
Jayo: Well (as I may have mentioned before), I have a mild-moderate form of autism called Aspergers Syndrome which impairs my ability to perceive unspoken expectations and nuances.
Bully: OMG...I can't believe this...how long do you intend to use that line as an excuse??
Jayo: [tempting response: "As a matter of principle, as long as I have to"] Actual response: well, to this date, there hasn't been a single recorded case of anyone being ' cured' of Asperger Syndrome, it can only be treated and scientists are discovering new things about it every day. Even though people who have it have higher than average IQs, it's basically like having dyslexia when it comes to reading nuances and reading unstated expectations. So to get the best results out of such a person, it just means being more direct with them - it's worth it in the end - but berating them is not going to make things better for anyone."

It would be hard to hold back tears doing such a dialogue, as it's spilling out a life of being persecuted for differences, but that's something like how it would go if I ever did. Assuming the bully didn't cut me off and let me finish. (Also, there is the risk that a street-smart bully may see this as a stepping stone to going to HR, and will preemptively make a complaint against me.) If I didn't see an improvement in the bully's behaviour, THEN I could go to HR in good faith (I went to them directly in one case, and both of us were let go in a round of layoffs soon after, so it basically amounted to a "suicide mission").

But I hope it instills some wisdom in you guys who (hopefully not) may find yourself embroiled in such a conflict.

Sounds like discrimination.

A new study revealed that apparently many prisoners have very high self-esteem and self-confidence. That flies in the face of all the pseudo-psychologists who have been telling us for years that criminals and bullies are really only the way they are because of insecurity.

I used to work with a bully who was a strongman competitor who benched close to 450 lbs. He picked fights with the patrons over the smallest things and messed them up pretty badly. And not just weak looking guys either. He was anything but a coward. 'Psychopath' and 'lunatic' would be better words to describe him.

The first few times I fought back, I got a week's worth of recess taken away, and then a couple week-long suspensions from riding the school bus (which meant I didn't go to school). After repeatedly fighting back against those who bullied me, the grown-ups sort of gave up on punishing me and put me on an IEP for being "behaviorally disordered". I had to see the elementary school psychologist every Tuesday to talk about my so-called anger/aggression issues, and the school told my parents that I should be on Ritalin.

Criminals aren't always bullies and bullies aren't always criminals.

My 16yo son deals with bullies all the time at school. These handfull of guys who are always messing with him. He also gets in a lot of fights. This last fight he got in, he won it spectacularly and I doubt he will have any more problems at school. He was suspended for five days, as was the other kid.

The funny thing is, after the fight, my son got up and went from the hall to the office cause he knew what was coming. The other boy got up and went and got his Mother from home. So yeah, the bully ran home to Mommy with his tail between his legs. They only live a half mile from the school, so they were back by the time the principal saw them.

Frances

It's not a particularly new study but yes there is a fair amount of evidence.