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Phonic
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23 Jan 2012, 1:28 am

Another high IQ f**k up here, dropped out of high school, barely tried, probably would have done poorly had I tried.

Aspies are pretty quick to explain how IQ tests don't work properly on them when the study or theory shows them in an unfovorable light, but when something or someone suggests aspies have high IQ's they're pretty quick to jump on the bandwagon and say aspies use their massive intellects and egos to become masters in any field they're in.

But everything I know suggests autistic generally arn't even employed and that the OP is just mixing up intelligent people with autistic people, which isn't a hard mistake to make.

It's like the ultimate sport of this community to take intelligent or popular people and claim they're autistic, always basically to give autism some street cred, who was it this week? Avril Lavrign? Robert Downey Junior before that I think.


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Verdandi
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23 Jan 2012, 1:42 am

Phonic wrote:
Another high IQ f**k up here, dropped out of high school, barely tried, probably would have done poorly had I tried.

Aspies are pretty quick to explain how IQ tests don't work properly on them when the study or theory shows them in an unfovorable light, but when something or someone suggests aspies have high IQ's they're pretty quick to jump on the bandwagon and say aspies use their massive intellects and egos to become masters in any field they're in.


I don't really consider myself an Aspie, so this may not apply to me - but I think you'll find that I have consistently said that intelligence doesn't prevent impairment (although one study linked IQ score to milder autism), and that there is no serious correlation between AS and high IQ. Average IQ from the study I've seen actually was a bit lower than the average for the general population. I'm not the only one who has been consistent in their views on this topic.

There are people who say that IQ doesn't necessarily measure ability in autistics - scores can easily come out higher or lower for whatever reason, but doesn't necessarily reflect the impairments that complicate getting very far with a high IQ.

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But everything I know suggests autistic generally arn't even employed and that the OP is just mixing up intelligent people with autistic people, which isn't a hard mistake to make.

It's like the ultimate sport of this community to take intelligent or popular people and claim they're autistic, always basically to give autism some street cred, who was it this week? Avril Lavrign? Robert Downey Junior before that I think.


I don't do this either, but again I do not think you are referring to me.



Phonic
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23 Jan 2012, 1:51 am

Verdandi wrote:

I don't really consider myself an Aspie, so this may not apply to me - but I think you'll find that I have consistently said that intelligence doesn't prevent impairment


Why don't you consider yourself an aspie anymore? Or have you never? Is it Autistic Disorder

i think intelligence - high intelligence - actually causes impairment, I think highly intelligent people are significantly more prone to depression, over qualification and general lack of satisfaction in life.


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I don't do this either, but again I do not think you are referring to me.


I'm not, it's usually people with lower post counts, and it's usually supremicists.


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shrox
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23 Jan 2012, 1:52 am

CrazyCatLord wrote:
Christopher Langan, the person with the second highest IQ (between 195 and 210) who has long held the title of the most intelligent man alive, is a former bouncer who now operates a horse ranch. Several other people with an IQ of 170 and above are chess players, i.e. one trick ponies who don't do anything to advance humanity. So much for IQ tests...


Really? Mine was 212 in high school. Probably slipped to 211.75 by now...



shrox
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23 Jan 2012, 1:54 am

Phonic wrote:
...i think intelligence - high intelligence - actually causes impairment, I think highly intelligent people are significantly more prone to depression, over qualification and general lack of satisfaction in life...


I would say that is true.



Verdandi
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23 Jan 2012, 1:57 am

Phonic wrote:
Why don't you consider yourself an aspie anymore? Or have you never? Is it Autistic Disorder


I never considered myself an Aspie, although I will identify my diagnosis as Asperger's Syndrome. I prefer "autistic" as I feel it more accurately describes me, and doesn't sound as annoying to me.

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i think intelligence - high intelligence - actually causes impairment, I think highly intelligent people are significantly more prone to depression, over qualification and general lack of satisfaction in life.


I think this is at least somewhat supported by empirical data, but I am too tired to go looking right now. I'll say it sounds like something I read.

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I'm not, it's usually people with lower post counts, and it's usually supremicists.


Yeah, I'm not fond of that sort of thing.



Rascal77s
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23 Jan 2012, 2:00 am

Phonic wrote:
Another high IQ f**k up here, dropped out of high school, barely tried, probably would have done poorly had I tried.

Aspies are pretty quick to explain how IQ tests don't work properly on them when the study or theory shows them in an unfovorable light, but when something or someone suggests aspies have high IQ's they're pretty quick to jump on the bandwagon and say aspies use their massive intellects and egos to become masters in any field they're in.

But everything I know suggests autistic generally arn't even employed and that the OP is just mixing up intelligent people with autistic people, which isn't a hard mistake to make.

It's like the ultimate sport of this community to take intelligent or popular people and claim they're autistic, always basically to give autism some street cred, who was it this week? Avril Lavrign? Robert Downey Junior before that I think.


I like you already.



shrox
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23 Jan 2012, 2:03 am

Rascal77s wrote:
Phonic wrote:
Another high IQ f**k up here, dropped out of high school, barely tried, probably would have done poorly had I tried.

Aspies are pretty quick to explain how IQ tests don't work properly on them when the study or theory shows them in an unfovorable light, but when something or someone suggests aspies have high IQ's they're pretty quick to jump on the bandwagon and say aspies use their massive intellects and egos to become masters in any field they're in.

But everything I know suggests autistic generally arn't even employed and that the OP is just mixing up intelligent people with autistic people, which isn't a hard mistake to make.

It's like the ultimate sport of this community to take intelligent or popular people and claim they're autistic, always basically to give autism some street cred, who was it this week? Avril Lavrign? Robert Downey Junior before that I think.


I like you already.


Ditto



Madao
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23 Jan 2012, 6:01 pm

I don't mind being labeled a genius...it's a lot better then the opposite, 'stupid' or 'ret*d'.
I always considered myself more of a specialized genius rather than a general one. Good in certain areas terrible at others. :)
I always found IQ tests to be subjective anyways. You could be a genius at art and music yet fail horribly in math and science. (Most IQ tests I've seen seem to measure math, science and writing only. :? )



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23 Jan 2012, 6:10 pm

What good is it having a high IQ if you can't actually DO the things you know your intelligence should make you capable of doing?

I don't judge anyone for doing "less" with their abilities than what they are thought to be capable of. You don't know what people are actually capable of. People assume if you're smart enough, you can do anything with your mind and IT'S NOT TRUE.



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23 Jan 2012, 6:13 pm

Verdandi wrote:

I agree with the statement that the whole IQ thing is flawed, but also:

There is no deserve here. People have the right to choose the course of their own lives.
Who are you to say they're not doing something meaningful? Is it meaningful to them? Probably. Why should anyone have to live up to your particular standards of "meaningful" in order to "deserve" their own neurology that they were born with?


Choices are limited with lack of resources, and can be guided into by constraints. Sometimes they don't do much with it at all. I think doing something benefiting society would be meaningful. It'd be nice to have some standards for the sake of justice.



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23 Jan 2012, 8:15 pm

I think a large part of the reason people with AS are often tagged as "highly intelligent" has more to do with the way we measure and identify "intelligence" in children and less to do with any actual correlation. The typical tests I took as a child involved rote memorization, logical word relationships, and such. I have always had an extremely accurate visual memory, so memorizing the meanings to made up words was about the duh easiest test I could have imagined. I also had a huge vocabulary for my age so I was automatically at a tremendous advantage in any sort of word logic. I have also had a talent for seeing similarities, differences, relationships in words, objects, situations, etc. Further, I had an extremely logical unemotional way of thinking. Add to this the fact I have never experienced test anxiety, and the situation becomes clear. All these things are common in aspies, and all these things give one an unnatural advantage in the sort of tests used to measure intelligence. My IQ on tests when I was a child was, I believe, somewhere between 120-140.

The simple truth is that, if you measure intelligence by memory, vocabulary, and reasoning ability, then aspies will automatically be more intelligent because we possess those traits. I think the confusion is likely because people with AS don't achieve as highly as those without. Many of us are unemployed, unmarried, have few friends, are poor, etc. By most of the typical measures of life success, we are underachievers. The logical conclusion is that the traits measuring "intelligence" are not as important as others in determining financial and social outcomes in our society. In my experience, our society invariably rewards conformity, social skill, outward appearance, and class status, above all other factors.

Or, to put those paragraphs into one sentence. Yeah, we're more intelligent, but so what; it doesn't seem to make very much difference one way or the other.


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abacacus
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23 Jan 2012, 8:24 pm

IQ is essentially a meaningless number. It's a bragging right.

The more important factors are drive and creativity. Someone can be amazingly brilliant and just not care enough to do anything with it.


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shrox
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23 Jan 2012, 8:30 pm

abacacus wrote:
IQ is essentially a meaningless number. It's a bragging right.

The more important factors are drive and creativity. Someone can be amazingly brilliant and just not care enough to do anything with it.


Or even deciding the world doesn't deserve it.



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23 Jan 2012, 8:32 pm

shrox wrote:
abacacus wrote:
IQ is essentially a meaningless number. It's a bragging right.

The more important factors are drive and creativity. Someone can be amazingly brilliant and just not care enough to do anything with it.


Or even deciding the world doesn't deserve it.


Possibly, although I'd wager that happens more with weapons developments and such.

Reading this topic really makes me wonder if I just need to get more motivated.


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XFilesGeek
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23 Jan 2012, 8:32 pm

Zur-Darkstar wrote:
I think a large part of the reason people with AS are often tagged as "highly intelligent" has more to do with the way we measure and identify "intelligence" in children and less to do with any actual correlation. The typical tests I took as a child involved rote memorization, logical word relationships, and such. I have always had an extremely accurate visual memory, so memorizing the meanings to made up words was about the duh easiest test I could have imagined. I also had a huge vocabulary for my age so I was automatically at a tremendous advantage in any sort of word logic. I have also had a talent for seeing similarities, differences, relationships in words, objects, situations, etc. Further, I had an extremely logical unemotional way of thinking. Add to this the fact I have never experienced test anxiety, and the situation becomes clear. All these things are common in aspies, and all these things give one an unnatural advantage in the sort of tests used to measure intelligence. My IQ on tests when I was a child was, I believe, somewhere between 120-140.

The simple truth is that, if you measure intelligence by memory, vocabulary, and reasoning ability, then aspies will automatically be more intelligent because we possess those traits. I think the confusion is likely because people with AS don't achieve as highly as those without. Many of us are unemployed, unmarried, have few friends, are poor, etc. By most of the typical measures of life success, we are underachievers. The logical conclusion is that the traits measuring "intelligence" are not as important as others in determining financial and social outcomes in our society. In my experience, our society invariably rewards conformity, social skill, outward appearance, and class status, above all other factors.

Or, to put those paragraphs into one sentence. Yeah, we're more intelligent, but so what; it doesn't seem to make very much difference one way or the other.


Yes, we can be more "intelligence" by defining "intelligence" as "whatever Aspies are good at."

Personally, I don't think IQ is a particularly good at predicting "success" in life, nor is it a particularly good measure of....well..."intelligence." Actually, "intelligence" itself isn't a particularly good predictor of "success" as "intelligence" means whatever we think it means at any given time. Heck, "success" means whatever we say it means at any given time.

My point is no one should feel bummed because they don't meet any of these ill-defined, fuzzy-headed, arbitrary standards. Most of it is just a bunch of cultural nonsense, not empirical truth, and I make "ignoring culture" an art form.


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